The Lure of Conspiracy. | Page 10 | INFJ Forum

The Lure of Conspiracy.

I understand where you are coming from, and of course there are secret societies out there. There's no debating that fact. It's just that a great majority, illuminati included, are distraction tools to misguide the population into searching for secrets. They give you the illusion of choice and diversity, the illusion of hidden truth and mystery. They want you to demand it, to crave it. They want you to dig so deeply within it you eventually lose yourself! The people who control your nutrition, health, education, information and societal morals have been around forever. What are you after, really?
 
I understand where you are coming from, and of course there are secret societies out there. There's no debating that fact. It's just that a great majority, illuminati included, are distraction tools to misguide the population into searching for secrets. They give you the illusion of choice and diversity, the illusion of hidden truth and mystery. They want you to demand it, to crave it. They want you to dig so deeply within it you eventually lose yourself! The people who control your nutrition, health, education, information and societal morals have been around forever. What are you after, really?

Do you mean what was i hoping to find by looking into all this stuff or do you mean what outcome would i like to see in the world? (or something else entirely?)

In researching this stuff I wanted to understand why the world was the way it was. I've found out a fair amount of the answers i was looking for; the stuff i don't know is also yeilding with more research

It helps to make sense of everything going on in what otherwise can be a confusing and frightening world

The ideal outcome i would like to see is an expansion of awareness on the part of the global population regarding the dynamic within humanity that shapes our world so that we can all refashion it together into something better...in a word: evolution

The changes we are seeing around the world are indicators of something massive happening....i believe it is an opportunity for everyone to change things for the better, but only if people can see clearly what is going on
 
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[SIZE=+4]Chomsky Dismisses 911
Conspiracy Theories As 'Dubious'[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+1]
12-13-6[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]The following is an exchange between a ZNet Sustainer and Noam Chomsky, which took place in the Sustainer Web Board where Noam hosts a forum...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+1]ZNet[/SIZE][SIZE=+1] Sustainer: Dear Noam, There is much documentation observed and uncovered by the 911 families themselves suggesting a criminal conspiracy within the Bush Administration to cover-up the 9/11 attacks (see DVD, 9/11: Press for Truth). Additionally, much evidence has been put forward to question the official version of events. This has come in part from Paul Thompson, an activist who has creatively established the 9/11 Timeline, a free 9/11 investigative database for activist researchers, which now, according to The Village Voice's James Ridgeway, rivals the 9/11 Commission's report in accuracy and lucidity (see,[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0416,mondo1,52830,6.html, [/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]or www.cooperativeresearch.org).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]Noam Chomsky: Hard for me to respond to the rest of the letter, because I am not persuaded by the assumption that much documentation and other evidence has been uncovered. To determine that, we'd have to investigate the alleged evidence. Take, say, the physical evidence. There are ways to assess that: submit it to specialists -- of whom there are thousands -- who have the requisite background in civil-mechanical engineering, materials science, building construction, etc., for review and analysis; and one cannot gain the required knowledge by surfing the internet. In fact, that's been done, by the professional association of civil engineers. Or, take the course pursued by anyone who thinks they have made a genuine discovery: submit it to a serious journal for peer review and publication. To my knowledge, there isn't a single submission.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]ZNet Sustainer: A question that arises for me is that regardless of this issue, how do I as an activist prevent myself from getting distracted by such things as conspiracy theories instead of focusing on the bigger picture of the institutional analysis of private profit over people?[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]

Noam Chomsky: I think this reaches the heart of the matter. One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work. How do you personally set priorities? That's of course up to you. I've explained my priorities often, in print as well as elsewhere, but we have to make our own judgments.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]ZNet Sustainer: In a sense, profit over people is the real conspiracy, yes, yet not a conspiracy at all * rather institutional reality? At the same time, if the core of conspiracy theories are accurate, which is challenging to pin down, though increasingly possible, does it not fit into the same motivations of furthering institutional aims of public subsidizes to private tyrannies? I mean, through the 9/11attacks, Bush Et Al. has been able to justify massive increases in defense spending for a "war without end," and Israel has been given the green light to do virtually whatever it wants since now 'the Americans are in the same fight.' Furthermore, there has been a substantial rollback of civil rights in our nation, with the most extreme example being strong attempt to terminate habeas corpus.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]Noam Chomsky: Can't answer for the same reasons. I don't see any reason to accept the presuppositions. As for the consequences, in one of my first interviews after 9/11 I pointed out the obvious: every power system in the world was going to exploit it for its own interests: the Russians in Chechnya, China against the Uighurs, Israel in the occupied territories,... etc., and states would exploit the opportunity to control their own populations more fully through "prevention of terrorism acts" and the like. By the "who gains" argument, every power system in the world could be assigned responsibility for 9/11.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]ZNet Sustianer: This begs the question: if 9/11 was an inside job, then what's to say that Bush Et Al., if cornered or not, wouldn't resort to another more heinous attack of grander proportions in the age of nuclear terrorism * which by its very nature would petrify populations the world over, leading citizens to cower under the Bush umbrella of power.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]Noam Chomsky: Wrong question, in my opinion. They were carrying out far more serious crimes, against Americans as well, before 9/11 -- crimes that literally threaten human survival. They may well resort to further crimes if activists here prefer not to deal with them and to focus their attention on arcane and dubious theories about 9/11.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]

