This sentence confuses me(I tried to think on it, but still confused.)
oh no worries. We're all good here <3
and I agree as well @Kgal . It's in my mum's generation and hers before, that structure.
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Definitely. Like I said when I originally explained, age differences happen in genuine relationships. There was also a time when an age gap in a marriage where the man was up to ten years older was ordinary.
Many times, these relationships don't last, or if they do, they aren't balanced. Or, they claim it is an exception, but the man continues to date much younger women after they break up. I'm 50, and right now I am seeing musicians with notoriety (ages 45-65) splitting with wives their own age and dating their young 20-something fans. That is specifically what sparked my original comment.
Exactly, and a lot of it is an ego-feeding activity because "bagging" the young woman is a "conquest" or achievement. This happens with women dating younger men, too, but less frequently. I know a few relationships where the woman is a lot older, but the dynamics are different. In the ones I can think of, the wife is more nurturing and bossy, but there is still a lack of balance.
That said, I believe no relationship is truly equal and there is always a dominant partner, even if that dominance is subtle. Yes, respect each other and compromise, but if you spend more time with one person's family or friends, if one person is more emotionally demanding, if one person's career takes precedence, etc, that person is the dominant one. It's kind of weird, but I've spent a long time studying long-term relationships, including my own, and in those equal and fair relationships there is a subtle dominance of one partner. It could be either the man or woman. Sometimes one is socially/publicly dominant and the other rules the home.
Same.
Good morning Asa <3
I suspect that with many famous people dating younger fans, it isn't only conquest that feeds their ego, but that youthful adoration people have of their idols from afar. As well as a sort of power dynamic that comes from being somebody wealthy dating somebody who's not. But that doesn't last.
I don't personally know any age gap relationships besides my big sis & her husband that have been successful. As Kgal mentioned, my sister is the older partner in hers, and she's definitely bossy, lol
But mostly, I agree.
I suspect that with many famous people dating younger fans, it isn't only conquest that feeds their ego, but that youthful adoration people have of their idols from afar. As well as a sort of power dynamic that comes from being somebody wealthy dating somebody who's not. But that doesn't last.
I don't personally know any age gap relationships besides my big sis & her husband that have been successful. As Kgal mentioned, my sister is the older partner in hers, and she's definitely bossy, lol
There's something I want to say about this but I don't know how to approach it, or if it can be approached.
But mostly, I agree.
You're probably sensing the relationship dynamics should be able to ebb and flow as each partner needs to stretch and grow. In that sense the dominant partner would change back and forth to suit the needs of the social structure of the relationship.
This was part of it, yes.
There were other things too though.
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I don't know about the wealth part, but otherwise, yes. Like I said, there are exceptions and I know some genuine couples, but when I made my initial comment I was talking about the sleazy habit of intentionally looking for younger people to date, not accidentally falling for someone younger because you have a deep connection, which also happens.
LOL.
You can say it.
This definitely happens in healthy relationships, and this should be the objective, but I still believe one person gets their way a little more in most cases. Even when one partner is obviously more dominant because they have the job that keeps them afloat or that they move across country for, that person should be championing the equal growth and success of their partner. Otherwise, forget it.
Yep. Even though my generation and the one's before were taught to stick it out no matter what...I walked away from the ones that weren't equal in being flexible for one another.
I also walked away from the idea of a marriage ending in Failure just because they couldn't stick it out. Our issues in my culture are predicated exactly upon that fact. In some insane point of view we are lauded and appreciated just for staying in a marriage of stagnation and misery. It's ludicrous.
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That mentality is so unhealthy and it is why people perceive marriage as a prison sentence.
Always hated it. Especially since some of the analogies used for marriage were always so negative and limiting:
- Lock it down or tie someone down
- Take the plunge or the leap
- Settle down - doesn't sound like fun
- The "ole ball and chain"
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Yes, and who wants to "trap" anyone? It sounds coercive.
I do know a lot of people in relationships who won't let their spouses live their lives to the fullest, though. For example: A lot of people make musicians quit their bands after marriage. My reply to that is always, "Why would you marry a musician if you don't want that person to play music?" You need to be in love with who the person is and what they do, or find someone else.
My new boyfriend (entp) is 9 years older than me. Divorced for almost a year (thirteen years of marriage, mutual decision to split). When we are out together and we meet people from his local community that knows them, he gets the "high five" grins/winks from the married guys, and I get the ever so subtle "ugh, un-woman" looks from the married women, and the "what are you doing swimming in my pool" wibe from the single women his age. I look my age+, and he actually looks my age, so the age gap isn't visible so to speak, but they know I'm younger than his "propper age group". He lives in an area that place high value on social status and appearances, and people there don't really divorce a lot. They don't know that we're just two weirdos that were lucky to find someone compatible within a comfortable radius and kind of just had to go for it
I'd have done the same <3 I'm happy you did and are living your life regardless of their pressures.
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My new boyfriend (entp) is 9 years older than me. Divorced for almost a year (thirteen years of marriage, mutual decision to split). When we are out together and we meet people from his local community that knows them, he gets the "high five" grins/winks from the married guys, and I get the ever so subtle "ugh, un-woman" looks from the married women, and the "what are you doing swimming in my pool" wibe from the single women his age. I look my age+, and he actually looks my age, so the age gap isn't visible so to speak, but they know I'm younger than his "propper age group". He lives in an area that place high value on social status and appearances, and people there don't really divorce a lot. They don't know that we're just two weirdos that were lucky to find someone compatible within a comfortable radius and kind of just had to go for it
I want to stress that this (below) is what I was trying to articulate all along, but as I have Fe/Ti, it can take me some time to organize my emotions into the proper words. That is why my initial post did not elaborate.
