Being Alone

[TinyBubbles]

When I was young my Dad noticed me taking photos of things and scenery and he said "Make sure you take some with people in them, those are the important ones" and he was right, it's the people we remember.

i've always wondered about the reasoning behind statements like this, that imply in the future sometime all you're going to remember - and hence all that will be considered important - will be the moments you've shared with others. or the experiences you've had throughout your life, the risks you've taken. i can't help but think, you know, why would memories take on an extra significance when you're older? as though you stop living at some point and having nothing left except visions of a life long passed. i think it's not true, you're going to live, step by step, until the day you die, one point is not going to be especially more valuable than another, and even old and decrepit you'll still keep making choices. what happens if you've lived a full life, an exciting and awesome adventure of a life, and then go senile in old age? what happened to all those fabulous memories? guess they were worth nothing then, guess only the experiences in the moment mattered. i think that's true of every moment.
lol sorry for going off on a tangent quinlan, but your post was thought-provoking.

 

[Quinlan]

i've always wondered about the reasoning behind statements like this, that imply in the future sometime all you're going to remember - and hence all that will be considered important - will be the moments you've shared with others.

I don't mean to say everyone is like that but I know for myself if I ever look back over photos, I skip over scenery and spend much more time looking at old photos of people. When I think of some of my hobbies and some of my fondest memories I rarely remember times when I was alone most often it was the company that made the moment.

or the experiences you've had throughout your life, the risks you've taken. i can't help but think, you know, why would memories take on an extra significance when you're older? as though you stop living at some point and having nothing left except visions of a life long passed. i think it's not true, you're going to live, step by step, until the day you die, one point is not going to be especially more valuable than another, and even old and decrepit you'll still keep making choices. what happens if you've lived a full life, an exciting and awesome adventure of a life, and then go senile in old age? what happened to all those fabulous memories? guess they were worth nothing then, guess only the experiences in the moment mattered. i think that's true of every moment.

If I lose something of value that doesn't mean it was never worth anything, the fact that it can be lost probably makes it even more precious.

Perhaps this is type related, in the sense that I'm an SP and if anything I can get carried away with living too much in the moment. Perhaps the F moments for me are more rewarding in an intrinsic and lasting kind of way than the pure sensory moments.

 

[TinyBubbles]

If I lose something of value that doesn't mean it was never worth anything, the fact that it can be lost probably makes it even more precious.

that's a really good point

 

[Skoffin]

I seem to have an almost opposite problem to this, I like to be alone but every so often I need people around me. I don't see any problem with being alone and a lot of the time I prefer it, frankly if I had people around me all the time I'd go mad.

 

[DeadlyPacifist]

I fundamentally don't see any merits in forming friendships that aren't potential "real" friendships. I think it's a complete waste of time and energy to be friends with someone for "networking purposes," or just bumming around, or whatever. Although it seems that many people do like having a circle of acquaintainces. Anyways, I'd rather be alone than have friends who aren't super close to me. However, once in a while, I'll feel that a social life is something I should definitely be pursuing, and actively spend time with people who don't really "matter" to me, etc. Then I switch back to my regular mode and stop contacting those people, and well, it doesn't really matter because if I decide to go back to my shell, they'll stop talking to me as before, so they didn't matter too much in the first place.

There are times in my life [like right now] where I'm utterly frustrated with humanity and hurt from certain people. At these times, I want minimal contact with people. However, in time, I'll probably start socializing again...but I don't know. Perhaps there are only a certain number of times that your heart can be stomped on before you decide that you'll have no more, and sweep the remaining pieces into a coffin and let it rust there instead of having it become crushed out of existence. I think this is the stage I'm at right now, though I'm not exactly sure. There is someone who's a small ray of hope for me, I suppose. Haha. I don't mean to sound overdramatic, but I think you guys should understand how an INFJ can easily get their heart shredded by falling for someone who takes advantage of our kindness and abusing us...and we let ourselves get abused. I'm just too traumatized from my past experiences, and I'm going to shut myself off for an indefinite period of time.

