Trusting with a higher power

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I find this somewhat easy to do at times, but not completely at all times. This is part of my problem here.

Also, as a mother, everything takes on a whole new and deeper more important meaning. I just don't want to give everything up to a God, sit back and watch my world change drastically around me when I take my hands off the wheel and let God do the driving. If it were just me, there would be much less to risk, but this is mainly about my kids and what I can give them to be the best parent in these hard times.

To let go of control and leave up to even another person, nevermind a "God" that I can't ask direct questions to and get direct answers back, it would mean Not being able to plan for anything and leave things (our lives) up to pure chance. If I let go and things get broken and my children hurt more, then I will have regrets that I should have done things differently. Like I should have not have gone against my intuition etc. I hope at least a few of you understand me! Sigh, LOL.



Edit: I just want to acknowledge how difficult I know I sound. Despite my sounding as though I'm to a degree, challenging what others may be posting, I really do truly appreciate your taking the time to share your thoughts and ideas with me. I'm taking everything to heart and consideration. Sorry for sounding so hopeless, I'm just a bit scared I guess! xx Ria.
 
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I understand you! This is the hardest part of my faith and it took me a long time to become comfortable with. Actually, my mom went through those exact feelings when meand my sister were born. Giving up control of your life to a hiher power is scary no doubt, but it has given me peace and closure about the harder things I've gone through in my life.

What made it easier for me to get to where I am now was knowing that I really don't have much control over the things that happen in the world. You can't control a natural disaster or a freak accident. But when I leave it to God and trust Him as someone who wants the best for me, whether I can see it or not at the time, it gives me a sense of peace.

Also, I don't think God wants us to leave everything up to chance, but rather, He wants you to do what He asks you to in alignment with His perfect plan for you. I guess you could say that the faith I have is really more like trust.
Just my take on life at this point.
 
I understand you! This is the hardest part of my faith and it took me a long time to become comfortable with. Actually, my mom went through those exact feelings when meand my sister were born. Giving up control of your life to a hiher power is scary no doubt, but it has given me peace and closure about the harder things I've gone through in my life.

What made it easier for me to get to where I am now was knowing that I really don't have much control over the things that happen in the world. You can't control a natural disaster or a freak accident. But when I leave it to God and trust Him as someone who wants the best for me, whether I can see it or not at the time, it gives me a sense of peace.

Also, I don't think God wants us to leave everything up to chance, but rather, He wants you to do what He asks you to in alignment with His perfect plan for you. I guess you could say that the faith I have is really more like trust.
Just my take on life at this point.


Thank you for this, it puts a great deal into perspective when I can't figure out how to put it into words. I have at times felt as though this bad luck is all part of his plan for punnishment for any sins I have ever made in my life. I think this is a big part of why I feel inferior too, because I was introduced to God by the Fear of God, rather than by the Love of God. It's good to be reminded that I am loved, and that my best interests are always there first in the eyes of something Universally more powerful than myself.
 
I don't mean to offend or anything, my posts are in the context of someone that wants to give himself permission to believe in something other than concrete but doesn't know how.

Sorry. :) Didn't mean to respond with a snap response.

Thing is, faith is not the easiest thing to explain. Those who believe have a defined sense of belief. It's not something that can be simply argued for or against. For many of us, we sense in our hearts, minds, spirits, that God simply exists outside of our own perceptions or feelings because He has placed that sense of awareness or knowing in us in different ways to let us know that it is real, and not just a fantasy.

If we say we know, then people will ask us to justify our belief which suggests that it is something which only exists in our minds or thoughts, and is not real. But faith requires that you believe and trust even if it doesn't seem to make sense because you are trusting not just any higher power but One who has reason and purpose, and who works to do what's best whether or not we know or see this with our own eyes.
 
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Notwithstanding what you hope to be true, what reason would you have for believing that such a higher power exists that cares about your well being? Why is this reasoning so much more compelling than the possibility of people merely being subjected to luck and coincidence?
 
