INFJ Rage

G

Gaius Baltar

One
MBTI
MBTI
Hi folks,

Congrats on setting up an INFJ forum. Stick with it for a while, it'll be hard to get people to come around at first.

Anyways, I have some questions about INFJs. There are a few things that have been bothering me for a long time now, and I think talking to some neutral INFJs may help me solve these problems. Please understand that I am not here to judge anyone. I am seeking only to understand just what in the hell happened. Don't be afraid to be blunt and honest. I'm most certainly going to be so in the analysis I'm about to present.

I'm an INTJ. I'm a very rare type, so I don't naturally gel well with most people. I find INFJs to be fascinatingly rich people with an enormous potential to fill very unique niches. That's the problem though; the potential is never realized and something always seems to go wrong. It appears on the surface that an INFJ would be an excellent compliment to me, but it turns out I'm 0 for 2.

--
INFJ #1 - Female, early 20s at the time. I was roughly the same age.

Things built up quickly at the start after I met her through some mutual friends. We seemed to be able to connect with each other and vibe quite well.

She was heavily involved with a man who was at least 10 years older than her at the time. They were not married, but it had progressed to the point where they were living together. Personally, I despised the man. Loud, obnoxious, and tries to flaunt how smart he is. Bases most of his worth on how well he can babble on for hours about absolute nonsense and how much money he makes by working for himself. That's great and all, but most of it was just a cover for how much he's full of shit. Not to mention that I felt he was taking advantage of someone her age (I do not have a problem with people dating across a large age gap, but I really did feel like she wasn't quite at that level yet being just barely 21 and him being 30+.)

Regardless, it was none of my business who she chose to associate with. I could tell that the relationship was starting to wear on her. It just wasn't right for her anymore, and for whatever reason she didn't want to end it. She was quite young at the time, and I believe that it was her first serious relationship. She started seeing this guy at age 16 I think.

I once made a comment to some of our mutual friends about how I was concerned about their relationship. She wasn't happy and needed to take a serious look at things. My intentions were honorable and selfless.

It turns out that was a bad idea. One of the group gossipers didn't like me for whatever reason (most people hate INTJs), and started spreading my remarks around. It had somehow morphed into malicious intent and that I was intentionally trying to sabotage the relationship. This eventually got back to her.

When she heard about this, she got pissed. Livid. Absolutely enraged.

When she eventually confronted me about it, it was nasty. She was basically yelling and screaming at me for over an hour about it. Let me tell you, it was quite intense. Few people can really connect on my level and rattle me like INFJs can.

I was too immature at the time to have handled it properly. I mostly cowered and apologized profusely for things that weren't really my fault and for something that was blown completely out of proportion. I was interested in trying to salvage the relationship since I genuinely liked her. I was also quite pissed that she doubted my integrity like that. She took a known gossiper's word over mine simply because she knew him longer.

That was the end of that relationship. She did cool down after that, but she never forgave me. There was abolustely nothing I could say or do to get back on her good side. So as a true INTJ, I just cut my losses and eventually sank back into the shadows.

--
INFJ #2 - Female, mid 20s at the time. I was a bit older in my late 20s.

The story basically starts out the same. We get long great at first and start building up a friendship. Then, disaster strikes...

This time around was a bit different. It sort of evolved into an informal student/mentor relationship since I was able to connect well with her and she was a bit behind me on the maturity scale. I had already been down the path she had been down, and so I tried to help her through it. I also genuinely enjoy helping people grow and discover their power. I'm pretty big on personal development, so it worked at pretty well at first.

She was going through a pretty crazy period in her life. Going on a million dates with guys (and girls) she met online, sleeping with most of them. She kept running out there trying to get excitement in her life, only to get burned over and over again since she really is an introvert and needs to learn where her limits are. Combine that with the fact that she was out of college, but had no clue what to do with herself, and she really didn't understand how the real world operated. It was complete misery for her, and it was quite painful to watch.

I had been through a lot of the same issues she had (minus the sleeping around part). The world isn't built for INTJs or INFJs, so she quite literally had no other resources to help her rare type out.

There were a multitude of factors that caused this falling out. First, she had always told me that she loved talking to me because while most people would see a brick wall (typical INTJ trait), she didn't and wanted to figure out how I worked. However, this came with the warning that "I may end up hating you once I figure it out."

She also kept running back to a man who was very similiar to the man in secenario #1. I have no idea which specific type this is, but they're most definitely the same. Full of shit, trying to take advantage of a young girl, and really only interested in getting tail. I really have no idea why INFJs appear to be drawn to this particular type as they almost always end up miserable because of it.

So of course, I eventually let her know my feelings on this subject. It was not my place to tell her who she could and could not hang out with, but I saw some things that she didn't. This did not go over well since she was convinced that the guy was completely harmless.

She also hated talking about controversial topics with me. I felt that I had to wander into this territory from time to time mostly because of the bad programming she's received from society at large that was making her miserable.

She eventually came to the conclusion that I was some sort of evil racist simply because I have some politically incorrect views (INTJs are infamous at adopting things that work regardless of how people feel about them). Of course, it didn't help the fact that I sarcastically told her "Yeah, I'm racist!" during our last conversation (Another INTJ trait is to make sarcastic comments when an idea is absurd and we can't get though to someone. I was also tired of her calling me crazy constantly over the past few months anways.)

