War Business

mintoots said:
This is about trade control slipping through US dominance, and forced allegiances.
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Pretty much.

I mean, take it from one of the tips of our spear himself: don't recall what clip it was, but to paraphrase

https://www.youtube.com/@habitual_linecrosser:
we be doing some pretty shady shit for resources.
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TomasM said:
One of the main reasons I made this thread was that NF’s and NT’s have incredible insight through intuition. Each of us can see pieces of the puzzle and collectively the entire picture starts to become clear.

Rarely is the reason for bombing someone or something the reason we are told - there’s almost always an underlying motivation that is working behind the scenes.

I personally believe there was a reason for installing Israel as a nation state in the Middle East and the efforts to support it continually plays into that reason. To me the answers come from recognizing the people of power that installed that government. Though there may be strategy and tactics used as time progresses, it all eventually goes back to the initial reason for the installment.

Personally, I want the bombing and killing to stop but I have to recognize that my idealism can be naive and is unlikely to ever be a practical expectation. Acceptance is a highly valuable personal attribute that I believe is critical to success yet this is an aspect [in our world] I struggle to accept.
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I think so far this thread is confirming OP's fears: war is big business! Even bigger now. Can't be healthy.

Those of Jewish decent more or less own most of LA and NYC. That thing about preferring to do business with each other fucking brilliant! Anyway, no question that factor has a big hand all up in the US's pie. Anyone else pull that shit...unless it's in Africa where there be marginal resources we want, US would take up arms and put boots on the ground to stop it ...At least sanctions. But no, not Israel; they're more or less running a holocaust of their own, and we're just telling them "can you tone it down a little?"

So we have something like 200+ nations on this planet... and what? -like 10% operate within the bounds of human decency? Not a good look! :cry:
 
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Some suggest according to game theory, this could result in trump staying in office.
Which is of course his goal, to maintain power and wealth.
People have been speaking the fall of the US into existence for years now.
The land isn't going anywhere but we are about to see significant government/regime upheaval both east and west.
It will be experienced differently for everyone.
It's the seemingly random and unknown forces in motion that are most threatening though.
 
America already is a failed nation. We're essentially the global embodiment of everything we were founded to fight against. Think Yale recognized us as being an oligarchy as far back as the early nineties. And we put bow on it 9/11.

Oh yea, shit is hitting the fan alright. Wouldn't be so bad except for america's ruling class doesn't think nearly as highly of our freedoms and founding principals as we do. That could go very bad very quickly.
 
US was the real shit hole all along 🫠
 
TomasM said:
One of the main reasons I made this thread was that NF’s and NT’s have incredible insight through intuition. Each of us can see pieces of the puzzle and collectively the entire picture starts to become clear.
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💚
 
mintoots said:
Qatar will likely retaliate. Official statements by Qatar point to that. This is escalating faster than I expected.
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I would again disagree here. Pre-announced attack with no casualties. Something similar happened last summer when Israel and Iran were launching pre-announced rockets at each other and intercepting them. And then, as now, Iran was sending terrifying threats with no follow up.

It's all about saving face now and looking like you're doing something.

This official statements have 0 value. It's like reading company mission statements or listening Tim Cook speak how Apple is the best company in the world and committed to continuous innovation and AI integration...
 
The United States states that Iran cannot have nuclear weapons.

That, coming from the only nation to use nuclear weapons, in a terrorism action, by purposefully bombing civilians during wartime.

Do as they say, not as they do.

Exceptionalism as its best.

Human darkness shines brightest when carrying the biggest stick, as it should.

Higher-minded ideals are but words.

At the end of the day, the threat of coercive force, and the violence resulting, it what gets things done.

From the rape of a child, to 9mm slugs to the chest and dome, to the forced starvation of millions—this is the singular truth of our species.

We bombed Iran? Of course we did. Whatever. Same shit, different day.

Banality Ascendant,
Ian
 
aeon said:
That, coming from the only nation to use nuclear weapons, in a terrorism action, by purposefully bombing civilians during wartime.
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You have to consider the context. The world was at war and the United States had not engaged the war as a country. Japan all out attacked the United States in Hawaii - it’s hard to say if that was provoked or unprovoked but it certainly wasn’t preceded by a military attack on Japan.