Notwithstanding what you hope to be true, what reason would you have for believing that such a higher power exists that cares about your well being? Why is this reasoning so much more compelling than the possibility of people merely being subjected to luck and coincidence?

Luck has a statistical limit. By lucks odds I should be dead...
 
That is a misnomer. Many times in my life I have not placed absolute trust in god and still tried to make things in what I wanted and needed them to be. In the back of my mind I had faith it would work out, but not completely. How god works is not black and white by any strech of the word, in fact it is quite the reverse. If you have good intentions and keep working to what you know is right (truly, not a masked want), god will keep you on the right path forward, even if it isn't linear. God is the ultimate just force of the universe, it is your intention that god watches.

I think I understand what you are saying and you are right. In fact when we say that we are exactly where we are supposed to be, that is regardless of our choices or our trust in a higher power. Somehow God brings us where we are supposed to be even if we don't have full trust in Him. However, when we get out of his way and have full trust in Him it makes it just that much easier, which is what I am trying to tell Ria.
 
Here are my thoughts now Ria. Sorry, but like I said last night just wasn't going to work. My initial thoughts after reading this thread are "great, this has turned into a religious thread" which I avoid like the plague. But you are my friend and in need of advice, so I will see if my strange views will help you at all.

As far as "God" goes, I was raised Catholic but do not hold to those dogmatic, archaic beliefs at all anymore. People worship the bible like the golden idol in the Tale of Moses and treat Jesus like God, not his son and messenger like he supposedly was. You can listen to someone talk religion for hours about "Jesus" and never mention God. I'm not interested in a man, or the writings and fictions of men on "God", in a spiritual sense anyways. Thought they contain wise thoughts, they are not holy and beyond question. Nor should they be taken literally. If you bother to comment on my above words, don't expect a reply, I will not debate religion. I just wanted my view out there since it will help understand my answer to Ria. At heart, I am a spiritualist like she is.

I don't believe you can have a "personal" relationship with God like some of these 12-Step programs (and religions) encourage--sorry! It's nice to assign a human facade to the power we feel oversees the cosmos, but it's doesn't really make sense does it? To even say "he" or "she" when talking about the thing we call God is putting boundaries on something we can't possibly fathom in our small ape brains. The fear of death makes us do many insane, terrible, and illogical things.

So to simply say put your trust in him, is a lazy and baseless statement. This higher power that flows through us and the universe is not looking at us individually, so there is no personal care involved here. Rather, we as the specks of tiny individualistic consciousness should seek to understand what and how we interact with the universe as a whole. How do we affect it and how does it affect us. This is a general statement that covers too much I know, but my point here is it's not a personal relationship. It can't be. That's like saying you should have a personal relationship with an Ant. The best we can to is get a sense of the feel, flow, and interaction of the universe. Of the power that controls and contains it (and us). When we are in touch with that, then we will feel some sense of peace and purpose.

I feel I am getting better at doing this as I get older. We need to shed the trapping of our culture and our limited thinking as much as we can. I've always been a "lucky" person. What does that mean? Good things seem to fall my way more often than for many other people. I've often wondered on this. Is is just luck and probabilities? Is it karma? Why me? I think it has something to do with the energy we maintain within ourselves. Even in my darkest times, I have at my core a positive belief (a positive energy if you will). In the realm of the spiritual, who is to say that like doesn't attract like, and that this is the basis for good things coming our (my) way. I know when things go bad they often seem to pile on. Likewise with the good things I find. Just food for thought here Ria.

My advice is more straightforward I guess. Work on keeping your inner spiritual fires stoked and positive, rely on your intuition, trust when it says you can do so, stay strong in your heart and believe. Bravery is going on when you want to lay down and cry. You do have the heart of a warrior that beats next to the poets heart in you. Use them both and don't give up. Peace my friend and remember those of us here are with you.
 
Here are my thoughts now Ria. Sorry, but like I said last night just wasn't going to work. My initial thoughts after reading this thread are "great, this has turned into a religious thread" which I avoid like the plague. But you are my friend and in need of advice, so I will see if my strange views will help you at all.