Anyways, I'm sorry to have gone off on a tangent...but I think this does relate to the thread in a way. At the end of the day, when I look into my heart, I think I realize that I'm alone. No one else besides yourself is a gurantee. My parents will probably be there for me until they die...but they will die one day, and even before that, they aren't there for all aspects for my life, and they really don't understand me too well to begin with. Friends and love is difficult. I do have one friend who I believe could easily be my friend for the rest of my life though =) We don't talk so much anymore, but I think that in our hearts, we are true friends to each other. I feel very lucky to have met him, and sometimes, if I'm feeling down, I think about him, and I feel a little better to know that he'll always be there. Well, I shouldn't say "always," but given the amount of time I've known him and such...I'd say it's a safe gamble. Stability if a huge issue for me...I guess.

I do believe that INFJs can be quite codependent. We want to share our lives with other people. We want to find those connections and give away our love. That's what we value. However, I think that we need to kind of "suck it up" [for the lack of a better phrase] and realize that those connections may never be found. They CAN be, but there is NO gurantee, and we need to accept that. We need to accept that there are no gurantees with any sort of relationships, and that we should take care of ourselves. We should be prepared for the failure of a friendship or relationship. It's hard, and I'm pretty sure I'm not quite capable of doing this [at least not right now], but it's definitely something that should be done..

 

[Sam]

I'm quite a stoic at heart. I really like the people in my life and I enjoy their company, but we're all alone, no one can be a part of us in a way that I think NF's typically "idealize".

My most natural reaction is to also withdraw, but I'm starting to realize how many opportunities I'm missing out on doing just that. (maybe the instinctual variants pack has a big influence on this, too, sp being my first) - but when we stay inside of ourselves too much, we deny ourselves the opportunity to grow, because growth only happens through other people mirroring us back to ourselves. In a vacuum we might be very comfortable and we won't have to face things, but we won't grow.

I think the best way to beat loneliness is by making yourself open. I think many would be surprised by what we could learn from people we think "can't understand us". I think in some ways ENxPs are way better at this, they're spreading themselves in every direction and bombarding and experimenting with the cause/effect more than INxJs usually (I get paranoid and worried and overthink the negative possible scenarios - and come to the conclusion fuck it, I won't go). It's better to have negative experiences than no experiences at all (using the word "experiences" here quite loosely)

Everyone's alone and no one can "complete" us or give us what we want or fix us or whatever, but other people make this life a lot more fun of a ride to be on. We're all pretty similar, people. I fight this battle with myself everyday, though, might be that tomorrow I disagree with myself completely *laugh*

 

[54192&#cmy]

I fundamentally don't see any merits in forming friendships that aren't potential "real" friendships. I think it's a complete waste of time and energy to be friends with someone for "networking purposes," or just bumming around, or whatever. Although it seems that many people do like having a circle of acquaintainces. Anyways, I'd rather be alone than have friends who aren't super close to me. However, once in a while, I'll feel that a social life is something I should definitely be pursuing, and actively spend time with people who don't really "matter" to me, etc. Then I switch back to my regular mode and stop contacting those people, and well, it doesn't really matter because if I decide to go back to my shell, they'll stop talking to me as before, so they didn't matter too much in the first place.

There are times in my life [like right now] where I'm utterly frustrated with humanity and hurt from certain people. At these times, I want minimal contact with people. However, in time, I'll probably start socializing again...but I don't know. Perhaps there are only a certain number of times that your heart can be stomped on before you decide that you'll have no more, and sweep the remaining pieces into a coffin and let it rust there instead of having it become crushed out of existence. I think this is the stage I'm at right now, though I'm not exactly sure. There is someone who's a small ray of hope for me, I suppose. Haha. I don't mean to sound overdramatic, but I think you guys should understand how an INFJ can easily get their heart shredded by falling for someone who takes advantage of our kindness and abusing us...and we let ourselves get abused. I'm just too traumatized from my past experiences, and I'm going to shut myself off for an indefinite period of time.

Anyways, I'm sorry to have gone off on a tangent...but I think this does relate to the thread in a way. At the end of the day, when I look into my heart, I think I realize that I'm alone. No one else besides yourself is a gurantee. My parents will probably be there for me until they die...but they will die one day, and even before that, they aren't there for all aspects for my life, and they really don't understand me too well to begin with. Friends and love is difficult. I do have one friend who I believe could easily be my friend for the rest of my life though =) We don't talk so much anymore, but I think that in our hearts, we are true friends to each other. I feel very lucky to have met him, and sometimes, if I'm feeling down, I think about him, and I feel a little better to know that he'll always be there. Well, I shouldn't say "always," but given the amount of time I've known him and such...I'd say it's a safe gamble. Stability if a huge issue for me...I guess.

