Being too direct and honest.

Angantyr

Angantyr

Regular Poster
MBTI
INFJ
One key problem with my life has always been my inability to keep friends, most people seem to be upset about obtaining friends but with me that's not really the cast (sadly its not like I can magically make everybody my friend). But one of my key problems is I seem to scare people off other than the few weirdos who seem to gravitate towards me. Anyway I saw somebody who used to be my friend then just randomly stopped talking to me then after a while even resorted to insulting me. After some time he changed, he didn't start being friendly to me but he subtlety agreed with what I was saying but was never direct about it.

Anyway upon seeing him again I straight out asked him why he did such and I got not response what so ever. This is something that really has bugging me for a while but I can't figure out and this is the only way I can get a proper response. Maybe I wasn't close enough to ask this kind of question in the first place so I really don't know. Maybe I'm coming off as an asshole but it feels like I'm on a higher level (not necessary being "better" per say, I hate that way of thinking) than most people.

After all this it got me thinking (though in part due to being drunk xD) am I too direct and honest with people? Society as a whole is full of lies and diceit and a lot of people lie like its nothing. To me however I struggle to lie intentionally and tell people how I really feel. Does this confuse most people other than the few people who remain loyal? Perhaps it's just something I'm not used to.

I do screw around but don't depending on the situation. It tends to be that if its urgent then I get it out of the way as quick as possible but if its not then whilst I want to get it out of the way I leave it to the last minute. When it comes to talking to people I think it plays a role and when I want to know something I out right ask it rather than play games. When somethings not that important I like to play games and be subtle when getting an answer out of people.

Anyway enough of my rambling I wonder how many other INFJs feel they come off as too honest and direct. Is it just me or a trait we all share?
 
Being honest and direct is an admirable thing and not something you should think of in negative terms. If your "friend" mattered at all, he would have answered. Forget about him and move on.
 
I can't speak for INFJs, but I will give my opinion anyway.

I like honest and direct almost always, as long as it is fueled by good intentions. If someone has questionable motives, then that is a different story.

However, there is a lot more than just that dynamic to sustained social interactions. Do you actively attempt to convey being 'higher up' than others? No one likes that, and in a lot of cases it just isn't true.

Some people really can't handle others that are so direct. It could be a good lesson for you in becoming more diplomatic or less sharp towards others. A sharp knife is a good tool, but isn't always the right tool for the job at hand.

Are you open to comments and input from others? If everyone thinks you only want to state your opinion but not take any opinions in return, that could cause obvious problems as well.
 
I appreciate honesty and directness from people.

I find it difficult to offer it back though. I usually serve it up with a sledge hammer, doing more damage than good.

It's probably because softening the harshness of the honesty and directness is not something I'm skilled at - even though speaking directly and honestly is something I could choose to do at any point.

I do not desire to hurt people's feelings.
 
You can be direct while still being somewhat tactful about it. Usually this requires vulnerable language, like "I feel ____ when you _____."
 
Being honest and direct is an admirable thing and not something you should think of in negative terms. If your "friend" mattered at all, he would have answered. Forget about him and move on.

I agree. However in this specific case I wanted to try to get a proper answer but failed leading me to wonder if I was direct. Perhaps I should have been more subtle in trying to talk to him. His friendship was not a huge issue as sad as that may sound but more trying to find something about myself out.

However, there is a lot more than just that dynamic to sustained social interactions. Do you actively attempt to convey being 'higher up' than others? No one likes that, and in a lot of cases it just isn't true.

Not at all, I hate it when I come off as condescending but I feel its in part due to people being so condescending to me for so long that it's influenced the way I communicate.

Some people really can't handle others that are so direct. It could be a good lesson for you in becoming more diplomatic or less sharp towards others. A sharp knife is a good tool, but isn't always the right tool for the job at hand.

I feel like I'm rather diplomatic and rational being the type of person to give the benefit of the doubt. However it frustrates me when people have an issue with me but can never being straight forward and give me a straight answer. Why do people try to complicate an issue? Is it because they're much more unsure than I am?

Are you open to comments and input from others? If everyone thinks you only want to state your opinion but not take any opinions in return, that could cause obvious problems as well.