As far as "God" goes, I was raised Catholic but do not hold to those dogmatic, archaic beliefs at all anymore. People worship the bible like the golden idol in the Tale of Moses and treat Jesus like God, not his son and messenger like he supposedly was. You can listen to someone talk religion for hours about "Jesus" and never mention God. I'm not interested in a man, or the writings and fictions of men on "God", in a spiritual sense anyways. Thought they contain wise thoughts, they are not holy and beyond question. Nor should they be taken literally. If you bother to comment on my above words, don't expect a reply, I will not debate religion. I just wanted my view out there since it will help understand my answer to Ria. At heart, I am a spiritualist like she is.

I don't believe you can have a "personal" relationship with God like some of these 12-Step programs (and religions) encourage--sorry! It's nice to assign a human facade to the power we feel oversees the cosmos, but it's doesn't really make sense does it? To even say "he" or "she" when talking about the thing we call God is putting boundaries on something we can't possibly fathom in our small ape brains. The fear of death makes us do many insane, terrible, and illogical things.

So to simply say put your trust in him, is a lazy and baseless statement. This higher power that flows through us and the universe is not looking at us individually, so there is no personal care involved here. Rather, we as the specks of tiny individualistic consciousness should seek to understand what and how we interact with the universe as a whole. How do we affect it and how does it affect us. This is a general statement that covers too much I know, but my point here is it's not a personal relationship. It can't be. That's like saying you should have a personal relationship with an Ant. The best we can to is get a sense of the feel, flow, and interaction of the universe. Of the power that controls and contains it (and us). When we are in touch with that, then we will feel some sense of peace and purpose.

I feel I am getting better at doing this as I get older. We need to shed the trapping of our culture and our limited thinking as much as we can. I've always been a "lucky" person. What does that mean? Good things seem to fall my way more often than for many other people. I've often wondered on this. Is is just luck and probabilities? Is it karma? Why me? I think it has something to do with the energy we maintain within ourselves. Even in my darkest times, I have at my core a positive belief (a positive energy if you will). In the realm of the spiritual, who is to say that like doesn't attract like, and that this is the basis for good things coming our (my) way. I know when things go bad they often seem to pile on. Likewise with the good things I find. Just food for thought here Ria.

My advice is more straightforward I guess. Work on keeping your inner spiritual fires stoked and positive, rely on your intuition, trust when it says you can do so, stay strong in your heart and believe. Bravery is going on when you want to lay down and cry. You do have the heart of a warrior that beats next to the poets heart in you. Use them both and don't give up. Peace my friend and remember those of us here are with you.


^^ This ^^

Keith thanks so very much for posting this as it resides closer to how I feel I can believe with my sincerity and honesty. I have always believed that my intuition has only let me down when I have not listened to it, and then it is actually me letting my intuition or "myself" down. I have always felt that universal energy flow through me, but at times have felt it leave me when I have been in bad situations. This is also part of my quest, to discover through my "Spewage", just how much more there is to know and understand about what is going on benieth the surface of my conciousness.

*hugs* my friend :)
 
So, you're a Pantheist.

If you must put a name to it, yes that fits the closest. Also this:


"Heaven and I were created together, and all things and I are one."--Zhuangzi


Taoism too is in line with my beliefs, though I am not as familiar with all it's writings as I would like to be.
 
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^^ This ^^

Keith thanks so very much for posting this as it resides closer to how I feel I can believe with my sincerity and honesty. I have always believed that my intuition has only let me down when I have not listened to it, and then it is actually me letting my intuition or "myself" down. I have always felt that universal energy flow through me, but at times have felt it leave me when I have been in bad situations. This is also part of my quest, to discover through my "Spewage", just how much more there is to know and understand about what is going on benieth the surface of my conciousness.

