INFJs and Arguments

[Altruistic Muse]

Ok, I'm kind of in the middle of an argument with my aunt. I have noticed that i am fine arguing with my immediate family (although prolonged instances will make me really tired and I usually end up crying) but with anyone at all further afield I avoid it like the plague! This silly argument with my aunt (involving a series of misunderstandings basically) has left me feeling really sad and exhausted. What is really silly is the fact that actually, I haven't even had the argument, my mum rang up on my behalf and told her she was in the wrong and kind of had the row between them. My mum is ISTJ, and even though I cannot get on with her most of the time, she is wonderfully solid and perfectly controlled at times like these. It's comforting . The whole row was also based around me being terrible at saying no when I can't do something as well. Is this a common INFJ thing? I always say yes or don't give an answer at all, because I try to keep everyone happy and in actuality everyone ends up pissed off. Anyway rant over. Conflict is the worst

 

[slant]

Yeah, Conflict sucks in the sense that you always have to be right or wrong therefore control someone else or having someone else controlling you. I don't mind conflict when it's needed, but when it's really ridiculous conflict that isn't playful and/or amusing, it is a bit irritating. I like impersonal conflict more than with other human beings.

 

[perpetual_liar]

Yep. Conflict sucks. I'll agree with you all on that point. Unfortunately, I always seem to be either source of conflict between others, or the one trying to stop it, or both. I used to think that an easy way to stop conflict would be to just not talk to anyone, but given my rant, I guess you can see how that turned out for me...
Anyway, I think the only way to stop conflict is to let unfold, however much it sucks at the time.

 

[sassafras]

I don't have a problem with a conflict between two, rational human beings. Tempers might flare a bit, and things might reach a heightened intensity, and I'll still be okay with it.

But I hate getting into an argument with someone who has a skewed notion of his or her intelligence or when their logic starts committing hara kiri left, right and centre and there's no humbling them. Those are the sort of conflicts I avoid because I have better things to do than watch a dog chase its own tail.

I have a friend like that in real life, and I love him to death, but I can't stand to argue with him. Most of the time, he thinks he's won and will congratulate himself for his superior intellect because everyone else has walked away, shaking their heads, when really, he doesn't realize how draining he is.

 

[Eric86]

I am usually able to tell before an argument starts if a person would even be worth my time arguing with, because I can see which kind of person they are: either someone who is actually willing to learn and understand, or someone who is just trying to push themselves on others. Most of the time, unfortunately, it's the latter, in which case I don't even bother with it because I'd be wasting my time. Of course, that ends up with me being called arrogant and prideful, but that assessment is obviously way off because of their skewed perceptions and agendas.

 

[laurie]

I can't stand conflict and, as my mum and sister fight a lot, I'm usually trying to stop arguments, then getting involved ^^" I think it's feeling bad if the peace is disturbed that leads to getting involved, but also I can't stand seeing people I love hurting each other over silly things.
Conflict usually makes me cry D:

 

[Onyrica]

I have a friend like that in real life, and I love him to death, but I can't stand to argue with him. Most of the time, he thinks he's won and will congratulate himself for his superior intellect because everyone else has walked away, shaking their heads, when really, he doesn't realize how draining he is.

My step father is like this. Always like this. It's absolutly exhausting, especially because he's from that generation in which they knew everything; they were the generation that learned and invented everything, including the wheel. I call them the 'God generation'. God was made after them - you can trust them to say that too.

So yeah, I do have a bit pride and I do have strong morals for which I stand for. And when I argue, very often I switch to a T aproach, rather than an F, because I know you usually have the lower hand when you try to argue with your feelings on your sleeve. (Although I'm not always able to switch to T, as my feelings over some things - like strong personal views - are very overwhelming)

But when it comes to people like my stepfather, among others, you just can't win. So instead of giving them the pleasure of 'defeating' you, I just raise an eyebrow, smirk and pretend I don't give a rats ass. You might be frustrated because you didn't put your point across, but imagine how that makes them feel~ =D

 

[RetardedMonkey]

I really hate conflict. It's very very rare for me to argue and it's only when I feel backed into a corner and have no other option. I'd much rather calmly discuss the issue and come to a compromise than argue about it to get my way. I usually start crying and get so worked up I have to take a long shower and isolate myself for a couple of hours in order to calm down again. I know, I'm weird.

 

[AUM]

It's not that I don't like conflict, but it's more like my body doesn't like conflict. When I get into an argument I feel a hole on my stomach usually when someone is really anxious for something that's how I feel. If I know I'm right I won't stop until the other person has understood that that's how I feel and nothing or anyone is going to change it. When I'm in a neutral situation or I know I have committed a wrong I just stay quiet, let the other person talk to their hearts content and just listen if there's actually something to listen about and walk away. I guess I know when to stop or when to fight.

 

[MindYourHead]

My step father is like this. Always like this. It's absolutly exhausting, especially because he's from that generation in which they knew everything; they were the generation that learned and invented everything, including the wheel. I call them the 'God generation'. God was made after them - you can trust them to say that too.

But when it comes to people like my stepfather, among others, you just can't win. So instead of giving them the pleasure of 'defeating' you, I just raise an eyebrow, smirk and pretend I don't give a rats ass. You might be frustrated because you didn't put your point across, but imagine how that makes them feel~ =D

If your age listed as 21 is correct, I take it you are probably referring to my generation? Those of us born in the late 50's or early 60's? 1961 in my case.
Generation Jones. Were not really boomers, and we are ahead of Generation X.
(I resent being grouped with Boomers! We really didn't share any of the same life experiences growing up, and just look at how they trashed the United States.)
But, I digress.