I try to believe me I try! Just kiding, yes going back to what I said earlier it basically means its hard to find people that want to discuss things on my level so I'm often never really sure about myself. I take peoples input but often they have little to say and it feels like what I say has gone completely over their head.

I appreciate honesty and directness from people.

I find it difficult to offer it back though. I usually serve it up with a sledge hammer, doing more damage than good.

It's probably because softening the harshness of the honesty and directness is not something I'm skilled at - even though speaking directly and honestly is something I could choose to do at any point.

I do not desire to hurt people's feelings.

This conveys my feelings to the matter, I feel like I'm too hard/blunt at times and people find it honest to swallow and at the same time I do not mean to offend.
 
Do you have a quick temper, or are you easily offended? Sometimes people won't want to give feedback if they think the other person won't receive it well enough - and some people are naturally non-confrontational and they'd rather leave than discuss the situation.

If I have to tell people things they may not want to hear, I usually soften my words first. I may use examples that are similar to the situation, so they can relate to what I'm saying without them feeling personally attacked. I'm usually quite good with tact, but I'll also get a little less tactful as the conversation continues and I feel the person isn't getting what I'm saying.

Communication is a two-way street, but not everyone will be at your level of communication and you have to respect that. Sometimes you'll have to change your communication style to be heard and understood, and you'll have to discover what the other person's style is in order to hear and understand them.

But I'll tell you this: No one likes to be played with when they're trying to be serious with you. If you're manipulating their words or making them admit something they're not ready to admit or commit to something they're not ready to commit to, then you'll lose friends. You've got to be equal here. You have to be as equally vulnerable to them as they will be to you. Otherwise it will always feel like a "one-up" thing to them.
 
Angantyr said:
Anyway upon seeing him again I straight out asked him why he did such and I got not response what so ever. This is something that really has bugging me for a while but I can't figure out and this is the only way I can get a proper response.
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You should realize that what is clear and simple for you may not be for other people. In my experience, a large portion of people's "lies" is their inability to analyze "properly", or rather, the same way as someone else, who decides they lie. Compare with children; they are bound to say a lot of absurd things and often appear deliberately lying or misbehaving, but most of it is about their limited vision and understanding. Well, in certain ways all of us still remain children when it comes to specific qualities developed better by others.

Most people, and it's probably safe to say all people, strive to be honest. And yet, all are bound to fall in position that may appear as lying to someone else. I can guarantee you that there are situations in which your own behavior may suffer from similar issues, compared to the understanding of a certain kind of observer, who may wonder why you lie.

In this particular case, you focus on what was happening inside the head of your friend. You look for very specific motivation for his actions. What if there is none? Quite possibly, he was confused, and is still confused. Therefore avoiding answering you (because he couldn't).

On topic, about straightforwardness. Well, there you are, your friend was also quite straightforward, if he went so far to start insulting you at some point. He didn't pretend, he reacted as he felt at the time. Then his attitude gradually changed, and he didn't even apologize. Now you end up wondering whether you are being rude, when it's your friend who has been way more directly rude to you. I think you shouldn't worry about it.

About INFJs, I don't think they have issues with being too direct, they usually put a lot of thought in what they say and it hits the target with great accuracy, so there's rarely any excessive pain.

Me (enfp), i take directness for granted. I often insult people without realizing and can be quite insensitive, and also assume that others around me shouldn't care and say things as they are. I may overlook subtle gentle hints, and in general subtlety and gentleness always surprise me and amuse me. However, I don't despise it (as some people actually do); I admire it deeply, and wish I could be more gentle myself, but it doesn't come easy to me.

(gosh, why does this post look so long, upon reading it seemed brief xD)
 
I'd like to know more about why feel like you are on a higher level than other people. I think there could be a lot of useful insights in the juxtaposition before your desire to connect and your reflexive feeling of separation.

**Puts down his snarky psychoanalysis pipe **
 
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I don't think I've ever found myself in a situation such as yours, but if I feel there is a problem with someone close to me or someone I can't avoid seeing (in laws, coworkers) I always gently ask if I have offended them or if they are having a rough time. This is always works at working towards closure on the situation. Alot of times it takes just acknowledging something is up. But if someone really treats me like shit, I don't worry about it, no loss there.
 
