What's your House positions in your horoscope? | Page 6 | INFJ Forum

What's your House positions in your horoscope?

Discussion in 'Psychology and MBTI' started by dxlin, Mar 21, 2009.

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  1. OP
    dxlin

    dxlin Newbie

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    hi EloquentBohemian this is my revised chart~!
    thank you for contributing to the thread, sorry if it cozed u too much trouble >_<
    [​IMG]

    take care
    Lin
     
  2. EloquentBohemian

    EloquentBohemian Community Member

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    No problem. I have replaced the other chart with this one.
     
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  3. juana_del_pueblo

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    I believe that I have a pretty unique chart.

    [​IMG]
     
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  4. EloquentBohemian

    EloquentBohemian Community Member

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    In doing charts for people on this Forum, I have encountered something which I had set aside several years ago when I was involved in studying Astrology deeper.... the problem of the Zodiacs.
    This arose when I was delineating VindurNott's chart which he requested be done in the Sidereal zodiac instead of the Tropical one more commonly used in Western astrology. This prompted me to resume my investigations, with unexpected results.

    In order to explain the dilemma which arose, and why I am writing this post, I must write an extremely compressed history of the Zodiac up to now. The dilemma will become apparent as you read.

    The Tropical Zodiac, which most Western astrologers use, is a band in the sky approximately 14 degrees wide, centered on the Ecliptic (path of the Sun seen from Earth), against which the Sun and planets are seen to move as seen from the Earth, and that is divided into equal 30
     

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    #104 EloquentBohemian, Apr 6, 2009
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2009
  5. alcyone

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    Sounds like you're about to start a revolution!
     
  6. EloquentBohemian

    EloquentBohemian Community Member

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    Or evolution. I can't express adequately how deeply this has affected me, for I have practised Astrology for over a dozen years now.
    Part of me thinks to eliminate the Signs and Houses completely and use the Planets, Ascendant/Descendant, and Medium Coeli/Imum Coeli exclusively, but this 'revelation' brings into question the definitions of these factors, as well.
    This hit me 'broadside' and I have gotten little sleep over the last few days.
     
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  7. Sever

    Sever Newbie

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    Hey eloquent bohemian! Can you take a look at my chart too, please?:m035: I've always been very interested in astrology but never got beyond the basics (sun,moon). Thank you!
     

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  8. Soulful

    Soulful life is good

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    *whoosh* the sound of it going right over my head!
     
  9. NaeturVindur

    NaeturVindur Cuddlemaster
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    ok, here's a simplified version of the tropical/sidereal zodiacs: At some point long ago, some people looked at the sky and said "ooooo do you see how those little things up there seem to make pictures??" and so the constelations came to be. a little later some more people looked up and noticed that every year the sun appears to rise in a certain constelation, and it always rises right there every year (another "oooooo"). What they did realize is that the earth spins like a top, the body spins in circle really fast, and slowly the axis also wobbles in a circle. Therefore, today, the sun appears to rise in another one of those pretty little pictures in the sky.

    the wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precession_(astronomy)
     
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  10. EloquentBohemian

    EloquentBohemian Community Member

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    Sorry. I got too complicated in my last post.

    Basically, there are two major zodiacs, Tropical, the one almost every Western astrologer uses, and Sidereal, used mainly by Vedic astrologers from India.
    A zodiac is an imaginary ring of pictures in the sky based on the constellations the Sun passes through.
    These constellation pictures, which are imagined out of the stars which our ancestors connected with imaginary lines (...like the Big Dipper) are called Signs in Astrology.

    Zero degrees Aries is the starting point of both zodiacs.
    In the Tropical zodiac Zero Aries is, as of today, 24.5 degrees different in reference to the actual starting point of the constellation Aries in the sky.
    This is best illustrated by the two example charts below.
    The Tropical chart has the Sun at 16:47 degrees Aries, which would make this person an Aries.
    The Sidereal chart has the Sun at 21:54 degrees Pisces, which would make the same person a Pisces.
    So, which one is correct?

    The difference is that the Tropical zodiac is started always on March 21st (approx.) of the year, because this is when the path of the Sun crosses the Equator on its 'journey north'. We see it getting higher and higher in the sky as Spring and Summer progess.
    But with the Sidereal zodiac, the starting point of Aries is the actual constellation which, because of the tilt in the Earth's axis, seems to move backward through the Tropical zodiac, and is now at approximately 5 degrees Pisces.

    So again, which one of these charts is correct, the one where this person is an Aries, or the one where this person is a Pisces?

    This is the first part of the dilemma, which I had set aside years ago when I began actually practicing Astrology and forgot about. I simply always used the Tropical zodiac out of habit because it was tradition. Neither is better/worse or more/less accurate.
    Doing VindurNott's chart in Sidereal brought this discrepancy back to mind.

    The second part is that the nice neat 30 degree Signs of both zodiacs do not reflect the actual size of the constellations these Signs refer to.
    As example the zodiac Sign Scorpio on the chart is a 30 degree part of the circle, just like all the rest of the Signs, but the actual constellation in the sky is only 7 to 8 degrees wide.
    Virgo is another good example because instead of the 30 degree section in the zodiac, Virgo the constellation is almost 44 degrees in width. It actually cover part of the zodiac Signs Leo and Libra.
    The yellow and white chart in my long post above shows the zodiac Sign size compared with the actual constellation size. Each day is a degree because the Sun travels a degree each day (...actually 58 minutes).

