Clinton vs Trump, Trump vs Clinton | Page 4 | INFJ Forum

Clinton vs Trump, Trump vs Clinton

For as weasely as Trump may or may not appear...it would take him a thousand years of trying to be as much of a weasle as Harpy is now.

A pox on both their houses, really.

I hate triangulation. Its a sell out - basically campaigning from the left and governing from right. Bill Clinton essentially invented it and it was just copied by Blair, Chrietien and all their sorry ilk. Hillary practices classic triangulation and her tenure as as Secretary of State proves it.

Trump is worse in many many ways. He a classic fraud and carnival huckster who stands for nothing. He has no plan, no viable program, presents no viable ideas for solving anything. He plays on people's fears blames the most vunerable people in society for the ills of society. Its classic scapegoating. He sees himself as a strongman and asks people just to trust him based on what? Some overblown image of the successful tycoon businessman whose mere presence is going solve all their problems, a modern day Daddy Warbucks. People are actually buying into this. It drives me crazy.

Sanders was the last candidate with any integrity. Good luck Americans, you're going to need it.
 
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A pox on both their houses, really.

I hate triangulation. Its a sell out - basically campaigning from the left and governing from right. Bill Clinton essentially invented it and it was just copied by Blair, Chrietien and all their sorry ilk. Hillary practices classic triangulation and her tenure as as Secretary of State proves it.

Trump is worse in many many ways. He a classic fraud and carnival huckster who stands for nothing. He has no plan, no viable program, presents no viable ideas for solving anything. He plays on people's fears blames the most vunerable people in society for the ills of society. Its classic scapegoating. He sees himself as a strongman and asks people just to trust him based on what? Some overblown image of the successful tycoon businessman whose mere presence is going solve all their problems, a modern day Daddy Warbucks. People are actually buying into this. It drives me crazy.

Sanders was the last candidate with any integrity. Good luck Americans, you're going to need it.

I have no love for Trump but to suggest he is worse than Hillary is difficult to take seriously.
 
I have no love for Trump but to suggest he is worse than Hillary is difficult to take seriously.

Why? Do you think the presidency is an entry level position? There is scant history for those never been in government being elected to the presidency. Taylor, Grant, and Eisenhower, who were successful Army generals, and Herbert Hoover, who had a good record in public administration and had served in the Cabinet are the only examples in history, of Presidents who have never been elected to office. I would argue the generals were bureaucrats in some sense who had some understanding of how government actually worked. Hoover had never won an elected position before winning the presidency, but he had been a cabinet secretary during the Harding administration.

...and then there's Trump. He knows nothing about inner working of government he really has no clue and no in depth knowledge of any issue. What's worse than that is that he thinks knows more than he actually does. Will his massive ego actually allow him to surround himself with knowledgeable people or will they be "yes men" who will confirm his preconceived notions on any given issue? My question is does he actually the believe the BS he has been selling (example: we are going to build and Mexico will pay for it) or is it just a massive joke?
 
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He's been open about the fact that he is being audited and can't. I think when you are that mega-wealthy, it is basically an ongoing audit. I actually believe him on this as, whatever his problems are, he doesn't seem to have a huge history of lying.

I think people are intimidated by his honesty, and for some ironic reason, the people that had spent years complaining that DC is full of career politicians suddenly recoil at the possibility of a President that spent his life criticising politicians, instead of being one.
 
I think people are intimidated by his honesty,

Is this some sort of joke??? Trump is dishonest and has spent his entire time in the public eye spouting falsehoods, overinflating his accomplishments, lying about his rivals, deliberately exaggerating so called facts to support his positions.

More examples of Trumps "pivots" http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-36318446

The Kissinger meeting is especially sickening. Trump is indeed a ludicrous figure
 
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I think people are intimidated by his honesty, and for some ironic reason, the people that had spent years complaining that DC is full of career politicians suddenly recoil at the possibility of a President that spent his life criticising politicians, instead of being one.
Yeah, I mean, whatever his flaws, he's been a career real estate mogul, not a politician. When he changes stances or alliances on an issue or person, he is completely open about it rather than going down the denial/lying path and being called a flip-flopper. So people come down on him for being a former card carrying democrat and friend of various democrats, including Hillary, and he just shrugs it off and basically says "Yeah, so? That was then, this is now. It worked then for me before and now it doesn't." Like it or leave it, can't really call it a lie, and in fact it is a pretty pragmatic way of approaching life. People may find his lack of political experience and lack of concrete agenda (no wall pun intended) distressing, but I really haven't found overt lying to be an issue. He has no problem answering questions with things like "Maybe," "Probably," or "I don't know." This doesn't create the lying issue many politicians have. Having an ambiguous agenda and no real political track record is sometimes preferable to having a poor track record and a disturbing agenda. From the cynical stance, sticking with the evil you know doesn't always make the most sense. When things are really going down the shitter, why not choose door X? Going OT here, but [MENTION=13855]JJJA[/MENTION] and all the other non-US posters who engage in political discussions here, I think you're awesome! I can't keep track of what's going on in all your corners of the world, but I'm impressed that you guys know what's up here.
 