No, lying isn't good (Duh)
Yes, it's good to be honest (Duh)
Honesty isn't synonymous with tactless (Slightly less duh)
I'm really craving some sour cream and onion pringles right now (PROFOUND WISDOM)
 
Sesquipedalian said:
No, lying isn't good (Duh)
Yes, it's good to be honest (Duh)
Honesty isn't synonymous with tactless (Slightly less duh)
I'm really craving some sour cream and onion pringles right now (PROFOUND WISDOM)
Click to expand...

Lying isn't always bad.
 
KazeCraven said:
Lying isn't always bad.
Click to expand...
I believe it is - always. Lies breed lies. Truth breeds truth. Your yes should mean yes. Your no should mean no. There should be no need for promises or fibs. Truth should be conveyed carefully, at the right time, with love, and in the right context, but shared nonetheless.
 
Sesquipedalian said:
No, lying isn't good (Duh)
Yes, it's good to be honest (Duh)
Honesty isn't synonymous with tactless (Slightly less duh)
I'm really craving some sour cream and onion pringles right now (PROFOUND WISDOM)
Click to expand...


Ahem

"Pray for peace and grace and spiritual food,
For wisdom and guidance, for all these are good,
but don't forget the potatoes."
 
Sesquipedalian said:
I believe it is - always. Lies breed lies. Truth breeds truth. Your yes should mean yes. Your no should mean no. There should be no need for promises or fibs. Truth should be conveyed carefully, at the right time, with love, and in the right context, but shared nonetheless.
Click to expand...

Classic Dilemma: A man comes to your house, and you know that he's trying to kill your friend, let's call him Sammy Sosa, who is hiding in your house. This man is armed, and he asks you, "Do you know where Sammy Sosa is?"

How do you handle this issue without lying?
 
KazeCraven said:
Classic Dilemma: A man comes to your house, and you know that he's trying to kill your friend, let's call him Sammy Sosa, who is hiding in your house. This man is armed, and he asks you, "Do you know where Sammy Sosa is?"

How do you handle this issue without lying?
Click to expand...

If an unstoppable man hits an immovable Sosa, what happens?
 
You should realize that what is clear and simple for you may not be for other people. In my experience, a large portion of people's "lies" is their inability to analyze "properly", or rather, the same way as someone else, who decides they lie. Compare with children; they are bound to say a lot of absurd things and often appear deliberately lying or misbehaving, but most of it is about their limited vision and understanding. Well, in certain ways all of us still remain children when it comes to specific qualities developed better by others.

I've never thought of it like that before but it does make a lot of sense. When I'm talking I find it hard not to be honest but when I notice other people lying they come off as unsure about what they're saying and when you do question it them they wonder about it. I understand it completely with kids though, I thought up a lot of stupid stuff as a kid.

Most people, and it's probably safe to say all people, strive to be honest. And yet, all are bound to fall in position that may appear as lying to someone else. I can guarantee you that there are situations in which your own behavior may suffer from similar issues, compared to the understanding of a certain kind of observer, who may wonder why you lie.

I don't think most people do to be honest. To me it feels like a lot of people do and say what they want for their own self interests. I've been reading up on Sociopaths and it has made a lot more sense to me.

A desire to be wanted/needed doesn't exist in everybody just some people try to create it.
In this particular case, you focus on what was happening inside the head of your friend. You look for very specific motivation for his actions. What if there is none? Quite possibly, he was confused, and is still confused. Therefore avoiding answering you (because he couldn't).

I think confusion is the key but I needed to know for myself as I want to stop what ever it is I'm doing. I don't know where to turn but if I want to move on with my life I need these answered.

How ever he did kind of change his attitude. He didn't talk directly to me but in a dicussion he talked as if he was agreeing with me. I think it may have been another friend of his influence.

About INFJs, I don't think they have issues with being too direct, they usually put a lot of thought in what they say and it hits the target with great accuracy, so there's rarely any excessive pain.