ZNet Sustainer: Considering that in the US there are stage-managed elections, public relations propaganda wars, and a military-industrial-education-prison-etc. complex, does something like this sound far-fetched?

[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]Noam Chomsky: I think that's the wrong way to look at it. Everything you mention goes back far before 9/11, and hasn't changed that much since. More evidence that the 9/11 movement is diverting energy and attention away from far more serious crimes -- and in this case crimes that are quite real and easily demonstrated.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]

ZNet Sustainer:Considering the long history of false flag operations to wrongly justify wars, our most recent precedent being WMD in Iraq, The Gulf of Tonkin in Vietnam, going back much further to Pearl Harbor (FDR knowingly allowing the Japanese to bomb Pearl Harbor * which is different from false flag operations), to the 1898 Spanish-American War, to the 1846 Mexican-American War, to Andrew Jackson's seizing of Seminole land in 1812 (aka Florida).[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]

Noam Chomsky: The concept of "false flag operation" is not a very serious one, in my opinion. None of the examples you describe, or any other in history, has even a remote resemblance to the alleged 9/11 conspiracy. I'd suggest that you look at each of them carefully.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]

ZNet Sustainer: Lastly, as the world's leading terror state, would it not surprise anyone if the US was capable of such an action? Would it surprise you? Do you think that so-called conspiracy theorists have anything worthy to present?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]Noam Chomsky: I think the Bush administration would have had to be utterly insane to try anything like what is alleged, for their own narrow interests, and do not think that serious evidence has been provided to support claims about actions that would not only be outlandish, for their own interests, but that have no remote historical parallel. The effects, however, are all too clear, namely, what I just mentioned: diverting activism and commitment away from the very serious ongoing crimes of state.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1]http://blog.zmag.org/node/2779[/SIZE]
mmm
 


He is wriggling every which way there to try and avoid the issue that the secret society network of which Bush as a skull and bones member is a part of is behind 911. The secret services of the west eg CIA, FBI, Mossad and MI6 are all also a part of the secret society network along with the jesuits

To answer his question: the people who have gained the most since the attack are the secret society network who have unleashed a surveillance, police state on us and who have enriched themselves through various banking scandals (they own the central banks) and are currently orchestrating a financial crash that will scare the bejesus out of the average US american far more than 911 ever did so that they will all in their state of utter fear and panic agree to the new option that the secret society network will present for them (a more centralised form of global government and a new currency).....not to mention everyone will have a microchip implanted under their skin
 
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.....have unleashed a surveillance, police state on us and who have enriched themselves through various banking scandals (they own the central banks) and are currently orchestrating a financial crash that will scare the bejesus out of the average US american f

these things can be true without 911
 
these things can be true without 911

911 provided the impetus to take the plan to the next level

That is the signature approach of the secret societies: order from the chaos

You only need to look at the ''strategy of tension'' approach used by the CIA in Operation Gladio (the CIA is a wing of the secret society network...see for example the many spiked star that is on their emblem. At the centre of this is the NATO star, which itself contains a swastika in the black portion of it)

''Problem, reaction, solution'' (Ike). You create a problem (a scary event) to induce a reaction in the public (fear) so that you can then get them to accept your solution (in this case the use of the US military to wage war in the middle east to dominate the oil of the region and to simultaneously wage a quiet war against the US public themselves by stripping away their rights, imposing a surveillance society on them, militarising the police, silencing dissenters and orchestrating further false flag attacks to justify the disarming of the american people

This is an old method outlined by the philosopher Hegel. He called it 'thesis, anti-thesis, synthesis'. The synthesis here being to create a new pearl harbour event (as stated in the fascist RAND corporation paper 'A Project for a New American Century') which would galvanise public opinion behind the actions the US government then took. Chomsky would under any other circumstance call this 'manufacturing consent'

The german banking families behind such occult orders as the germanordern, the thule society, the Ordo templi Orientis, the bavarian illuminati and the hermetic order of the golden dawn learned Hegels methods in the university of Berlin and have applied it

'Fear is the mind killer'-Bene Gesserit
 
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you mean this guy was working for KAOS all along?
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[video=youtube;O2AS_J0QZtU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2AS_J0QZtU[/video]
 
Muir do you think they believe in the occult religion or are they just "culturally occult"?
 
you mean this guy was working for KAOS all along?
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I mean like JFK said that it is a vast conspiracy that has gatekeepers in all significant areas of human life. Chomsky is supurbly placed as a lecturer, activist and public figure to guide people in certain directions. There will be many individuals who because Chomsky says he doesn't buy the 911 angle...they won't even entertain it

So for example if you look at Operation Gladio which was an operation to create stay behind armies in europe after world war 2 run by the CIA and NATO, their aim was to stop the spread of communism.