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Trump is worse in many many ways. He a classic fraud and carnival huckster...

Not being sarcastic, but curious, what do you find fraudulent about him? Yeah he has sold everything from vodka to cuff links to board games, has owned casinos, condominium developments and golf resorts, but how does this make him a carnival huckster? None of those things may be your cup of tea, but neither are any of them snake oil, so to speak.
 
[MENTION=13855]JJJA[/MENTION] and all the other non-US posters who engage in political discussions here, I think you're awesome! I can't keep track of what's going on in all your corners of the world, but I'm impressed that you guys know what's up here.

today-im-proud-to-be-an-american-meme.jpg
 
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[MENTION=13730]PintoBean[/MENTION] Take Trump University as an example that one was pure snake oil. It was a never a university.

Trump University is currently the defendant in three lawsuits — two class-action lawsuits filed in California, and one filed in New York by then-attorney general Eric Schneiderman, who told CNN’s New Day in 2013: “We started looking at Trump University and discovered that it was a classic bait-and-switch scheme. It was a scam, starting with the fact that it was not a university.”

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/432010/trump-university-scam

We could into overpriced steaks and vodka too. Trump has mainly marketed himself, he is a relentless self promoter and the image is what he uses to scam unwitting people into buying and investing in his products.

Here's another quote from National Review:

Trump’s record as a businessman is hardly a recommendation for the highest office in the land. For all his success, Trump inherited a real-estate fortune from his father. Few of us will ever have the experience, as Trump did, of having Daddy-O bail out our struggling enterprise with an illegal loan in the form of casino chips. Trump’s primary work long ago became less about building anything than about branding himself and tending to his celebrity through a variety of entertainment ventures, from WWE to his reality-TV show, The Apprentice. His business record reflects the often dubious norms of the milieu: using eminent domain to condemn the property of others; buying the good graces of politicians — including many Democrats — with donations.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/430137/donald-trump-conservative-movement-menace
 
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Living next to you is in some ways like sleeping with an elephant. No matter how friendly and even-tempered is the beast, if I can call it that, one is affected by every twitch and grunt.

Pierre Trudeau - Addressing the Press Club in Washington, D.C. (25 March 1969)

This is why I follow US politics.
 
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[MENTION=14199]brightmoon[/MENTION] oh haha, you are right. The Trump university thing is pretty embarrassing! Totally forgot about that. On the other end, I will still take someone involved with that over somebody who Who has basically been taking bribes from the banks. Trump does claim no more bail outs for the for big banks, I think Hillary owes bail outs to Wall Street if she gets elected. And all of this does return to comparing bad and worse, who is actually worse continues to be the hot topic of debate I guess, so we are at square one. Please excuse typos, I am posting from my phone.
 
[MENTION=14199]brightmoon[/MENTION] oh haha, you are right. The Trump university thing is pretty embarrassing! Totally forgot about that. On the other end, I will still take someone involved with that over somebody who Who has basically been taking bribes from the banks. Trump does claim no more bail outs for the for big banks, I think Hillary owes bail outs to Wall Street if she gets elected. And all of this does return to comparing bad and worse, who is actually worse continues to be the hot topic of debate I guess, so we are at square one. Please excuse typos, I am posting from my phone.









Courtesy of Abel Danger
 
Trump is whats called "Mobbed up"..

#2566:

Serco's Resilient Pedophile Brain – Hotel Clinton, Boeing Trump – Hull House Jarrett’s Dump and Pump

By United States Marine, Field McConnell
Plum City Online - (AbelDanger.net)
January 16, 2016

1. Abel Danger (AD) asserts that agents of Serco – the UK's former radio patent monopoly founded as RCA GB in 1929 – are operating as a resilient pedophile brain which tracks elite pedophiles and then blackmails them while death-pool betting on the times of death at targeted assassination or mass-casualty events.

2. AD asserts that Serco's agents equipped hotel suites and Boeing aircraft – used by pedophile guests of a Clinton or Donald Trump – with the Defense Red Switch Network to synchronize news injects and media plays for Resilience 9/11.

3. AD asserts that Serco used the Red Switch to track pedophiles through Hull House, Boeing HQ and various elite hotels in Chicago and help Valerie Jarrett's insiders dump and pump Dow Jones futures contracts during the 9/11 attacks.
http://www.abeldanger.net/2016/01/2566-sercos-resilient-pedophile-brain.html



How Close Was Donald Trump To The Mob?

