[INFJ] How do you 'train' your cognitive functions?

[Ginny]

(P.S. flow-state? Csikszentmihalyi ?)

If you're asking what I mean with this it is to me a sort of (almost ineffable) state wherein whatever is at work just seemingly does it on its own. It's like you're completely immersed in it without any other influence/function at play and time begins to lose meaning. Nothing else exists but that one thing.

About that "Te-Meditation":

I guess it depends on which system description you're following. I have heard Te also being described as "reasons of the tribe". As far as I can tell, it is a kind of cause-and-effect function and concerned with effectivity and efficiency, which would explain the fact-oriented thinking. Even to me it is still fairly unfamiliar, being the IxFJ blind-spot. An xxTJ/P would probably be best at explaining it.

 

[bonfire]

I use writing (or even speaking) as a tool to sort my thoughts, because they tend to stay afloat until I can put them into words. It's like they don't properly manifest or become truth until I bring them out in some way. It can lead me to new considerations/conclusions in the process of writing, too. Sometimes it's still hard to find the right words or expressions too, something I ought to keep a better overview of in the future as well. So in the sense of having an "overview", @bonfire may be right in saying it has to do with Ne. But perhaps we should consider that there is also a different relation to words and word uses in different types, before claiming that someone is more or less eloquent (sorry, "claiming" is a strong word, I don't mean to accuse you of anything)? I think the capacity or potential is there for anyone, but it's the way of thinking (and a couple of other factors) that have an impact on expression. Ni (or even Si) could perhaps be used to be precise in expressions, but the way of thinking (function use) may make it look differently because of how the register is ordered in the mind, be it associative, conceptual, analytical or any other way.

Ne is about grasping for the underlying connections or impressions associated with the objects, which strongly associates with language. For example, when Ne perceives, it refers to its idea surrounding it. There can be a lot of ideas such as "red, blood, bottom, flower petal", etc. which generate a sort of objective viewpoint or something most people tend to agree, even though they don't know why. Therefore, NP types are fast and efficient in finding the best nuance to explain a certain subject. This phenomena is a good example:



I'm not claiming that INTPs are more eloquent than ISTPs. There is a correlation between Ne and eloquence, so I was just giving you a comparison between Ti+Ne and Ti+Se. In reality, it appears to the the case. If you read a lot ISTPs' celebrities' quotes, It's frequently full of something along the line with "I don't like talking/ speeches/ long sentences". I know an ISTP who is a theoretical physicist, a very intelligent man, but also has a difficult time in explaining a simple theory to his students. Compared to Einestein's "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Well, yeah of course, because he's an INTP.

I don't doubt that there is the possibility for the INFJ to reach a flow-state by using Se as well, during the performance of an activity. An INFJ may have Se as the inferior function but could still be an exceptional dancer, for instance. It is probably no less efficient or effective than mindfulness meditation or walking meditation (which I just thought may "train" Si and Se, respectively... what are your thoughts? might depend on how you define mindful *lol*).

I didn't say that INFJs reach a flow-state through Se. INFJs' (or any other types') flow-state will always be their dominant function, which is Ni in INFJ's case. What I meant is we need balance. Ni-doms can overuse Ni and that can cause one to be too arbitrary and irrevocably tunnel-visioned (Hitler, for example). In this case we need Se to counter it. Se is great in providing "raw" experience, so that Ni can sift them through their filter of impressions, making Ni more well-informed and in tune with reality. I don't have a problem with how one defines "mindful" though. You can find mindfulness through several activities, like writing, creative projects, housework, etc. I just mentioned about what works for me. But to each their own I suppose.

 

[Impact Character]

If you're asking what I mean with this it is to me a sort of (almost ineffable) state wherein whatever is at work just seemingly does it on its own. It's like you're completely immersed in it without any other influence/function at play and time begins to lose meaning. Nothing else exists but that one thing.

this is pretty much what the flow theory is, too ^^ the key to a happy life and the perfect state for learning/growing effect. so... concerning the topic: ...whatever activity it should be best executed within the flow channel (challenge-skill-ratio)

 

[bonfire]

That being said, I agree that anyone can use their innate functions to develop their language skills and eloquence. Actually struggling with language can be the sign of developed Ti, in that you're looking for ways to reach to the accuracy and try to be precise. "Finding the right word" is an INFJ daily struggle.

 

[Ginny]

I'm not claiming that INTPs are more eloquent than ISTPs. There is a correlation between Ne and eloquence, so I was just giving you a comparison between Ti+Ne and Ti+Se. In reality, it appears to the the case. If you read a lot ISTPs' celebrities' quotes, It's frequently full of something along the line with "I don't like talking/ speeches/ long sentences". I know an ISTP who is a theoretical physicist, a very intelligent man, but also has a difficult time in explaining a simple theory to his students. Compared to Einestein's "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Well, yeah of course, because he's an INTP.

That's a good way of putting it, thank you. I did say that "claim" is too strong a word, so I'm sorry if you were irritated or offended by that word choice.
It is interesting that you put Einstein as INTP, because when I read about him in a work of Heisenberg, I would have typed him as INTJ. But I guess this is a discussion for another thread

I didn't say that INFJs reach a flow-state through Se. INFJs' (or any other types') flow-state will always be their dominant function, which is Ni in INFJ's case. What I meant is we need balance. Ni-doms can overuse Ni and that can cause one to be too arbitrary and irrevocably tunnel-visioned (Hitler, for example). In this case we need Se to counter it. Se is great in providing "raw" experience, so that Ni can sift them through their filter of impressions, making Ni more well-informed and in tune with reality. I don't have a problem with how one defines "mindful" though. You can find mindfulness through several activities, like writing, creative projects, housework, etc. I just mentioned about what works for me. But to each their own I suppose.

Again, I'm sorry. This part was actually my own theorising, I wasn't referring to or criticising something you said. But yes, I agree, each person is different in their experiences and perspectives. Thank you for adding your own in this context.

this is pretty much what the flow theory is, too ^^ the key to a happy life and the perfect state for learning/growing effect. so... concerning the topic: ...whatever activity it should be best executed within the flow channel (challenge-skill-ratio)

That's a cool find! I didn't know such a theory existed

 

[Pin]

Si = Past
Se = Present
Ni = Future
Ne = Alternate reality

 

[Rowan Tree]

Ne = Alternate reality

Counterfactuality!

 

[Sandie33]

Si = Past
Se = Present
Ni = Future
Ne = Alternate reality

Counterfactuality

Watch the film How to Train Your Dragon. Then watch the Never Ending Story. Cognition will make perfect sense

 

[Zola]

Ni - Trust my intuitions. Give them time. Keep them to myself. Don't let other people make me doubt.
Se - Zazen, a.k.a. walking meditation. Use my five senses and turn off internal thought and words.
Fe - Notice and care about other people's feelings, but don't let them inside myself. Stay calm.
Ti - Take pleasure in understanding how everything works. Don't get rushed into decisions.

 

[Ginny]

Watch the film How to Train Your Dragon. Then watch the Never Ending Story. Cognition will make perfect sense

YES! Absolutely! I learned a lot about the functions in practice watching HTTYD and Dragons