I definitely know all those looks and attitudes and I'm sorry you're experiencing that. Even if/when I think an age gap is inappropriate I'm not going to treat the people like that. Everyone deserves respect and kindness. I used to get a lot of attitude from women who thought I was younger than they were, so I've experienced this.
I also don't think ten years is too much of a gap. One of the men I had in mind when I initially posted is 65 and dates 20-somethings. I know another man who is similarly 65-70 who only dates 20-somethings. (It's pretty easy to do when you are in a band, have a cool car, tattoos, etc.) Since my first post about this, I have been socializing with a couple who are about 17 years apart. She is mature, grounded, and confident and the relationship works. She is in her late thirties. This is a much different situation. In many circumstances, age gaps work. In circumstances where the older person only dates very young people, it is weird.
Hey, so I have a question. As women, do you feel comfortable asking your partner for what you need or want in a relationship? I have not had success in this. Has anyone found they lacked confidence in this area but built up confidence in this? How? What happens when your partner doesn't understand or isn't initially receptive? Looking forward to your responses.
No worries, Asa. I got what you meant in your previous posts, and it's me that should have made that clear in my post: I absolutely share the frustrations and feelings about the shallow mentality you were referring to in your first post. That's why I can't really take those looks personally, because I have these presumptions myself, and get where they're coming from. I just wanted to offer an ironic twist, that what they think they see (shallowness) in this instance, is the exact opposite of what's actually the case (genuineness). We're definitely together in spite of the age gap, not because of it.
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No worries, Asa. I got what you meant in your previous posts, and it's me that should have made that clear in my post: I absolutely share the frustrations and feelings about the shallow mentality you were referring to in your first post. That's why I can't really take those looks personally, because I have these presumptions myself, and get where they're coming from. I just wanted to offer an ironic twist, that what they think they see (shallowness) in this instance, is the exact opposite of what's actually the case (genuineness). We're definitely together in spite of the age gap, not because of it.
OK, phew. A lot of women I know have long-term older partners. It definitely works.
I didn't in the past, but now I feel that I would make requests without worry since finding my 'voice'. I think it boils down to trust. Do you trust that they value you to the extent that even a word of criticism is accepted because it is uttered from the lips of their beloved? How can they possibly chastise you for expressing a need or want, and if they did, why is it so harmful to them that they would do so? What is it you fear should you ask? I should note, I've lived the prior, and have been silenced to ever wanting or needing-- and this is the reason why it is prudent to express these things all the more with those who actually want for your good. Even if they didn't chastise you for having wants or needs, they have within them the power to deny such a request with a simple, "No".
I haven't had the opportunity to express myself in such a way with a healthy partner yet (when I tried with an unhealthy partner, my requests were seen as some form of abasement to his personhood/manhood-- and I was punished in doing so), but I hope to do so one day with a healthy partner, and I'd fulfill their requests generously in the fruit of reciprocity. However, I have done so with friends and relatives. It started slowly in meager things which didn't pose a threat. Asking if we could eat somewhere I wanted instead of going to a place they wanted again, suggesting an alternate plan or experience that I'd like to try, telling them I need to know in advance if they want to spend time so that I can plan accordingly instead of being told the day of, etc. The confidence comes when the responses you fear don't occur in the way you perceived they would. Realizing that it is okay to request of people, that it is okay to make your needs and wants known, is integral to sustaining healthy give and take in relationships. If they don't receive the requests well, depending on how paramount these needs/wants are to you, they could be further discussed or it may be time to decide whether that person truly has your good in mind.
My few past romantic relationships have been unboundaried. I didn't feel comfortable or uncomfortable because we were lost in each other; it would be like saying "is your left hand comfortable asking something of your right?".
As for non-romantic relationships, I've not many. I once felt uncomfortable but not so much anymore. However I've low expectations my needs will be respected.
Sometimes I let it go. Other times I make unilateral decisions. Or compromise. It depends on what they are and their consequences.
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I'm really uncomfortable with the sexual objectification of men via the "gray sweatpants season" memes.
Yes, I get the old joke about gray sweatpants. Why are we doing to men what women have been asking men to stop doing to us?
Someone I follow on social media posted that a woman approached him at the gym and told him he shouldn't be working out in gray sweatpants because he has too much to offer. WTH? He said he was uncomfortable and self-conscious for the rest of the workout.
While this is a "taste your own medicine" moment, I'll never be comfortable with objectifying people.
Thoughts? Agree? Disagree?
Yes, I get the old joke about gray sweatpants. Why are we doing to men what women have been asking men to stop doing to us?
Someone I follow on social media posted that a woman approached him at the gym and told him he shouldn't be working out in gray sweatpants because he has too much to offer. WTH? He said he was uncomfortable and self-conscious for the rest of the workout.
While this is a "taste your own medicine" moment, I'll never be comfortable with objectifying people.
Thoughts? Agree? Disagree?
I think it is natural to objectify in mind, but to actually approach someone as if it is your 'right' to place your own stringent expectations upon them on how or what they should be, is presumptuous on a level I'm uncomfortable with. I think it's akin to men telling women that they cannot wear something out in public as if it is somehow representative of them in any way; I honestly see it as a form of control and extremely unhealthy. The human body should be allowed to exist in public unscrutinized, as long as no one is forcing others to view their naughty bits openly in a space which doesn't allow it. I don't understand why anyone feels the 'right' to harbor judgment about another person's body. I think it has more to do with that woman at the gym having guilt in objectifying him in her mind, and saying something to him somehow passed the guilt onto him as a projection of her own insecurities. It's telling, and laughable.