The Nice Guy

[Bird]

I'm just going to say this and get it out of the way:
I hate the friend zone. There is nothing else that
irritates me more than hearing complaints about
being friend zoned.

You're complaining because someone wants to be
your friend? What the fuck.
I seriously have two friends and I barely even talk
to them. I don't even know what I would do if someone
wanted to "friend zone" me and actually be my friend
instead of just wanting to fuck me.
I'd probably bawl hysterically from joy.

 

[Claridon]

and actually be my friend
instead of just wanting to fuck me.
I'd probably bawl hysterically from joy.

I can understand how that would make you feel strongly on the subject; now makes sense.

 

[Number B]

All the time, usually I get tired of the emotional garbage they call "problems". They often times instead of wanting to solve it just want to be heard meaning the problem presists. I always end up breaking contact because I can't be bothered with yet another female who tells me about her negative emotions(a.k.a let her S.O solve it for her).

 

[Billy]

I'm new to this so if there is another thread like this already, please direct me, but I looked through a few of the pages already.

Are any INFJ guys often the "Nice Guy" who becomes best friends with girls, and are able to talk to them in a real way and listen to their problems, and talk about feelings, and then realize they are waist deep in the friend zone with no way of getting out of it.

I have, obviously. I guess I'm wondering if this is common for other INFJs......

my 1st few forays into the dating world were like that, I caught on quick though. Typically the best way to avoid being friend zoned, is to just be up front about your intentions instead of lying via silence. When I learned that and how to take a shot and take rejection if I got rejected, I never got friend zoned again, unless I was putting someone into a friend zone. But even then I try to be merciful by clarifying my relationship with everyone.

 

[Billy]

I'm just going to say this and get it out of the way:
I hate the friend zone. There is nothing else that
irritates me more than hearing complaints about
being friend zoned.

You're complaining because someone wants to be
your friend? What the fuck.
I seriously have two friends and I barely even talk
to them. I don't even know what I would do if someone
wanted to "friend zone" me and actually be my friend
instead of just wanting to fuck me.
I'd probably bawl hysterically from joy.

No, complaining that they didnt have the gusto to put a move out and instead tried to use friendship as a way to get a girlfriend under false pretenses. And when it didnt work, the girl is obviously a beotch who doesn't see whats in front of her, even though i'm certain there were many cases in which she suggested or hinted at them about their intentions and they vehemently denied them.

 

[Diana]

I'm a girl, so no. But I've been the girl version of that which is "just one of the guys".

 

[Trifoilum]

It's weird, tbh; wait, disclaimer; I went to the guys. >_>; So I have no idea about how boys and girls interact with each other in this sense, but;

Since when kindness, compassion, and good manners becomes something so precious girls have to offer their heart and body and mind and sex to them? Not that it's not worthy; I believe it's a good pinnacle of human sanity and proof of a good heart, it's just.....don't you think to attract someone, you need something 'more'?

However; and please do correct me if I'm wrong; people who moan about friendzoned or being a Nice Guy seems to compare themselves, consciously or not, to the Non Nice Guy or the Jerk Ass Popular Jock with Tons of Women?

Why not compare to the saner population of males out there?

 

[Life.is.beautiful]

Bahahahahaha
I like this community. Thank you for the welcomes.

Claridon, I wasn't scared away, I was just not near a computer.

I agree that's it's not right to be mad that someone wants to be your friend. I also agree that it's mainly the friendzoned person's fault for pussing out and not sharing their emotions when they should, and not giving them any cues that they actually really like them.

I have enjoyed being in the friendzone a lot of the time, because being close to people is more important than having a SO who you can physically pleasure yourself with.

I'm not trying to complain about it, I was just curious.
And sometimes Girls enjoy sort of flirting, and then backing off..... I would think because they want someone who they can talk to about their problems, when they can't talk to their SO

 

[Billy]

I would think because they want someone who they can talk to about their problems, when they can't talk to their SO

A girl in a relationship doesnt need a male friend to talk to if her relationship isnt doomed to failure, communication is key, a guy who tries to be the friendly-friend-zoned guy who talks to a girl about her problems and not to her BF, is kind of creepy IMO and needs an ass kicking. Thats just a guy putting himself in line to be the next rebound BF plain and simple. Words say 1 thing, actions say another.

 

[The Jester]

A girl in a relationship doesnt need a male friend to talk to if her relationship isnt doomed to failure, communication is key, a guy who tries to be the friendly-friend-zoned guy who talks to a girl about her problems and not to her BF, is kind of creepy IMO and needs an ass kicking. Thats just a guy putting himself in line to be the next rebound BF plain and simple. Words say 1 thing, actions say another.

I've listened to females talk about their problems before.
That's not because I want to get in their pants,
but I genuinely care about some people.

 

[Billy]

I've listened to females talk about their problems before.
That's not because I want to get in their pants,
but I genuinely care about some people.

As have I, but not because they couldn't talk to their boyfriends about it, that would just make me feel like a scumbag.

 

[Life.is.beautiful]

You're right Billy, the next time a girl wants to talk about their problems because their BF wont listen it would be better to just turn her down and ignore her. That's not scumbag-ish at all.......(My voice is dripping with sarcasm......)


I agree with The Jester, caring about someone, and wanting to help them is not bad at all. And caring does not mean "I want to sex you", it means I care about you.

 

[Forest Dweller]

I'm glad we didn't chase you off!