I agree for the most part but some times we just have so much to say its hard to put it in terms which they can understand. This is something I need to work on.

Me (enfp), i take directness for granted. I often insult people without realizing and can be quite insensitive, and also assume that others around me shouldn't care and say things as they are. I may overlook subtle gentle hints, and in general subtlety and gentleness always surprise me and amuse me. However, I don't despise it (as some people actually do); I admire it deeply, and wish I could be more gentle myself, but it doesn't come easy to me.

ENFPs are good people, though in my experience with my ex (also an ENFP) she was hard to talk to on a deeper level and she was bad with me being subtle leading to a lot of frustration. In part personal experience plays a role as well.

(gosh, why does this post look so long, upon reading it seemed brief xD)

Been there.

I'd like to know more about why feel like you are on a higher level than other people. I think there could be a lot of useful insights in the juxtaposition before your desire to connect and your reflexive feeling of separation.

**Puts down his snarky psychoanalysis pipe **

I see how things are and over analyse everything.

Truth be told nobody (at least irl, the internet is a different story) gives me a chance to talk about things that interest me and it feels like it's going all over their head. When I do start to say things I struggle to explain to them and they treat it like a joke.
 
I come off a many things to different people due my varying levels of comfort with those I choose to let in versus those who do not. While people I have just met think I'm a very quiet reserved person ( and while this is true to some extent ) , others feel that I'm too open. This is due to the fact that I generally get goods feeling about the people I actually choose to associate with. For this reason, I sensually just lay down who I am. I'll have no inhibitions about it. My mind has no inhibitions, so I generally say what I mean all the time. And because I do not find anything taboo , like most people, it can be taboo when i'll openly make jokes about myself. It will seem to honest because most people simply do not think in such a way as I. I just find lighthearted topics boring, thats why I come off as too direct.

* usually not sensually
 
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Angantyr said:
One key problem with my life has always been my inability to keep friends, most people seem to be upset about obtaining friends but with me that's not really the cast (sadly its not like I can magically make everybody my friend). But one of my key problems is I seem to scare people off other than the few weirdos who seem to gravitate towards me. Anyway I saw somebody who used to be my friend then just randomly stopped talking to me then after a while even resorted to insulting me. After some time he changed, he didn't start being friendly to me but he subtlety agreed with what I was saying but was never direct about it.

Anyway upon seeing him again I straight out asked him why he did such and I got not response what so ever. This is something that really has bugging me for a while but I can't figure out and this is the only way I can get a proper response. Maybe I wasn't close enough to ask this kind of question in the first place so I really don't know. Maybe I'm coming off as an asshole but it feels like I'm on a higher level (not necessary being "better" per say, I hate that way of thinking) than most people.

After all this it got me thinking (though in part due to being drunk xD) am I too direct and honest with people? Society as a whole is full of lies and diceit and a lot of people lie like its nothing. To me however I struggle to lie intentionally and tell people how I really feel. Does this confuse most people other than the few people who remain loyal? Perhaps it's just something I'm not used to.

I do screw around but don't depending on the situation. It tends to be that if its urgent then I get it out of the way as quick as possible but if its not then whilst I want to get it out of the way I leave it to the last minute. When it comes to talking to people I think it plays a role and when I want to know something I out right ask it rather than play games. When somethings not that important I like to play games and be subtle when getting an answer out of people.

Anyway enough of my rambling I wonder how many other INFJs feel they come off as too honest and direct. Is it just me or a trait we all share?
Click to expand...

I know what you mean. I had this problem a lot when I was younger. I would make friends very easily but constantly be loosing them. This made me very jaded and almost afraid to be my true self because the minute someone really got to know me they'd be running in the other direction. I'm too weird, I'm too honest, I'm too hard to figure out, it goes on and on. Now, that I'm older I don't make friends so easily because I've become much more picky about who I call a friend. I don't think being direct and honest is something you should ever change. It's a wonderful quality and you will find that your true friends will accept you for it ( they might even think you are awesome because of it).
 
I am a 31 yr old infj female. I get in trouble all the time for being too direct and honest. I value being authentic but it costs me harmony in my relationships. Now I know why people play it safe.
 
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