I do believe that INFJs can be quite codependent. We want to share our lives with other people. We want to find those connections and give away our love. That's what we value. However, I think that we need to kind of "suck it up" [for the lack of a better phrase] and realize that those connections may never be found. They CAN be, but there is NO gurantee, and we need to accept that. We need to accept that there are no gurantees with any sort of relationships, and that we should take care of ourselves. We should be prepared for the failure of a friendship or relationship. It's hard, and I'm pretty sure I'm not quite capable of doing this [at least not right now], but it's definitely something that should be done..

I totally agree. I am with ya 100%. I only have one or two real friends. And they both live too far away to hang out with. But when we do hang out it is like we never quit hanging out. We just know one another and we have a deep respect for what the other one is about. I have had a lifetime of people walking into and out of my life. It usually ends when I get upset and decide to cut them off and start over. I am in the process of really changing my outlook on life and a lot of people have had to go. Letting them go has made my life easier though. I don't have to listen to their problems and be the support person. It's like being in a bad relationship....

 

[MrWindUpBird]

I fundamentally don't see any merits in forming friendships that aren't potential "real" friendships. I think it's a complete waste of time and energy to be friends with someone for "networking purposes," or just bumming around, or whatever. Although it seems that many people do like having a circle of acquaintainces. Anyways, I'd rather be alone than have friends who aren't super close to me. However, once in a while, I'll feel that a social life is something I should definitely be pursuing, and actively spend time with people who don't really "matter" to me, etc. Then I switch back to my regular mode and stop contacting those people, and well, it doesn't really matter because if I decide to go back to my shell, they'll stop talking to me as before, so they didn't matter too much in the first place.

There are times in my life [like right now] where I'm utterly frustrated with humanity and hurt from certain people. At these times, I want minimal contact with people. However, in time, I'll probably start socializing again...but I don't know. Perhaps there are only a certain number of times that your heart can be stomped on before you decide that you'll have no more, and sweep the remaining pieces into a coffin and let it rust there instead of having it become crushed out of existence. I think this is the stage I'm at right now, though I'm not exactly sure. There is someone who's a small ray of hope for me, I suppose. Haha. I don't mean to sound overdramatic, but I think you guys should understand how an INFJ can easily get their heart shredded by falling for someone who takes advantage of our kindness and abusing us...and we let ourselves get abused. I'm just too traumatized from my past experiences, and I'm going to shut myself off for an indefinite period of time.

Anyways, I'm sorry to have gone off on a tangent...but I think this does relate to the thread in a way. At the end of the day, when I look into my heart, I think I realize that I'm alone. No one else besides yourself is a gurantee. My parents will probably be there for me until they die...but they will die one day, and even before that, they aren't there for all aspects for my life, and they really don't understand me too well to begin with. Friends and love is difficult. I do have one friend who I believe could easily be my friend for the rest of my life though =) We don't talk so much anymore, but I think that in our hearts, we are true friends to each other. I feel very lucky to have met him, and sometimes, if I'm feeling down, I think about him, and I feel a little better to know that he'll always be there. Well, I shouldn't say "always," but given the amount of time I've known him and such...I'd say it's a safe gamble. Stability if a huge issue for me...I guess.

I do believe that INFJs can be quite codependent. We want to share our lives with other people. We want to find those connections and give away our love. That's what we value. However, I think that we need to kind of "suck it up" [for the lack of a better phrase] and realize that those connections may never be found. They CAN be, but there is NO gurantee, and we need to accept that. We need to accept that there are no gurantees with any sort of relationships, and that we should take care of ourselves. We should be prepared for the failure of a friendship or relationship. It's hard, and I'm pretty sure I'm not quite capable of doing this [at least not right now], but it's definitely something that should be done..

I agree with you about not wanting to spend time with people you don't really connect with or contact. They're throw away friends, they're a warm body so you have some background chatter while you eat a hamburger at the local diner. And yeah, when you stop contacting each other, no big deal. Plenty of fish.

