Questioning "introversion"

[Limit]

http://www.benziger.org/articlesIng/?p=30

Don't limit yourself to Jung alone, expanding your scope of study is always good.

The above described was confirmed via empirical research, not "hear and say". You may want to look up the references cited before you make that claim. It also helps us understand the mechanics of typology on a different, biological level.

Even though MBTI was used, this kind of research actually helps move away from it because it introduces to the people the possibility they may have mistyped themselves by adhering to silly extremist stereotypes of Introversion and Extroversion, which are more commonly equated with the degree of gregariousness in the type community.


http://aptinternational.org/assets/jptvol65_1105_apti.pdf

I actually didn’t limit myself to Jung. I purposely didn’t put the authors in, but each one is indeed from a unique author

It’s not so much “hearsay” as it is interpretations of interpretations. I just looked over the sources. There’s not one DIRECTLY from the source. I can discuss MBTI with Pat Wyman (http://www.patwyman3keys.com/aboutpat.htm/) who wrote books about MBTI, and I can tell you that she doesn’t know crap

This reminds me of Dr. Nardio. He’s no doubt a very educated Professor and his Jungian Test is one of the bests (few out there), but you even tell by his questions that he doesn’t have a clear understanding of the functions. A lot of his questions that are “Ti” categorized are mixed with other functions (along with all the other ones).

So yes, I see sources and I see some good informations, but LEARNING THE DEFINITIONS I BROUGHT TO THE TABLE IS REALLY GOING TO HELP WITH THE MISTYPES.

marahwhhwahrahrararaha

 

[arbygil]

Oy, now see, you've gotta be *nice* about it, Limmie...'cause when you're sarcastic, no one will want to play with you.

So, the question might be this: Who's theories accurately expand on Jung's functions and his interpretations of introversion/extraversion, and why?

 

[Limit]

Oy, now see, you've gotta be *nice* about it, Limmie...'cause when you're sarcastic, no one will want to play with you.

So, the question might be this: Who's theories accurately expand on Jung's functions and his interpretations of introversion/extraversion, and why?

I agree. I mean Benziger is actually a REALLY good source, I’m just stating that people should dig deeper and work up. Everything is being worked backwards, and I can understand. It’s a lot easier. Jung’s texts aren’t that easy to comprehend.

So I’d continue with Benzinger, but I’d still go to Jung first.

Jung, Bezinger, Hyde, Lenore Thompson. All good stuff, but start with Jung!

PS: Yes, I need to work on that. I know. I’m too quick to get frustrated. Type 8 over here. I want to get everyone angry and work within my anger to come to the realization. Almost like slapping people in the face. Definitely not always the best way.

 

[arbygil]

So Jung has a definition for introversion that's quite sound. I think we've talked about this extensively on our board, that introversion doesn't mean you don't talk a lot and you're quiet all the time, and extraversion doesn't mean a loud, boisterous party animal. It just is; it's where do you get your energy, and how you recharge.

I saw this example in another website the other day, and I found it remarkably apt:

What Are You?

Undertaking Myers Briggs will help you determine whether you are Extravert or Introvert, whether you use Sensing or Intuition, Thinking or Feeling, Judging or Perceiving. By the way, the words Extravert and Introvert were coined by Jung and have been absorbed into the English language but along the way the meaning (and the spelling) has altered a little.

To further explain the differences, when we commonly talk about people being extrovert we mean sociable and outgoing while we use introverted to mean shy and perhaps a little withdrawn.Jung had a different meaning! When he talked about an Extravert he meant those who orient their energy to the outer world,who gain their energy from looking outwards. Introverts direct their energy to their inner world.

Party Animals

Here is a short story to help make it clearer. It’s Friday night and my colleague and I have a work party we feel we ought to attend. At 4pm neither of us wants to go and we are whinging away about it while clearing our desks. However, we have given a commitment and it would be rude and unkind to pull out at this stage and so we go.

At the party we are both the life and soul. We talk to everyone; we get up and dance when asked (and even when not), we enjoy the food, the wine, the company and to all intents and purposes we have a great time and no one would ever know we hadn’t wanted to go.

But one of us is an extravert and one of us is an introvert – yet we have both behaved in the same way. My colleague is an introvert. She has genuinely enjoyed the party but it has taken its toll and she looks forward to getting home to her own space and curling up with a book. Then she will replenish herself and the energies she has expended doing something that doesn’t come entirely naturally to her. She needs her private time, although she is very sociable, has great social skills, and not at all shy.

I too am looking forward to going home and resting my weary feet and curling up in bed with a good book. But I have no need of replenishment. I have just gained enormous energy from being with people and doing what comes naturally. I still enjoy my private space, everyone needs a bit of time to themselves, but there is a qualitative difference between me and my friend.

Link: http://www.changingpeople.co.uk/tag/mbti/

 

[Limit]

So Jung has a definition for introversion that's quite sound. I think we've talked about this extensively on our board, that introversion doesn't mean you don't talk a lot and you're quiet all the time, and extraversion doesn't mean a loud, boisterous party animal. It just is; it's where do you get your energy, and how you recharge.
I saw this example in another website the other day, and I found it remarkably apt:



Link: http://www.changingpeople.co.uk/tag/mbti/

See, that

 

[arbygil]

See, that

 

[Limit]

And yet still, she discusses how stimuli affects her and her friend - that both enjoyed the party, but at the end one wanted to recharge while the other didn't need to recharge. I think there's merit in that as well, despite the MBTI designation. She understood Jung's POV, at any rate.