*hugs* my friend :)

I am glad my post helped you in some small way Ria. I feel our views are close on such things and I wanted you to know you are not alone in how you feel. *hugs back*
 
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I was introduced to twelve step programs while desperately trying to help someone with a destructive addiction. I even spent some time in a program for co-dependency. From the experience I gleaned some helpful concepts that prompted me to change some of my own counterproductive behaviors. I have always been a rather anxious person. In an attempt to assure positive outcomes, I became an extreme perfectionist. Unfortunately as I got older and assumed more responsibilities, my thoroughness ceased to bring me comfort. I had less time to devote to the details so instead my perfectionism resulted in another source of anxiety. The serenity prayer, often recited at the end of a twelve step meeting, helped me tremendously. Once I was able to identify some things as completely beyond my influence, there wasn
 
I was introduced to twelve step programs while desperately trying to help someone with a destructive addiction. I even spent some time in a program for co-dependency. From the experience I gleaned some helpful concepts that prompted me to change some of my own counterproductive behaviors. I have always been a rather anxious person. In an attempt to assure positive outcomes, I became an extreme perfectionist. Unfortunately as I got older and assumed more responsibilities, my thoroughness ceased to bring me comfort. I had less time to devote to the details so instead my perfectionism resulted in another source of anxiety. The serenity prayer, often recited at the end of a twelve step meeting, helped me tremendously. Once I was able to identify some things as completely beyond my influence, there wasn’t as strong a compulsion to exert control over every situation. I would recite my own version of the serenity prayer. I don’t know how much my higher power intervened on my behalf but the prayer definitely reminded me what I needed to do. But I’m lucky. I believe in a higher power that’s got my back so I’m sure this made handing over the reins much easier.

I would like to understand your faith better. You describe your higher power as, Does this Oneness include the sense that we are all in this together? Can you trust that because of this connection, all will be well? If something is outside of your control, can you conceive of someone else stepping in? Not because you have failed but because of Karma. From what I have read on your blog, you seem like a very caring person. You have used your energy to help others. Because of this Universal Oneness shouldn’t that energy flow back to you when needed?

Maybe I’m totally off base. But if not, maybe you can reword the concepts presented in the twelve step program so they resonate with you. I’ve forgotten much of what was presented but my rendition of the serenity prayer continues to help me daily. Can you take what will help you grow and leave the rest?


Norwich I'm really happy you posted here, thanks very much for sharing your thoughts. I will try and answer your questions:

The Universal Oneness means that we all exsist with a life foarce, this includes plants, animals, humans and anything else upon this planet. (also in space and time etc). What happens here during our stay upon this earth was meant to happen. To some degree we have control (due to the choices we make) and as well we do not have control (due to what others choose to do). I understand that I cannot micromanage others.

I believe we make choices based on many things. Energy plays a huge part in this. Energy that resides in us in thought, word and deed. I believe we are under the influence of many underlying elements that we cannot see. How we feel often controls behavior, and the ripple effect of our behavior affects everything around us for ever after. The domino effect if you will. Universal Oneness is not out for the happiness of me, of whomever specifically, rather Universal Oneness should not have expectations of having good things returned, even when given. If I give only to recieve, then I have made it all about "me" instead of all about what is outside of me which is my main focus and insentive. To make this world better, by giving the best of me to it.

Universal Oneness is for the greater good of the world. Me and my life and the lives of my children are just parts of the play; we may not be the lead roles as we may spend most of our time in the background working to keep things going in a good direction with eyes wide open and love available to the rest of what goes on on the stage. Universal Oneness is made up of Greater beings such as God, to some, there are other greater beings that work along side with God. I believe there is secret wars going on at all times and there always has been, between governments and illuminati etc. that we are not supposed to be aware of as it would have all things as we know it, change in a drastic way and have us all face our world in shock of everything we thought was reality, to not be so. I see my role on this Earth as a considerate and contiencious person who tries to teach through example, and with love and acceptance and understanding of others. To see behavior as a message of what goes on belieth the person.

