Morality is Evil. | INFJ Forum

Morality is Evil.

TheLastMohican

TheLastMohican

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Strange thought, isn't it? I just watched this video:

[youtube]9lg6Q_xRII0&feature=feedu[/youtube]


The argument is that morality is the problem, not the solution. Would we be better off ignoring questions of right and wrong that do not occur to us naturally?
 
"Is something good because god commands it, or does god command it because it is good?"

If we say that something is good because god commands it, then I suppose that all the wars that have been fought for the name of religion are good because that's what god would want.

If we say that god commands it because it is good, then what became the basis to establish something as good or not?

I almost never agree with anything that this guy says about religion, but this time, he may have a point.
 
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So, you'd be a rapist and murderer, and child molester if you did not believe God was there to stop you?

I don't believe in God and yet I'm not a rapist or murderer or child molester. Does that make Atheists more moral than Christians?
 
Shai Gar said:
So, you'd be a rapist and murderer, and child molester if you did not believe God was there to stop you?

I don't believe in God and yet I'm not a rapist or murderer or child molester. Does that make Atheists more moral than Christians?
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Agreed. This argument has been used over and over again to make follows afraid of atheism/ agnosticism. Its sloppy and its assumptions are fair fetched.
 
Shai Gar said:
So, you'd be a rapist and murderer, and child molester if you did not believe God was there to stop you?

I don't believe in God and yet I'm not a rapist or murderer or child molester. Does that make Atheists more moral than Christians?
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Why are you not a rapist, murderer or child molester? Is something stopping you? Maybe afraid of repercussions such as going to jail or being lynched by the victims families?

What's stopping you from becoming just that?
 
The problem with that question is that it requires a definition of God. Nobody agrees on a definition of God, so the question can't be discussed.
 
Last Dawn said:
Why are you not a rapist, murderer or child molester? Is something stopping you? Maybe afraid of repercussions such as going to jail or being lynched by the victims families?

What's stopping you from becoming just that?
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I am not a rapist because the act of rape is morally abhorrent to me.
I am not a murderer because I know no person of whom I wish to murder.
I am not a child molester because molesting children is morally abhorrent to me.

Christians might not commit these acts because they're afraid of the government or god. I am not afraid of a government (consisting of people who I could murder "Law Abiding Citizen") or a god who doesn't exist. But I abstain from these acts, not because I am afraid of the repercussions, but because I've no desire to commit these acts.

This makes me more moral than Christians.
 
Shai Gar said:
I am not a rapist because the act of rape is morally abhorrent to me.
I am not a murderer because I know no person of whom I wish to murder.
I am not a child molester because sexual abuse of children is morally abhorrent to me.

Christians might not commit these acts because they're afraid of the government or god. I am not afraid of a government (consisting of people who I could murder "Law Abiding Citizen") or a god who doesn't exist. But I abstain from these acts, not because I am afraid of the repercussions, but because I've no desire to commit these acts.

This makes me more moral than Christians.
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"A man chooses; a slave obeys."--Andrew Ryan.

Sorry, that quote just came to mind with your post, Shai.

I also find the examples used in this thread thus far to be odd--no, extreme--what with using murderers, rapists, and child molester's as examples. History has proven that religion does not always stop people like these from existing, and some even encourage it (the Polygamist Compound in Texas comes to mind...). Also, we can't forget that Catholic Priests have molested children.

So, really, how much of an impact does religion have on one's morality? Also, if no one groups of people can agree on what's moral, is the idea really something people as a whole are capable of grasping in a unified way?
 
 
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TheAmazingAtheist's youtube channel is recommended, yeah, but just for the sake of clarification:
Morality is Evil -> Logic is False
morality is the problem, not the solution -> solution to what?
better off ignoring questions of right and wrong -> better in what sense?
:p
 
morality is a clever tactic to transfer the freedoms of one person to another.
 
The value of opinions on morality is equal to that of favorites.

I like the colors blue and green the best; what do you think about that?
 
TheLastMohican said:
I don't know what to make of this post.
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I would postulate what you, as an individual, see as "normal" would be far different from what I see as normal. If we cannot agree on normalcy, how can we further agree on what is "natural"? "Naturally", therefore, becomes a barrier rather than a bridge between our understanding things.

Take Christianity, for example; I would be amazed if we see eye to eye on moral laws in the Bible. Some take the moral laws and use them as crutches to get about, while others lay snares for the same laws trying to discredit them.

I see the law in the Bible so misunderstood because of the inability to try and understand the Bible as a complete book. People have a tendency to quote scriptures without the realization of their intent. The law is said to be a tutor to bring us unto Christ. When we have reached that understanding, we are told to love the Lord God with all your heart, soul, and mind. We are taught to love our neighbor as ourselves. We are told all the law and all the prophets are here in these two things. Against these things there can be no law, for they are the fulfilling of the law.

I question whether I personally could possibly be better off without this understanding. I know I could not be better off. Normal or natural to me is, then, most likely much different than that of most. This new set of two laws or new covenant is written in my mind and in my heart. I cannot see otherwise to be normal or natural.

Is it natural for me to drop by your house and urinate in your front yard?
 
Morality by etymological definition depends on customs and habits or peoples and individuals. It has nothing to do with right or wrong, ad in general should be ignored. Ethics is the same thing, only from Greek instead of Latin. One thing it has going for it though it that it comes from a contraction of the phrase Ethika Arete instead of just ethika, meaning good habits instead of just habits. We should really be focusing on the Arete, not the ethika.


Morality is not really consistent with Christianity. Christians ought know that all things are legal to us, but not all things edify. We should not care about social norms, but rather the inner virtues which our actions can manifest. Those who refrain from evil acts only on account of norms, mandates, or fear of punishment are not deserving of the name Christian.
 
magister343 said:
Morality is not really consistent with Christianity. Christians ought know that all things are legal to us, but not all things edify. We should not care about social norms, but rather the inner virtues which our actions can manifest. Those who refrain from evil acts only on account of norms, mandates, or fear of punishment are not deserving of the name Christian.
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As a Christian I know we should let all things be done in the church for the edification of the whole body. I do not see all things as legal to us, literally speaking. We do take note regarding social norms, if for nothing but our children's sakes.

When you speak of inner virtues, I do follow you but regarding
morality, ethics, virtues, right or wrong, and the likes: are they so different we should ignore some of them altogether?
 
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Morality and religion can go together, but are not dependent upon each other.
 
IndigoSensor said:
Morality and religion can go together, but are not dependent upon each other.
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+1

I tend to abstain from this sort of discussion. It usually brings less peace and more argument between both parties.

This answer is straight forward, I seen plenty of moral individuals who do not follow a religion, I seen plenty who commit immoral actions because of religion.

It really is all subjective.
 
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Raccoon Love said:
+1

I tend to abstain from this sort of discussion. It usually brings less peace and more argument between both parties.

This answer is straight forward, I seen plenty of moral individuals who do not follow a religion, I seen plenty who commit immoral actions because of religion.

It really is all subjective.
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You are correct in where these lead to.
I have seen plenty of immoral individuals who do not follow a religion, and I have seen plenty who commit immoral actions because of things other than religion, too.
 
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