I laugh, because my parents generation came across that same way to me.
As did their parents to them. As will your children think of yours.
It's just part of the circle of life.

I used the same tactics with my parents you did, or still do with your Stepfather.

It's all good! :rockon:

 

[Onyrica]

If your age listed as 21 is correct, I take it you are probably referring to my generation? Those of us born in the late 50's or early 60's? 1961 in my case.
Generation Jones. Were not really boomers, and we are ahead of Generation X.
(I resent being grouped with Boomers! We really didn't share any of the same life experiences growing up, and just look at how they trashed the United States.)
But, I digress.

I laugh, because my parents generation came across that same way to me.
As did their parents to them. As will your children think of yours.
It's just part of the circle of life.

I used the same tactics with my parents you did, or still do with your Stepfather.

It's all good! :rockon:

Yeah, 50's generation would be it, pretty much.

However, I'll correct myself a tad in saying that I'm talking from the spanish approach. (I'm half american, but I didn't live there long enough to learn how different generations were affected by the culture of the time.)

Over here, up to 30 years ago, there was a vast tradition of patriarchal families, in which the father was the 'owner' of the wife, the children and the rights to say and do whatever they pleased and believe they were right about it. This was heavily influenced and supported by the dictatorship we had at the time, which nearly promoted very heavy disciplining on the whole family - especially on women. (Who were - and somewhat still are - considered inferior, stupid things)
The people that were born and raised in the 50-60's here still conserve that mentality from their own parents and enforce it on their own time, even if things now are quite different. (People from the late 60's towards 70's already have a different mindset.)

Basically, it seems I'm reeling in a rush here, but my point is that I spoke from the point of view from the spanish society and so I can't really generalize and say all the 50's generation across the world is like that. I just know it is over here, given the political and social sittuations of the time, so I don't want anyone to be affected by my generalitzation. (I probably should've considered mentioning this at the time... ^^

 

[TaylorS]

I hate conflict and will try to avoid it if possible and help others to not get into conflict. The exception is when a very importance principle I hold is violated, then I erupt into shrill rants.

 

[Ketsugi]

I dislike conflict. It makes me physically ill. I have a lot of bad memories of it. Unfortunately, I was extremely disrespected in my last relationship and faced a lot of situations where I chose to argue to defend myself. It was literally Hell on Earth for me and I never want to get involved with someone like that again.

 

[Wyst]

I used to hate conflict altogether.

Since then I've grown up a little bit. I've started being more forthright with that I think and how I feel. I think that for the longest time, I held back that part of me thinking, 'My opinion doesn't matter to anyone'.

For the longest time, people thought I was fine with decisions made or that I simply agreed because I didn't share my mind with them and then they'd wonder why I was out of sorts or putting distance between us.

I realized this wasn't solving any problems. Granted, I don't argue with everyone. Just the people that matter to me. I argue because I want to communicate with them about how I feel/think. To choose not to communicate with those people I love and care about would, to me, be a devolving from the lesser-developed INFJ I used to be.

 

[MindYourHead]

Yeah, 50's generation would be it, pretty much.

However, I'll correct myself a tad in saying that I'm talking from the spanish approach. (I'm half american, but I didn't live there long enough to learn how different generations were affected by the culture of the time.)

Over here, up to 30 years ago, there was a vast tradition of patriarchal families, in which the father was the 'owner' of the wife, the children and the rights to say and do whatever they pleased and believe they were right about it. This was heavily influenced and supported by the dictatorship we had at the time, which nearly promoted very heavy disciplining on the whole family - especially on women. (Who were - and somewhat still are - considered inferior, stupid things)
The people that were born and raised in the 50-60's here still conserve that mentality from their own parents and enforce it on their own time, even if things now are quite different. (People from the late 60's towards 70's already have a different mindset.)

Basically, it seems I'm reeling in a rush here, but my point is that I spoke from the point of view from the spanish society and so I can't really generalize and say all the 50's generation across the world is like that. I just know it is over here, given the political and social sittuations of the time, so I don't want anyone to be affected by my generalitzation. (I probably should've considered mentioning this at the time... ^^

I see were you are coming from now.
I hope you didn't feel I was taking you to task.
(See, I don't want conflict, or hard feelings.)

 

[Julia]

Conflict based on conflicting perceptions of what is going on is almost impossible to resolve. I have found it can be disarming to just ask the person "what can I do to help resolve the situation?" There are a few instances where I went ahead and apologized because in their perception I had been hurtful even though it was not my intent. From their vantage point, they needed an apology from me and so I gave it. It seemed like one way to move their perception closer to mine because I had intended nothing negative or hurtful and so the apology fit with that intent. I can see there can also be a problem apologizing for things a person is not guilty of, but it is an art rather than a science dealing with people. It can be helpful to find some way to let the person know you want good things for them.

Yeah, Conflict sucks in the sense that you always have to be right or wrong therefore control someone else or having someone else controlling you. I don't mind conflict when it's needed, but when it's really ridiculous conflict that isn't playful and/or amusing, it is a bit irritating. I like impersonal conflict more than with other human beings.

This resonated with me. Debating and comparing conflicting ideas can be constructive when the social roles and egos are dismissed from the situation. That seems to be rare, though.

 

[Onyrica]

I see were you are coming from now.
I hope you didn't feel I was taking you to task.
(See, I don't want conflict, or hard feelings.)

No hard feelings at all~
(I feel the same way though, hate hurting or annoying people. Thus my often (and boring) explanations of things. xD)

 

[Jana]

(I feel the same way though, hate hurting or annoying people. Thus my often (and boring) explanations of things. xD)

People around often say: Oh no, you are explanaing again!!!