Do I believe that I will be taken care of? Yes to the degree of I will continue to survive but maybe my quality of life would be continuousely difficult. If I have been designed mentally and emotionally to accept my role in life to be this, then I have also accepted that I have been armed in awareness and that my simple yet not so simple task now, is to not react emotionally to when things go wrong to both myself and others, by others. To find peace and serenity in the serenity prayer, still is a difficult thing for me. It's difficult because it means that I have to accept things that are hurtful when this is the very thing I am always trying to assist with preventing. These are the things that I cannot change, as the serenity prayer states. The end is to ask for the difference between what I can change and what I cannot change. This is what I am seeking when I ask the question of "Where and when do we stop and God begins" and vice versa.

I suppose I believe this because this is the way I had to teach myself to think when I was very small. I developed certain stratagies and coping mechanisms that are not helpful to me now that I am an adult. For a child to lose trust in their parents, in their teachers and peers, is a terrible thing. It means that they will only trust that bad things will happen, and that they may not be important enough to be loved and cared for in the way that they need to be, and this is why I believe I am the way I am. Despite not having clear memories about too many things, these residual beliefs remain strong within me, and I have been trying to do a lot of soul searching to come up with just as simple an insight as this. It might be so clear and obvious to anyone else who say watched me grow up, but for me because I lived it, it's too close to home to see objectively all of the time. Only sometimes when I go off on a Spewage rampage such as this thread! :D

In short I suppose I believe I am unloveable and unworthy to be taken seriousely and looked after by something bigger than life itself. At the same time, I am doing this very same job as the Higher beings in my own tiny contributions as we all are. I only believe I was chosen to be one of those individuals who was placed here to help others, not to be helped if that makes sense. If I had it too easy, I may not have developed any insights from pain, and I may be ignorant to others suffering. I guess what was meant to be, happened, and I don't have to like what is now. I just want to believe that I will be given a break from my part of the play, and just switch off and do some painting of the backdrops for a while, instead of watching, helping and stratagizing myself and others on the stage to keep the ol' ship afloat!

Just because I am helping that ship stay afloat, does not mean good things need to come back my way. To simply be able to make this world an easier place to live for us all, is reward enough. This is why I have a hard time giving up my post as looking after my life, and others in my life, such as my children.

Did this make any sense?
 
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Did this make any sense?
Yes, quite a lot of sense. I can understand how experiences of childhood influence beliefs. Because the evidence seemed to indicate that I was a tremendous burden to my mother and of no importance to my father, I developed some pretty interesting ways of viewing the world. I also spent many years trying to "earn" the love of those close to me. I'm still trying to fight injustice.

Thank you for telling me more about your faith. I think I have a much better understanding now. Your determination to make the world a better place by giving the best of yourself is admirable. You said,
maybe my quality of life would be continuousely difficult. If I have been designed mentally and emotionally to accept my role in life to be this, then I have also accepted that I have been armed in awareness and that my simple yet not so simple task now, is to not react emotionally
Are you saying that if you are destined for more hardship, you want to face it without reacting to the emotions of sadness or anger that may result from the challenge? If I am understanding you correctly, that it is a very mature attitude. I'm feeling a bit ridiculous for responding as I did originally. Maybe I was projecting from my own experiences.
I just want to believe that I will be given a break from my part of the play, and just switch off and do some painting of the backdrops for a while, instead of watching, helping and stratagizing myself and others on the stage to keep the ol' ship afloat!
This doesn't seem like to much to ask. Everyone needs a chance to rest and recharge.
Just because I am helping that ship stay afloat, does not mean good things need to come back my way. To simply be able to make this world an easier place to live for us all, is reward enough. This is why I have a hard time giving up my post as looking after my life, and others in my life, such as my children.
Here I am a bit confused. Do you feel by switching off and doing some painting in the backdrops you would be giving up the post of looking after you and your children? Or are you looking for that fine line between abandoning your post and taking care of yourself? Maybe I'm projecting again. With two small children and the a fore mentioned control issues, I'm forever loosing sight of that fine line.
In short I suppose I believe I am unloveable and unworthy to be taken seriousely and looked after by something bigger than life itself.
This is very sad. I wish that you could see yourself as you truly are. But yet I understand how this mindset developed out of the pain you have endured. :hug:
 
Trust a hard thing to give if it's been taken from you. Being wronged by others make hard to helped by other.