If Donald Trump wants to be a serious candidate for president, we deserve to know more about his business with mass murderers whose plunder of public and private funds added up to billions.

By David Marcus JULY 28, 2015

Donald Trump is running for president. Many believed or hoped that the Donald's latest foray into national politics was nothing more than a public-relations move, not a serious attempt to reside at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

But now that Trump holds the lead in national polls, as well as polls in Iowa and New Hampshire, it's time to take his campaign seriously. Media outlets like Huffington Post and the Wall Street Journal, which are covering Trump's run as an entertainment story, not a news story, are making a mistake. If Trump wants to be a serious candidate for president, and has the numbers to back it up, he must be vetted like a serious candidate for president.

A good place to start is to take a hard look at Trump’s ties to Philadelphia and New York organized-crime families.*Donald Trump's Connections to Organized Crime*Trump was building his eponymous empire of hotels, casinos, and high rises in the early 1980s in New York City and Atlantic City. In both places, the construction industry was firmly under the thumb of the mafia. And in both places there are literally concrete connections between*La Cosa Nostra*and Trump's lavish projects. Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist David Cay Johnston, who has covered Trump for decades, has written a very*useful list*of questions for Trump.

Many focus on his ties to the mob. In addition in his 1992 book, "Trump, The Deals and the Downfall," author Wayne Barrett lays out a slew of suspicious dealings and associations.*The Atlantic City story starts with Trump's purchase of a bar, at twice its market value, from Salvatore Testa, a made man in the Philadelphia mafia and son of Philip "Chicken Man" Testa, who was briefly head of the Philly mob after Angelo Bruno's 1980 killing.

Harrah’s casino, half owned by Trump, would be built on that land, and Trump would quickly buy out his partner, Harrah’s Entertainment, and rename the casino Trump Plaza.*Author Wayne Barrett lays out a slew of suspicious dealings and associations.*Trump Plaza's connection to the mob didn't end with the land purchase from Testa. Nicademo "Little Nicky" Scarfo (who became boss after the elder Testa was blown up) and his nephew Phillip "crazy Phil" Leonetti controlled two of the major construction and concrete companies in Atlantic City.

Both companies, Scarf, Inc. and Nat Nat, did work on the construction of Harrah's, according the State of New Jersey Commission of Investigation's 1986*report on organized crime. In addition, Scarfo, whose reign as head of the Philly mob was one of the bloodiest in history, controlled the bartenders union, which represented Trump's workers in Atlantic City, according to George Anastasia’s book, "Blood and Honor."*One more link to organized crime lurks in Trump's past Atlantic City dealings.

He had a*close association*with Kenny Shapiro, an investment banker for Scarfo. According to secret recordings of then Scarfo attorney Robert F. Simone, Shapiro was intimately involved with bribing Atlantic City Mayor Michael J. Matthews, whose term would end in 1984 with a conviction on extortion charges.*On the tapes, in 1983, Simone, talking about Leonetti, states: "He's a nice-looking boy…Nicky's nephew, he can sit with the…mayor. Ah, and Kenny's (Shapiro) got the mayor through this kid Phillip."*The Connections Don't End in Atlantic City*Trump's association and business dealings with known mafia figures was not limited to his Atlantic City projects. In New York City, several of his buildings were built by S&A Concrete Co., a concern partly owned by Anthony "Fat Tony" Salerno, the boss of the Genovese crime family.

In addition to this business relationship, Trump and Salerno were*both represented*by high-power attorney Roy Cohn. In his book, Barrett cites an anonymous source who confirms that on at least one occasion Trump and Salerno had a sit-down in Cohn's apartment. Trump has denied this claim in the past.*How can the candidate who promises to secure the border and bring good jobs back to America explain having farmed out good-paying jobs to a bunch of illegal immigrants?*Is it reasonable to assume that Trump had no idea that S&A was run by Salerno's Genovese*borgatawhen Trump's own attorney was so closely linked to that organization?

After all, if Trump (who likes to point out that he has "one of the highest IQs") is as smart as he would have everyone believe, how could he have been so naive?*Another issue that needs to be addressed in Trump's New York operations is the use of undocumented Polish workers to demolish the Bonwit Teller building, which made way for the Trump Tower. Only a handful of union workers from Housewreckers Local 95 were employed on the site, the vast majority were illegal Polish alien workers, toiling under inhumane conditions, and wildly underpaid. Trump and his associates werefound guilty*in 1991 of conspiring to avoid paying pension and welfare fund contributions.