    The zodiac we are all familiar with is an arbitrary simplified construction of 12 - 30 degree sections of a circle merely for convenience sake. It was developed first by the Babylonians and passed down through the Greeks, Egyptians, and Arabic world to where we are now.

    Because of recent translations of old cuniform tablets and some Greek writings, we know that our ancestors used the constellations for their astrology, not the artificial zodiac.

    So my dilemma remains that because of the uncertainty of the zodiac Signs and the relative size of the actual constellations, anything I say in a chart delineation is suspect.
    In fact, anything any astrologer says when using these zodiacs is suspect.

    I will say right here that I am not disproving Astrology, I am only illuminating certain aspects of it which need addressing and possible exclusion.
    I have not ruled out the Planets nor the Ascendant/Descendant line or the Medium Coeli/Imum Coeli line. These two lines are still valid, but should not have a Sign designation. The Ascendant is the point formed on the circle by the Horizon at the time of one's birth. This is a mathematical point. Similr to the M.C., as it is the measurable highest point of the Sun's arc during the day of one's birth.

    Anyhow, I hope this simplifies my former post and everyone can see why I must pause and contemplate this before continuing.
     

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  11. EloquentBohemian

    EloquentBohemian Community Member

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    So, there is always a solution to any problem.
    First, House systems have always been a problem for me because there are many ways to calculate them.
    These I will eliminate.
    The Zodiac Signs, as I have spoken about above, are not reliable and are arbitrary and mythological constructs. For all the reasons indicated above, I will eliminate them as well.

    What remains is a chart which looks like the attachment below (which btw, is my chart). Though this does not look like much, the most important information is there - the Planets/Points, the two main division lines which create the Quadrants, and the aspects between them (opposition, square, trine, etc.).

    When I first approach a chart, this is the way I look at it initially. I do not take into account the Signs and Houses until after I understand the inter-relationships between these important elements, then I add any qualities a Sign indicates and the arbitrary area of life a House indicates.
    From my p.o.v., Signs are merely categories which have a minor impact on the internal workings of a chart and Houses are not as important as the 4 Quadrants are. The whole of an individual's chart is present at all times, it is the environment/situation one is in at any given time which dictates which combination of potentials (planets) one will prefer to use more prominently. In a full session with someone, this is what I emphasise.

    This also corresponds to the fact that I prefer that someone not refer to themselves as any Sun Sign, such as Scorpio or Cancer, because this is misleading. One is much more than merely the Sun Sign, one is the complete chart at all times.

    So, I will continue with doing the charts people have asked form but without reference to Signs and Houses.
    If you have any questions whatsoever, feel free to ask.

    If you still would like me to do your chart, please either PM me one way or the other or post your preference on this thread. I will also redo the individuals I have already finished if they wish.
    For those who do not wish their charts done in this manner, I will eliminate them off my hard-drive.

    These are the people whose charts I have so far:
    candaylandjoe
    BlackSwan
    Vindur Nott
    arbygil
    Pristinegirl
    dxlin
    PsilocinProject
    merrytrees
    mayflow
    uberrogo
    JaneRose
    naxx
    SoDistant
    JustNickey
    Satya
    Taz
    alcyone
    Soulful
    An Enigma
    shannishannon
     

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  12. acd

    acd Well-known member

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    Heckya I would love my chart done, still!:llama:
     
  13. NaeturVindur

    NaeturVindur Cuddlemaster
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    I'm happy with the initial reading. Thanks!
     
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  14. TenorKite

    TenorKite Community Member

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    I'd be interested in having my chart read again, Thanks! I thought the first reading was pretty good, but I'm interested in comparing them.
     
  15. An Enigma

    An Enigma Newbie

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    You may go ahead with my chart as well-- Thanks for taking the time to do all of these charts!
     
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  16. arbygil

    arbygil Passing through

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    :hug:

    I'm really flexible, EB - any way you choose is fine with me. Especially since I have no skills in it either way! I'd still enjoy hearing your insights. Thank you for doing so much! You didn't have to, but you decided to anyway. And for that I'm grateful.
     
  17. Creon

    Creon Community Member

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    I'm not too serious about it EB. You can drop mine if you want, it seems many people have post their charts, and they want to see their charts explained much more than I do. My chart is just additional burden for you.


    And keep my chart. You will need it to blackmail me when I conquer this planet. :peace:
     
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  18. EloquentBohemian

    EloquentBohemian Community Member

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    merrytrees, Xel'Karin, An Enigma, arbygil... no problem. Thanks for the opportunities.

    VindurN
     
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  19. Creon

    Creon Community Member

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    Sure, EB. When you've finished with the others and If you're not bored doing it, then why not. Thank you.

    EXCELLENT! I've found my astrologer! Now all I have to do is raise an army, hire some generals, and buy some nukes...
     
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  20. shannishannon

    shannishannon Saponifier
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    Please proceed with my chart. Real Solar Zodiac seems to make sense. Thanks in advance for hopefully a fresh perspective.
     
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