It is my personal beliefe that trusting God is the hardest thing to do as a Christian, I know full grown men whom are far wiser then me who've struggled with it there entire life. Even more so it may be the most painfull of all the virtues to come by in your life, If you don't believe me ask job.


With that being said, it is also the most rewarding of virtues in Christianity. There is a grand sense of peace that come from knowing that everything is taken care of, that God has everything covered. It would be like watching the worst possible storm raging outside of your window, and yet knowing that a beutifull sunset is waiting behind the clouds.


Truthfuly, it's freedom, maybe that's why it's in the twelve step process. Freedom from worry, regret, pain. Freedom from the past, the moment and the future. It is indeed a wonderfull feeling.
 
Yes, quite a lot of sense. I can understand how experiences of childhood influence beliefs. Because the evidence seemed to indicate that I was a tremendous burden to my mother and of no importance to my father, I developed some pretty interesting ways of viewing the world. I also spent many years trying to "earn" the love of those close to me. I'm still trying to fight injustice.

Thank you for telling me more about your faith. I think I have a much better understanding now. Your determination to make the world a better place by giving the best of yourself is admirable. You said, Are you saying that if you are destined for more hardship, you want to face it without reacting to the emotions of sadness or anger that may result from the challenge? If I am understanding you correctly, that it is a very mature attitude. I'm feeling a bit ridiculous for responding as I did originally. Maybe I was projecting from my own experiences.
This doesn't seem like to much to ask. Everyone needs a chance to rest and recharge.
Here I am a bit confused. Do you feel by switching off and doing some painting in the backdrops you would be giving up the post of looking after you and your children? Or are you looking for that fine line between abandoning your post and taking care of yourself? Maybe I'm projecting again. With two small children and the a fore mentioned control issues, I'm forever loosing sight of that fine line.
This is very sad. I wish that you could see yourself as you truly are. But yet I understand how this mindset developed out of the pain you have endured. :hug:

No, lol... it meant that instead of manning my post of assuming a whole ton of responsibility, I could just relax and turn my back on the world and do a little painting or "switching off" the caring button for a while. :) Let the stage do as it may, and try not to worry about things falling apart without me there.
 
Trust a hard thing to give if it's been taken from you. Being wronged by others make hard to helped by other.

It is my personal beliefe that trusting God is the hardest thing to do as a Christian, I know full grown men whom are far wiser then me who've struggled with it there entire life. Even more so it may be the most painfull of all the virtues to come by in your life, If you don't believe me ask job.


With that being said, it is also the most rewarding of virtues in Christianity. There is a grand sense of peace that come from knowing that everything is taken care of, that God has everything covered. It would be like watching the worst possible storm raging outside of your window, and yet knowing that a beutifull sunset is waiting behind the clouds.


Truthfuly, it's freedom, maybe that's why it's in the twelve step process. Freedom from worry, regret, pain. Freedom from the past, the moment and the future. It is indeed a wonderfull feeling.


Thanks Barnabas, this takes away some of my feelings of failure in this struggle. Thanks for verifying and always being a friend :)
 
No, lol... it meant that instead of manning my post of assuming a whole ton of responsibility, I could just relax and turn my back on the world and do a little painting or "switching off" the caring button for a while. :) Let the stage do as it may, and try not to worry about things falling apart without me there.

Surrendering, and turning things over to God doesn't mean "switching" off anything. You don't have to turn your back or stop caring. What it does mean is that we continue to do the footwork, but we don't worry about the result. The result is up to God. We ask for guidance on a regular basis, and our higher power shows us the way. If you are unsure about your course of action just ask yourself, what would love do?
 
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Thanks Barnabas, this takes away some of my feelings of failure in this struggle. Thanks for verifying and always being a friend :)

It's what I'm here for.
 
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