By 'communism' i mean proper communism...i mean the kind where the workers actually take over ownership and control of the means of production. This is one area where there seems to be widespread confusion. So the right wing guys who are talking about a 'communist plot' to destroy the US and create a centrally controlled one world government are missusing the term. That wouldn't be a true communist system because the means of production would not be owned and run by the workers. It would be owned and run by the bankers, the aristocrats and the royals

The old el-ite of europe has been the royal families, the aristocratic landowners who support the royal families and the church which has also been a massive land owner in Europe and has also always supported the royals and the aristocratic system of entitlement.

These groups or castes have worried for centuries about the workers taking over control of society, so they have violently suppressed them. They have created secret societies and secret services to achieve this end. One way to do this is to support fascism which they have often done because fascism protects the corporations which are simply wealth creating vehicles for the aristocrats, royals and church and their bankers of course!

The NATO stay behind armies were designed to stop the spread of workers movements in Europe and they didn;t care how they did it.....in other words they fight dirty

Operation Cointelpro in the US is an extension of this same paranoia of the Anglo-american el-ite that spans europe and the US, because the US grew out of europe. Like the stay behind armies cointelpro was intended to quell workers movements to stop them creating a more fair system where the workers would own and control the means of production

So you see the whole conspiracy is really a group of wealthy people wanting to hold on to their wealth and not wanting to share it with the workers. The way they invisage doing this in the future...indeed the only way they see that they can keep the inequality going....is to create an all powerful government which they will control to keep the workers down

So lets take this out of the realm of theory and look at some more real world examples

Here is the emblem of operation gladio:

150px-Gladio.png


In the emblem is the winged sword.

In the UK we have military group that are world famous after their busting of the iranian embassy seige which was all caught on the worlds cameras and shown on the news. It is of course the SAS (special air service). This group do not offically exist.

As far as we know they were created during world war 2 by a scottish aristocrat David Stirling. Here is their emblem:

150px-S.A.S_emblem.svg.png

It also contains a winged sword which i assure you is not a coincidence. Note the motto 'who dares wins'.....who dares indeed! Do they dare to pull off a false flag by crashing some planes in order to frighten the public and make them agree to all sorts of crazy shit? You betcha!

The sword is the roman short sword, the gladius. The romans used a 'fascis' as a symbol of power from which the word fascism is derived

The SAS has helped train these non official secret service armies all around the world for example australasia and also Germanys GSG-9

They have been involved in pushing back workers movements across the world for example in Oman and in the jungles of south america

Stirling himself was born to an aristocratic family with blood ties to the templar Maxwell family. The network of aristocratic families in Scotland have strong ties to freemasonry (and by default the knights templar) and the catholic church.

After the war Stirling helped to create a private defence contractor (ie mercenaries) which are essentially private armies for hire which the corporations can use to keep the workers movements down. Recent mercenary firm Blackwater aka Xe or whatever the hell they call themselves these days has been implicated in rapes and murders in all its theatres of operation for example Iraq, which is why it keeps re-naming itself....it is running from its own notoriety in the publics perception.

Stirling became worried about various workers movements in the 1970's when the trade unions were still militant and actually had some balls, and created a group recruited from aristocratic circles called ''Great britain 75''. This group was a secret army which was ready to seize the reins of power in the case of a workers uprising.

The group was also tasked with infiltrating, undermining and disrupting the trade unions. His group was funded by jewish banker James Goldsmith. A persistant rumour about james goldsmith is that due to the nature of his 'friendship' with princess dianas mother it is believed by some that diana might actually have been his child. This would make Prince William, the heir to the throne a blood member of the goldsmith clan.

Prince william has of course married kate middleton whose mother is a goldsmith. The goldsmith family intermarried with the rothschild family

Again and again you see it all boils down to: aristocrats, royals, bankers (seemingly always german jewish) and the roman catholic church who are all members of mystery schools that are themselves based on qabalah
 
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Muir do you think they believe in the occult religion or are they just "culturally occult"?