My current best friend (my life's been in flux, I moved back to Florida 3 years ago, then got divorced over the last 18 months, so when I refer to her as an old friend I'm talking about a little more than a year) is a friend-zoned fellow infj. And I'm damn glad to have her as a friend for many reasons. This is the wisdom I've learned from the friendship:

1. If you have feelings, ask her out. If she rejects you and runs away, so be it. Get the feelings on the table. I asked this person out last year and was rejected, maybe for external reasons (I was still married at the time albeit completely and irreconcilably separated and having filed for divorce), maybe for other reasons of her own that she's chosen not to share with me. It's her business, I've chosen not to ask her about it since. Believe me, it wasn't easy to do, I stuttered when I asked, and while she went out of her way to be kind in her rejection, it wasn't fun internally for me. But she knows how I feel about her for disclaimer or for future purposes, I'd feel dishonest or ambivalent otherwise.

2. Honestly assess whether the relationship is reciprocal. If you're just chasing these people, probably not the best friendship. This friend of mine reaches out to me, invites me along to things, all of that. Yeah, I'm a subservient little f'er, so I'm willing to go extra miles, but I can say that it's worth it for what I get in return. Sure, she uses me to complain about her bf. But, she's there to lend an ear when I complain about my (now-ex) gf. And the stories, fears, and advice we share are I hope useful to each other now and in the future. Everyone needs and deserves to have that.

3. Keep a pulse on your own feelings. The best measure here is when you see this person having a good relationship with a partner, who do you feel jealous over. At the point where I could feel jealous for her, that she was in (at least at the time) a good relationship with someone, and not jealous for the guy she was with, that was when I could rest a little easy, despite the fact that I do have some idle daydreams to the contrary.

4. (Similar to 2), assess your needs in life and where this/these friends fit. This woman I'm talking about fits very well in my life. I hope she'll be there for a long time, we have mutual friends and interests, I rely on her a bit for spiritual and relationship advice. And yeah, I find that especially when I don't have any significant someone, it's nice to have people to smile at, flirt a bit with, etc. It makes life less lonely, and it leaves me in a better place and a stronger position when I think about whether I want a relationship, with whom, and how soon.

 

[Billy]

You're right Billy, the next time a girl wants to talk about their problems because their BF wont listen it would be better to just turn her down and ignore her. That's not scumbag-ish at all.......(My voice is dripping with sarcasm......)


I agree with The Jester, caring about someone, and wanting to help them is not bad at all. And caring does not mean "I want to sex you", it means I care about you.

Yeah, letting some guys girlfriend cry on your shoulder while you be the better man then he is really noble. You truly are a "nice guy".

 

[bamf]

I don't see why a girl couldn't talk to her guy about her BF when she can talk to girls about him. If the friendship is truly just a friendship on both ends, I see absolutely no difference.

 

[KorJax]

i've seen this sort of thread before and it kind of annoys me. it often seems to me that this eternal complaint is needy, full of self-pity, and even self-entitlement. expectations, expectations! - there is zero humility in it! as if she owes you something more, just because you have shown her friendship! is her friendship simply not enough for you? the whole time you're being nice to her, are you thinking in the back of your mind not about her as a unique person and the fun you're having together, but about why she won't cling to you or provide you with a relationship? perhaps she is not attracted to you. sex is not guaranteed to us as humans; maybe you will meet a compatible partner in future and maybe you won't, there are plenty of people in the human race who never even get kissed. and being a good person is its own reward. if you're doing it with the expectation that it will make you deserving of sex or some sort of validating devotion, you are not sincere about it.

This is so true.

INFJ's have the tendency to be "nice guys" in relationships or when pursueing one. This is not the way to a long lasting or fufilling relationship, because it's not sincere and it's kinda shallow.

Once you realize the above, and you pursue relationships without trying to ham-fist everything and accepting them as they are, that's when you evolve beyond "nice guy syndrome". And the best part is that you don't have to stop being nice and considerate - you just stop the bad symtoms and habits that are steriotypically associated with being a "nice guy" (i.e. such as clingy, coming on too fast, bringing silly stuff like gifts/roses on the first/second/third dates, being way too passive agressive, etc).

 

[The Jester]

Yeah, letting some guys girlfriend cry on your shoulder while you be the better man then he is really noble. You truly are a "nice guy".

I never let them villanize their partner.
I actually try to rationalize the whole thing, or offer them new perspectives.

 

[KorJax]

It should be said though that a lot of times when it comes to personal problems and a person needing support for it, the solution is something that only that person can come up with despite what they say.

Basically what I am saying is that sometimes what people need to get on the right track is for the solution not be given to them, but rather them getting empathy/support and being an outlet, so they can simply come up with the solution that was hidden but there all along on their own.

There are times where I feel kind of irritated for people to try and tell me what I should do and what I am doing wrong with certain kinds of issues, even though I know they are just trying to help. Sometimes I just need something to lean on for a bit while I find my footing, instead of a completely new ground all together being given to me.

 

[Nixie]

Just to throw a female Thinker perspective out there as well. Sometimes I have had no clue that a guy was interested and honestly believed that they just wanted to be friends. While Ni usually gives me a idea they might be interested, my feelings are always funneled thru Te first so sometimes I have been totally oblivious. Additionally my logic tells me that there will always be a certain amount of tension between mixed sex (or sexual attraction possible) relationships. I tend to allow the relationship to evolve naturally--sometimes you are flirty or you stay reserved, you give hugs, you don't, you talk about SO's or you don't. If a guy doesn't come out and make his intentions clear, I will disregard him as a potential boyfriend. My best relationships have always been with a man who was my friend first and we both decided it was worth moving forward.

 

[Moya Anomalous]

Any male capable of getting into the "friend zone" of the opposite gender is to be praised, indeed. For in this very skill does long term marriage thrive. You need only have patience and not focus on the sexual aspects of your potential marriage partner.

Ah, so is the beauty of such a relationship... to live naturally with no fa