I learned from an early age to keep my heart locked away, partly because of my highly mobile childhood and partly because both my relationships before college didn't go well (though I admit in one case it was mostly my fault). I think INFJs have a naturally childlike heart and love for people, but they have to hide that empathy and quench that loving desire lest they be hurt very frequently. I think we need to keep ourselves from becoming too guarded. To give you an example, my last relationship, which actually ended amiably, was never one I could enjoy, because I was never able to let myself fully emotionally embrace the other person. The story is more complicated in that, but it was a wake up call for me.

Quoting you has led me on a tangent...

I don't think people are meant to be alone. That's why we feel loneliness. Compare the nuisance of being around a ton of people all the time, versus the slow agony of forced solitude. Unless you're a misanthrope, it should be obvious which one is more painful. I think people are drawn to develop bonds towards friends, spouses, or god/nature/spirituality.

Anyway, that's my two cents.

 

[randomsomeone]

I enjoy people's company a great deal (in moderation), but I have come to expect little of substance from these relationships, which is fine as there are really very, very few people I actually click with. In any case, even these folks eventually seem to leave my life....just circumstances or fate.

So, in the end, I find that I now understand solitude much better than I do anything else....it feels like home to me. Perhaps it's more of a center...I find I am most content here.

That does not mean I cannot wander out now and then...I have some great friends and acquaintances and these are very warm, genuine relationships. Still...there is no place like home.

 

[Ria]

I agree with you about not wanting to spend time with people you don't really connect with or contact. They're throw away friends, they're a warm body so you have some background chatter while you eat a hamburger at the local diner. And yeah, when you stop contacting each other, no big deal. Plenty of fish.

I learned from an early age to keep my heart locked away, partly because of my highly mobile childhood and partly because both my relationships before college didn't go well (though I admit in one case it was mostly my fault). I think INFJs have a naturally childlike heart and love for people, but they have to hide that empathy and quench that loving desire lest they be hurt very frequently. I think we need to keep ourselves from becoming too guarded. To give you an example, my last relationship, which actually ended amiably, was never one I could enjoy, because I was never able to let myself fully emotionally embrace the other person. The story is more complicated in that, but it was a wake up call for me.

Quoting you has led me on a tangent...

I don't think people are meant to be alone. That's why we feel loneliness. Compare the nuisance of being around a ton of people all the time, versus the slow agony of forced solitude. Unless you're a misanthrope, it should be obvious which one is more painful. I think people are drawn to develop bonds towards friends, spouses, or god/nature/spirituality.

Anyway, that's my two cents.

+ 1

 

[Ria]

I'm quite a stoic at heart. I really like the people in my life and I enjoy their company, but we're all alone, no one can be a part of us in a way that I think NF's typically "idealize".

My most natural reaction is to also withdraw, but I'm starting to realize how many opportunities I'm missing out on doing just that. (maybe the instinctual variants pack has a big influence on this, too, sp being my first) - but when we stay inside of ourselves too much, we deny ourselves the opportunity to grow, because growth only happens through other people mirroring us back to ourselves. In a vacuum we might be very comfortable and we won't have to face things, but we won't grow.

I think the best way to beat loneliness is by making yourself open. I think many would be surprised by what we could learn from people we think "can't understand us". I think in some ways ENxPs are way better at this, they're spreading themselves in every direction and bombarding and experimenting with the cause/effect more than INxJs usually (I get paranoid and worried and overthink the negative possible scenarios - and come to the conclusion fuck it, I won't go). It's better to have negative experiences than no experiences at all (using the word "experiences" here quite loosely)

Everyone's alone and no one can "complete" us or give us what we want or fix us or whatever, but other people make this life a lot more fun of a ride to be on. We're all pretty similar, people. I fight this battle with myself everyday, though, might be that tomorrow I disagree with myself completely *laugh*

Indeed...

This is my delimma, and this place has been a great opportunity to be loved in return, the way that I give my love. (from the soul). I moved a lot when I was little, so I never made lasting friendships. My friendships have been only in the last 3 years irl, and I hold these very few people dear and close to my heart. But yea, I'm used to losing people, but I'm getting over that now, and trusting that people will stay with me now. Thus, I'm being more open.