It gets very weird when you get into the occult

Essentially what they are doing is preparing themselves through magickal ritual for taking powerful psychotropic drugs. When on these drugs they are communicating with entities

They seem to have a preoccupation with sex and death. They are sex and death cults.

You can take drugs eg DMT and communciate with entities as well but that's not to say that you will then want to take over the world. So to what extent are the entities external and to what extent are they a projection of your subconscious mind?

So what happens when psychopaths start doing that and feeling that because they are receiving instruction from a 'higher power' they are justified to do whatever they are going to do?

I believe these cults are recruitment vehicles for psychopaths.

The rituals and the qabalah are used to communicate with entities and draw these entities to us. The more energetically charged you can make a ritual eg through: fear, sex, terror etc the more powerful the process will be.

I think a person with a pure heart using psychdelic drugs is going to have a very different trip to the one these guys are going to have

In egypt they had the blue lotus. The ancient greeks spoke of the lotus eaters living on an island off the coast of north africa.

In other parts of the world there are powerful mushrooms. The secret society mystery schools do not however want regular joes like you taking these drugs and exploring other realms because they want to control all avenues of human endevour....it is as Graham hancock says a 'war over consciousness'

That's why psychdelics are banned and why all fascist empires have stamped out shamanic traditions around the world and forced the bible on people instead....they do not want inner exploration!

The mystery schools also use the king making practices of the pharoahs which is to drink the fluid from the pineal gland of the dead pharoah. This is the most powerful psychadelic experience you can have (see for example the bit in the film 'fear and loathing in las vegas where hunter s thompson takes some of this). This would project the king into the stars (perhaps a form of astral projection)

The merovingean kingly line also used to do this and their skulls have been found with holes bored into them. They were known as magician kings.

What do you think the 'illuminated ones' need to do to gain their 'illuminated' status? Perhaps drink the pineal fluid of a child? Is it hard for men of power to find such items?

I don't think Kubrick would have thought so:

[video=youtube;wOZSfyLsFqE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOZSfyLsFqE[/video]
 
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[FONT=&amp]Seventy-two killed resisting gun confiscation in Boston![/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Boston – [/FONT][FONT=&amp]National Guard units seeking to confiscate a cache of recently banned assault weapons were ambushed by elements of a Para-military extremist faction. Military and law enforcement sources estimate that 72 were killed and more than 200 injured before government forces were compelled to withdraw.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Speaking after the clash, Massachusetts Governor Thomas Gage declared that the extremist faction, which was made up of local citizens, has links to the radical right-wing tax protest movement.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Gage blamed the extremists for recent incidents of vandalism directed against internal revenue offices. The governor, who described the group’s organizers as “criminals,” issued an executive order authorizing the summary arrest of any individual who has interfered with the government’s efforts to secure law and order.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]The military raid on the extremist arsenal followed wide-spread refusal by the local citizenry to turn over recently outlawed assault weapons.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Gage issued a ban on military-style assault weapons and ammunition earlier in the week. This decision followed a meeting in early this month between government and military leaders at which the governor authorized the forcible confiscation of illegal arms.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]One government official, speaking on condition of anonymity, pointed out that “none of these people would have been killed had the extremists obeyed the law and turned over their weapons voluntarily.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Government troops initially succeeded in confiscating a large supply of outlawed weapons and ammunition. However, troops attempting to seize arms and ammunition in Lexington met with resistance from heavily-armed extremists who had been tipped off regarding the government’s plans.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]During a tense standoff in the Lexington town park, National Guard Colonel Francis Smith, commander of the government operation, ordered the armed group to surrender and return to their homes. The impasse was broken by a single shot, which was reportedly fired by one of the right-wing extremists.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Eight civilians were killed in the ensuing exchange.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Ironically, the local citizenry blamed government forces rather than the extremists for the civilian deaths. Before order could be restored, armed citizens from surrounding areas had descended upon the guard units. Colonel Smith, finding his forces over matched by the armed mob, ordered a retreat.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Governor Gage has called upon citizens to support the state/national joint task force in its effort to restore law and order. The governor also demanded the surrender of those responsible for planning and leading the attack against the government troops.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Samuel Adams, Paul Revere, and John Hancock, who have been identified as “ringleaders” of the extremist faction, remain at large.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]And this fellow Americans, is how the American Revolution began, April 20, 1775.[/FONT]

[FONT=&amp]On July 4th, 1776 these same extremists signed the Declaration of Independence, pledging to each other and their countrymen their lives, fortunes, and sacred honor. Many of them lost everything, including their families and their lives over the course of the next few years.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Lest we forget…[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]- See more at: http://www.hourofthetime.com/wordpresstest/?p=11226#sthash.PQNbWnpe.dpuf[/FONT]
 
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