I agree, but to an extent. All definitions of introversion and extraversion are going to deal with the relation towards external stimuli. I

 

[arbygil]

I agree, but to an extent. All definitions of introversion and extraversion are going to deal with the relation towards external stimuli. I

 

[Peppermint]

If your functions are stimulated during conversation, so are you.

 

[Inquisitive]

Thx for posting @Peppermint but i am not arguing that the concepts of introversion or extroversion don't exist, as i completely agree with the article definition of the terms, but what i'm referring to is the continued use of the term introversion when it's been stereotyped into something which it isn't. Many here are describing the validity of the concept, which isn't in dispute, but rather the use of the term "introversion" which is often misleading because of the negative connotations assigned to it over a period of time, despite what we personally feel or think about what it means. I may value my "introversion" but on the other hand, i (as a generic i) am being judged for it negatively indirectly, if not directly, because of the negative stereotypes others associate with the term. And as much as i'd love to have the luxury of not caring what people think, which is not realistic, because we are affected by the social perceptions of others, it is better to use language which celebrates rather than perpetuates the stereotype. People are less likely to change their understanding of a term, and hold to what they think it means than to accept a new term which they have no past associations with.

@Anita

This is a very interesting topic. New words are born everyday and they can share new concepts.

Having done some work in this arena, I have dealt with specific word replacement to reshape perception before and it only succeeds for a time and to an extent. In the end the new word only replaces the old, while misconception remains. It seems that in terms of reshaping perception, the best work is done when you allow for an individual, or groups of individuals, to express their perception with the words they possess, and then using their vocabulary work to change it. When, in any campaign for change, new phraseology is used, new ideas “live” in the words. Such campaigns are typically multifaceted and target different demographics with different phraseology, but support the same theme and goal. Again this approach uses the established vocabulary within the target group to birth the new idea.

Anyway, on a side note, forgive me but I love the word “introversion”.

 

[Cyrus]

DO a lot of people view introversion as a bad thing? I've only ever heard it used as different than extrovert. But I've never heard anyone say its better to be an extrovert... ???

 

[Tulip]

An introvert CAN find people they can be around and feel like they NEVER have to recharge. I have talked to INTJs for HOURS w/o them feeling the need to recharge.

I

 

[Gaze]

@Anita

This is a very interesting topic. New words are born everyday and they can share new concepts.

Having done work in this arena, I have dealt with specific word replacement to reshape perception before and it only succeeds for a time and to an extent. In the end the new word only replaces the old, while misconception remains. It seems that in terms of reshaping perception, the best work is done when you allow for an individual, or groups of individuals, to express their perception with the words they possess, and then using their vocabulary work to change it. When, in any campaign for change, new phraseology is used, news ideas can “live” in the words. Such campaigns are typically multifaceted and target different demographics with different phraseology, but support the same theme and goal. Again this approach uses the established vocabulary within the target group to birth the new idea.

Anyway, on a side note, forgive me but I love the word “introversion”.

thx, agree. It's funny because i was hoping to open up a discussion about the use of language to define/describe experiences but epic fail . "Que sera, sera, whatever will be, will be" i guess - Doris Day.

 

[Bird]

I think you should learn the proper use
of the terms introversion and extroversion
in Jungian psychology.

 

[Gaze]

I think you should learn the proper use
of the terms introversion and extroversion
in Jungian psychology.

thx for responding.

 

[Pat Wyman]

Utilizing wrong Pat Wyman and wrong website in your quote

Please note that you referred to Pat Wyman, founder of HowToLearn.com and used a particular page on my website in your message. I am not the Pat Wyman who wrote Three Keys To Understanding and thank you for removing that comment about "she does not know crap" as well as my website from your comment.

Thank you and Happy Holidays.

 

[Gaze]

Thanks for all the comments. I can see from the responses why introversion is valued and appreciated. And i guess it really depends on the meaning we give it. It seems the word's a keeper

 

[arbygil]

The links have been fixed, Pat. If you have any other questions, please feel free to email me - I'm one of the administrators of this forum.

Take care.

 

[Limit]

Please note that you referred to Pat Wyman, founder of HowToLearn.com and used a particular page on my website in your message. I am not the Pat Wyman who wrote Three Keys To Understanding and thank you for removing that comment about "she does not know crap" as well as my website from your comment.

Thank you and Happy Holidays.

Oops, my bad. Google fail on my part.

Sorry about that. And you are correct, it was referenced to the Pat Wyman who wrote Three Keys To Understanding.

There. The link I meant to put up is now up. Thanks for whoever changed it originally.

 

[Limit]

I view myself as a true introvert regardless of how introversion is defined.

There is hardly anyone I talk to for hours that I don't feel the need to recharge. Any external stimulant drains me out and I normally need to shut myself off from the world in order to return to my equilibrium state.

Hmm.

Well the issue here is if we