 

[laurie]

I remember my sister saying that, biologically, humans are pack animals that work together. I guess in our currently society it's not too hard to see that if you look - there's lots of incidents every day within every few moments that shows this, like someone helping carry a pushchair down stairs or a worker in a business etc.

Relationship-wise, most people are highly dependent on having family, friends and a partner, so I suppose that's pretty usual of groupish animals ^^

Personally, I could just do with my family. I love my friends, but I don't feel as close to them (consistently, at least) as my family. There's not the bond...
Got no clue about partners though, never had one XD Don't feel the need to find one.

 

[Feelings]

My feelings side developed alot recently. There's a lot more INFJ in me now. This is making me really fall apart inside from loneliness because it's hard to find companionship for me. Very few people could jive well with me. In a way it feels like I'm dying.

Also, I hold back a lot, even to myself. I let out bits and pieces of my feely nature only. If I completely let out and externalize what is actually occurring inside of me, you'd probably see a full on INFJ. Rather, some strange INTJ variant of it.

 

[SpaceCowgirl]

I think looking for happiness from companionship will ultimately fail, at least for introverts. But I also think relationships can bring you a lot of happiness if you don't rely on them for it. Being content by yourself allows you to have more meaningful relationships, because you aren't desperate for them. And I don't think that we have to accept being completely alone, because we aren't

 

[DeadlyPacifist]

You know, I have this INFJ/INTJ borderline personality thing going on as well. Sometimes I become very INTJ-ish, cold, and maybe even apathetic. Then my feelings kick in and I feel like I'm dying. I actually feel like I'm getting closer to death every time I switch from INTJ [my shield against bad feelings] to INFJ. I can't control it either. When I took the MBTI test, I was 50% Feeling...

 

[Feelings]

You know, I have this INFJ/INTJ borderline personality thing going on as well. Sometimes I become very INTJ-ish, cold, and maybe even apathetic. Then my feelings kick in and I feel like I'm dying. I actually feel like I'm getting closer to death every time I switch from INTJ [my shield against bad feelings] to INFJ. I can't control it either. When I took the MBTI test, I was 50% Feeling...

Would be easier if I was female, too. I would be less likely to get dumbass comments if I were to actually show more feelings. I wouldn't have to hide as much.

I think looking for happiness from companionship will ultimately fail, at least for introverts. But I also think relationships can bring you a lot of happiness if you don't rely on them for it. Being content by yourself allows you to have more meaningful relationships, because you aren't desperate for them. And I don't think that we have to accept being completely alone, because we aren't

Looks like that was directed at me. I don't think you're understanding me very well.

 

[TinyBubbles]

Would be easier if I was female, too. I would be less likely to get dumbass comments if I were to actually show more feelings. I wouldn't have to hide as much.

do you really believe that? it's not exactly easy for me to display my emotions, and I AM a female. imo it's context dependent, if you have a supportive environment and are led by others to believe that your expressed feelings won't be misunderstood or unappreciated, you'll be more willing to display them, regardless of whether you're a male or female. though i'll admit most people are more willing to give women the benefit of the doubt than men in this regard..

 

[Sloe Djinn]

I think looking for happiness from companionship will ultimately fail, at least for introverts. But I also think relationships can bring you a lot of happiness if you don't rely on them for it. Being content by yourself allows you to have more meaningful relationships, because you aren't desperate for them. And I don't think that we have to accept being completely alone, because we aren't

It's easy to forget that every once in a while.

 

[RafiqNF]

I read someone's opinion once, he said that people who actualize go through three stages - one where they seek to fulfill their ego by dealing with other people (where most people are), then where they isolate themselves from others in order to become self-secure and to determine who they really are (where less people are), and the final stage where they rejoin with everyone in order to act in accordance with their own values.

I thought that was interesting, that solitude is a step in the process of finding one's purpose. One that might hurt and be unpleasant for a time, but most certainly not an endpoint.

 

[DeadlyPacifist]

Solitude is something that every human who wishes to progress and develop should embrace. Not complete solitude, but solitude in moderation. If you're always around other people, you never have time to absorb and reflect.

I used to fret at the idea of being alone. Now I embrace it with open arms. I love the idea that I am completely free. I have no obligations. I don't need to answer to anyone, not even my parents. I can do whatever the hell I want. It's my life. Think about it this way, and it becomes a positive thing.