The US wasn’t going to stage a long term infantry campaign on mainland Japan by transporting troops across the pacific, so they did the same thing Japan did only on a larger scale.

Was it wrong - yes, in every way conceivable, but it did send a statement to the world that nobody has forgotten. This is the reason nobody attacks the United States with a military.

I really believe that keeping nuclear weapons away from Iran is to prevent destabilizing the Middle East. I’m fairly confident that Iran would use this on Israel and the ramifications of this would be vast. There’s a reason the Israeli government is positioned specifically where it is located - by a state that is not Islamic.
 
philostam said:
Oil down 7% on the day lol.

Markets are speaking...

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Oil prices have to be low to fight a war. I worked for an energy company and we had optional lunch and learn sessions every day. Most of the time it was health related but they did a series on the history of oil and gas. In the documentary series they specifically talked about one of the biggest reasons for the Nazi’s loss in WW2 - it was because they didn’t have enough fuel to complete an effort in flanking the Russians.

Low oil prices increases my concern because it says that big money (and power) will give up profits for a reason. Big money doesn’t like to give up profits EVER!
 
TomasM said:
I really believe that keeping nuclear weapons away from Iran is to prevent destabilizing the Middle East. I’m fairly confident that Iran would use this on Israel and the ramifications of this would be vast. There’s a reason the Israeli government is positioned specifically where it is located - by a state that is not Islamic.
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Yes. Israel's possession of nukes has not sparked an ME nuclear arms race but Iran's would. Arab states in general are uneasy with Iran. Saudi would have almost as much to fear as Israel.

Their ideology and their means of government make them a loose canon in the region. And yes, Israel is a western bulwark in a rescource-rich region dominated by a fusion of sovereign states and Islam.

Anyway, it's blowing over now.
 
TomasM said:
The US wasn’t going to stage a long term infantry campaign on mainland Japan by transporting troops across the pacific, so they did the same thing Japan did only on a larger scale.
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I firmly and resoundingly disagree. To call that “same thing” is wishful thinking, purposeful misrepresentation, or wilfully ignorant, even allowing for matter of scale.

Japan attacked a military target. Fair game in war.

The USA bombed civilian targets. War crime. Abject terrorism.

Oh right...all is fair in love and war. Nevermind.

Best,
Ian
 
Some Christians believe end of times and rapture is at hand.

Which tracks. Not those things happening, but the belief.

Um, Yeah,
Ian
 
aeon said:
Japan attacked a military target. Fair game in war.
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The US was not engaged in WW2 when they were bombed. This made the attack on the people not just a military base. Just because it is a military base does not make the people there any less a citizen of the country.

If the US was at war and had engaged Japan with warfare then perhaps it could be viewed as only a military attack but that was not the case. Japan engaged in a sneak attack on a country that had not engaged them from a military stance. This means they were attacking civilians even if you don’t want to recognize military personnel as civilians. Most of the people were sleeping and woke to bombs dropping on everyone.

The rules of engagement set the rules for how wartime conflict is acceptable. Japan chose to forego the rules of engagement and that is why they got bombed in civilian areas. The attack on Pearl Harbor was viewed as an attack on innocent people by the United States.
aeon said:
The USA bombed civilian targets. War crime. Abject terrorism.
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Not according to the rules of engagement. If a country bombs innocent people then they put theirselves in a position of receiving the same in return.

Again, I have to make it clear, I do not approve of nuclear weapons nor do I approve of any wars but that’s my idealism. I’m only speaking based on what I know of governments and how they view the engagement of wartime activities.
 
TomasM said:
This means they were attacking civilians even if you don’t want to recognize military personnel as civilians.
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My thoughts in this regard are immaterial. The law, however, is very clear indeed. Members of the military are not civilians.

Associated personnel, yes, they are civilians.

Regardless of peacetime status, it has long been accepted that a first strike is to be carried out on a military target. Japan did exactly that.

Cheers,
Ian
 
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