Two questions arise from this. First, how did Trump get away with using such obvious scab labor without raising the ire of local 95? More importantly, how can the candidate who promises to secure the border and bring good jobs back to America explain having farmed out good-paying jobs, legally entitled to American workers, instead to a bunch of illegal immigrants? When the rubber hit the road Donald Trump didn't walk the walk, he lined his pockets and sold out American workers.

Is it possible that Trump was simply involved in an industry which in the early 1980s was so infiltrated by the mafia that he couldn't help but have tangential ties? Could this myriad of associations, points of contact, and shared affiliations with known mobsters just be the price of doing business in that business at that time? Sure. And if Trump were just a private citizen, businessman, and reality TV star, he would be under no obligation to explain any of this. But he isn’t. He is the frontrunner for the Republican nomination for president of the United States.*



Quoting Sinny:

I've only just heard word that Trump can be traced back to Political Pedophilia via Epstein, he was recorded in Epsteins 'little black book', which has be coined the 'Holy Grail' for anyone wishing to uncover who was attending his illegal and underage sex orgies.

Makes sense, considering he's bosom buddies with the Clintons when the cameras aren't rolling.
And he certainly has enough money to play in that game.

Will place relevant info in my Savile thread.


Quoting Trump:
"I've known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy,'' Trump told New York magazine in a 2002 profile of Epstein written three years before Epstein began to be investigated. "He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it -- Jeffrey enjoys his social life."

Since then:

Trump's attorney Alan Garten told VICE News last week that the presidential candidate had "no relationship" with Epstein, and only knew him because Epstein was a member of Mar-A-Lago, Trump's private club and residence in Palm Beach.

"A lot of people hung out there, including Jeffrey Epstein," Garten said. "That is the only connection."

Mark Epstein, Jeffrey's brother, testified in 2009 that Trump flew on Jeffrey's private jet at least once.


The private jet which is called Lolita Express.

Lolita is a 1962 British-American black comedy-drama film[3] directed by Stanley Kubrick based on the novel of the same title by Vladimir Nabokov, about a middle-aged man who becomes obsessed with a teenage girl

Kubrick .. look no further than Eye's Wide Shut.

Judge a man by the company which he keeps
http://freedom-articles.toolsforfreedom.com/trump-and-pedophilia-epstein-black-book/

Or maybe his 169 federal law suits (Including attempted rape)
http://lawnewz.com/high-profile/exclusive-inside-the-donald-trump-sexual-assault-lawsuit/

What a creep - and he frequently makes inappropriate comments about his daughter.. Like, that he'd be fucking her if he could.

It's what they do, why would he be any different?

And just who keeps plastering him in that awful orange, all over his fucking pedophile face
 
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[MENTION=13730]PintoBean[/MENTION] Take Trump University as an example that one was pure snake oil. It was a never a university.

Trump University is currently the defendant in three lawsuits — two class-action lawsuits filed in California, and one filed in New York by then-attorney general Eric Schneiderman, who told CNN’s New Day in 2013: “We started looking at Trump University and discovered that it was a classic bait-and-switch scheme. It was a scam, starting with the fact that it was not a university.”

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/432010/trump-university-scam

We could into overpriced steaks and vodka too. Trump has mainly marketed himself, he is a relentless self promoter and the image is what he uses to scam unwitting people into buying and investing in his products.

Here's another quote from National Review:

Trump’s record as a businessman is hardly a recommendation for the highest office in the land. For all his success, Trump inherited a real-estate fortune from his father. Few of us will ever have the experience, as Trump did, of having Daddy-O bail out our struggling enterprise with an illegal loan in the form of casino chips. Trump’s primary work long ago became less about building anything than about branding himself and tending to his celebrity through a variety of entertainment ventures, from WWE to his reality-TV show, The Apprentice. His business record reflects the often dubious norms of the milieu: using eminent domain to condemn the property of others; buying the good graces of politicians — including many Democrats — with donations.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/430137/donald-trump-conservative-movement-menace

Over priced sfeak and vodka.... can you provide more insight into this please? If I have a product I can sell it for whatever I like just as you can make the choice not to buy it.
 
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Jydske-rear.jpg


#DonaldRumpForPresident​
 
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Over priced sfeak and vodka.... can you provide more insight into this please? If I have a product I can sell it for whatever I like just as you can make the choice not to buy it.

Except when its fraud and you are misrepresenting what your are selling, like Trump U

I agree with Paul Ryan - Trump latest comments are "textbook racism". If he think the judge should recuse himself because of his ethnic heritage this is just pure racism and nothing else. Now Trump claims his meaning has been misunderstood.

“We’re building a wall. He’s a Mexican. We’re building a wall between here and Mexico. . . . This judge is giving us unfair rulings.”

How can these comments be misunderstood?
 
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