INFJs, Changing or Losing Religious Faith | Page 2 | INFJ Forum

INFJs, Changing or Losing Religious Faith

melatonin said:
I feel like practicing a religion while growing up really gave me a solid foundation of morals and eventually led me to having a sense of identity and individualism.
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Although the rest of what you said was very great, I hate it when people say morals come from religion. It's possible to be an atheist and have morals that do not stem from a religion. I know you may not believe this but I hear it a lot from Christians when they ask atheists "Well, where do your morals come from?" I think they assume that 1. all morals are the same morals and 2. all morals stem from Christianity. What is not realized is that one can have different morals. I doubt Christianity invented "don't steal, kill, lie or cheat".

I had a freind in high school who was also muslim and she's going through something similar. She "just never felt it".
 
Religion is a part of many people's life. But it doesn't mean it has to make any sense. It's like non-religious culture which is theoretically useless. Personally I think that all people like to use symbols or signs. And religion is just someone's personal interpretation of world around.

About Christianity - it's a story about war which happened once on the coast of Mediterranean sea - why there is nothing about Christianity in Indian stories? Among Buddhists? Arabs? Answer this question yourself.

Why Christians are modern Europeans and Americans then? It's simple - conquest. Military power with a religious mask was a force that barely organised tribes couldn't resist. And even educated, "modern" societies are still haunted by the shade of gods fury. Of course before they grow strong and start to force their own visions.
 
bickelz said:
Although the rest of what you said was very great, I hate it when people say morals come from religion. It's possible to be an atheist and have morals that do not stem from a religion. I know you may not believe this but I hear it a lot from Christians when they ask atheists "Well, where do your morals come from?" I think they assume that 1. all morals are the same morals and 2. all morals stem from Christianity. What is not realized is that one can have different morals. I doubt Christianity invented "don't steal, kill, lie or cheat".

I had a freind in high school who was also muslim and she's going through something similar. She "just never felt it".
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Practicing a religion is what I'm talking about, not anything from its teaching specifically.

I grew up in an unstable and more or less impoverished area. If I hadn't been following a religion, anything at all, I probably would have taken my 'morals' from off the street. The fact that I had some sort of guidelines that weren't purely street smarts kept me in check. Having something like faith let me keep hope in my life, and it provided a foundation for some of my lifestyle choices today, if not a loose skeletal structure.

Of course, this was just from my personal experience. I know plenty of people who live in similar situations as non-religious, and they found their own way and developed their own morals that are generally considered 'good', whatever that means. I just don't know if I could trust myself to have any of that that on my own; I'm not sure how I would have coped considering I am a fairly unstable person, and even now I'm still dealing with my own identity.

I am at fault though; I should have elaborated in the first place, and I suppose my parents' influence gave me more structure than religion itself. I'm just glad they raised me as such, and I am very grateful for their understanding now after telling them I no longer wish to practice any faith.
 
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Billy said:
Whos that? Not that famous fictional character?
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It's the picture of a white man with a beard facepalming, I don't think he represents any one person in particular.
 
why shouldnt god prove his existence?
 
Jesus was Jewish. Christianity is a Jewish cult IMO. It is all subjective and dependent upon the individual as to faith, believe and all those things. One way is no better than any other. The best thing about being individuals is that you don't have to live my life and I don't have to live yours.
 
Sonya said:
Jesus was Jewish....just saying.
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There isn't any real evidence Jesus was even real lol. At least not the Bible version of Jesus... was there a Jewish end of the worlder "prophet" back over 2000 years ago? Well yeah the streets of Jerusalem were literally overflowing with them.
 
Billy said:
There isn't any real evidence Jesus was even real lol. At least not the Bible version of Jesus... was there a Jewish end of the worlder "prophet" back over 2000 years ago? Well yeah the streets of Jerusalem were literally overflowing with them.
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Yes, you are correct. If Jesus was real, he was Jewish.
 
Billy said:
I would ask for the proof, proof that can be verified via science, not conjecture.
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But if he already proved why should he have to prove it again?
 
Sonya said:
Yes, you are correct. If Jesus was real, he was Jewish.
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Would he be though? I mean, technically he started his own cult/religion with him being the king of all mankind... I think thats why he was sentenced to death by the Jews and then executed by the Romans. (if any of that is true) God it sucks not having an accurate record for this stuff, its like debating what Greg House would do *IF* he was real... sigh.
 
Billy said:
You didnt even attempt to answer the question, not even a little bit. Typical.
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See your not even trying to answer the question, typical.
 
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Billy said:
Would he be though? I mean, technically he started his own cult/religion with him being the king of all mankind... I think thats why he was sentenced to death by the Jews and then executed by the Romans. (if any of that is true) God it sucks not having an accurate record for this stuff, its like debating what Greg House would do *IF* he was real... sigh.
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Actually I believe his godhood wasn't determined until about 300 years after his death. By all reports (if he existed) he belonged to a rather strict Jewish sect. I haven't studied early Christain doctrine as much as my mother. I am not as interested in Christian dogma which makes me uninterested in Christian history. I'd much rather study something like Egyptian history which has a much broader and richer history than Christianity.
 
I find it interesting that if God created the universe eons ago, people demand that he prove himself through the format of science which was created by man at best hundreds of years ago... and is an ever changing format. It's kind of an arbitrary standard.

Carpenter: "I built this house 20 years ago."
Kid: "Prove it."
Carpenter: "Um, I can show you all around the house and point out everything I made."
Kid: "I grew up here and can point everything out too. That doesn't mean you built it."
Carpenter: "I can tell you how I did it."
Kid: "You could be making that up. I have a story for how the house was built too, involving ninjas and dump trucks!"
Carpenter: "I can tell you what it was like when I finished it."
Kid: "It wasn't like that when I moved in, and I've made some awesome additions on the walls with crayons."
Carpenter: "Funny thing. It doesn't matter if you believe me. The house exists, and I'm glad you are happy living in it. Also, do what you want with it. I made it for you."
 
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VH said:
I find it interesting that if God created the universe eons ago, people demand that he prove himself through the format of science which was created by man at best hundreds of years ago... and is an ever changing format. It's kind of an arbitrary standard.

Carpenter: "I built this house 20 years ago."
Kid: "Prove it."
Carpenter: "Um, I can show you all around the house and point out everything I made."
Kid: "I grew up here and can point everything out too. That doesn't mean you built it."
Carpenter: "I can tell you how I did it."
Kid: "You could be making that up. I have a story for how the house was built too, involving ninjas and dump trucks!"
Carpenter: "I can tell you what it was like when I finished it."
Kid: "It wasn't like that when I moved in, and I've made some awesome additions on the walls with crayons."
Carpenter: "Funny thing. It doesn't matter if you believe me. The house exists, and I'm glad you are happy living in it. Also, do what you want with it. I made it for you."
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The carpenter could also show pictures he took of the house in progress, as well as receipts for the materials used, and most carpenters sign their work all over the place in hidden places... I know, I am a carpenter. Plus your analogy is faulty, I dont want the carpenter to prove he made the house nor do I want god to prove he made me, I just want the carpenter to prove he exists, he can do that by ya know... existing.
 
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