Our last conversation wasn't good at all. It was a complete repeat of scenario #1. The only difference is that this time, I stood my ground. I refused to feed her emotional fit, and I remained calm and rational.

Of course, this was also quite a permanent end. I had offended her to the point where there was absolutely nothing I could say or do to get back on her good side. Again, no forgiveness for me.

--
A few closing points:

-I understand that both of these INFJs were quite young. More stable and mature versions of this type might be that perfect compliment I was hoping for.

-You're only getting my side of the story. While I'm trying to be as objective as possible, it's hard to analyize since you're only getting one side.

-I admit that I might have done some wrong things in scenario #2. I'm not entirely sure what it was, however.

-It appears that these two women assumed that everyone was bad and nasty from the get-go. It's only a matter of time before people show their true colors, and I had apparently done so in both cases. I was tried and sentenced to death without a fair trial even though their anaylses were wrong.

-I can see them coming to these conclusions about most people, but INTJs are not most people. If they had actually understood me properly and still hated me, then I could accept that. However, they were both wrong and refuse to see it any other way.

-They both appear to love steamrolling people like a bully. It must seem to work with most people since these appear to be defense mechanisms that have been adopted quite some time ago. Of course, neither realized that they're dealing with an INTJ which resists any sort of manipulation to the hilt.

-They got so offended and angry that I think I would have gotten off lighter if I had actually just murdered their parents. I'm not exaggerating this rage in the slightest.

-They seem to be great at seeing how people operate under the hood, but they're miscalibrated. I had nothing but good intentions and yet I was identified as the devil. And yet the men they kept running to were nasty types, and they were identified as saints.

Anyways, INFJ rage is scary. I welcome any input from neutral INFJs. As you can tell, these issues have been bothering me for a long time, otherwise I would not have made such a long post. :P Just what in the hell happened, and can INFJs be excellent compliments to INTJs if they're more stable and mature?

Thoughts?
 
I loved this post. I can relate with those girls.

Ok, there are a few things you need to know about INFJs.

1. INFJs can be inherently distrustful of everybody. We can be constantly on the look out for hidden motives and agendas.
2. INFJs can be inherently paranoid. We can believe that it is only "a matter of time" before people's true inner demons come out.
3. INFJs can be inherently neurotic. We can begin seeing conspiracy plots and we could expect that people are "out to get us" or "out to control us" with exceptionally little information to support the suspicion.
4. INFJs can become histrionic and "wig out" in a melodramatic display of emotion.
5. INFJs can fall into a full out rage where they relentlessly and caustically attack at anyone who is in their path, or even utilize malicious insinuations.

But at the same time....

1. INFJs can put their complete trust in individuals and reveal their deepest selves.
2. INFJs can see the inner good and potential in people and work very hard to bring it out.
3. INFJs can foresee patterns and avoid disasters of which others may be oblivious.
4. INFJs can be incredibly stable and caring when others need them to be.
5. INFJs can be insightful, cool, and detached, and may seek compromise for the sake of harmony.

The reason for this is because INFJs feel hard. We tend to be a hypersensitive type, and so we feel everything much harder than everyone else probably does. That includes the good emotions and the bad. And since we absorb those from the environment so easily, they become us. So an INFJ is often a reflection of how they percieve their environment.

So your girls were probably very afraid, felt they had very little control over what was happening in their lives, and were seeking to understand all the negative feelings that were bombarding them. But INFJs seek to understand their emotions by doing, not reflecting, and the result is what you observed.

Or the short answer is...Fe is a bitch...especially when paired with Ni.
 
Thank you for sharing your experiences. I'll be sure to take them into account if I ever become close to an INFJ. :shock:
 
i concur with Satya

they were seeing something you probably would overlook
 
Satya, INFJs seem to experience extremes. That must suck. :(
 
batumi said:
Wow Satya, that was an incredible post. Very well-stated!!! Thank you.
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Thanks. :D

sriv said:
Satya, INFJs seem to experience extremes. That must suck. :(
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What did you think was meant by calling INFJs an "intense" type?
 
Just to look at something else slightly, did you feel like you violated their "rules" for the behavior of friends? Their response was very much as if you had backstabbed them, regardless of your opinions. You apparently did something they perceived as the ultimate in disloyalty or violation.

Yes, they were young and probably immature, and your lack of focus on the Fe thing (resulting in your coming out with some blunt statements, I can imagine) probably didn't help matters.

Watching my daughter (INFJ), though, she's very stubborn and strong-willed even at age ten. She takes small disagreements very personally, making them into a personal affront against her, and she hates feeling inadequate or to have others see her make a mistake -- she either gets mad and argues incessantly about how she's not wrong even if she is clearly making no sense whatsoever (and she knows it, that's partly why she's mad!), or she goes off and pouts and locks out the person who challenged her. I see a lot of that in the behavior of your friends too.

She's also got all the beautiful INFJ qualities mentioned. It's just in these situations where she feels slighted or criticized, she can become completely inaccessible and ruthless.
 
Satya said:
What did you think was meant by calling INFJs an "intense" type?
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I missed the "intense", but I did see the "Fe is a bitch".
 
I was thinking about INFJ rage today and I think I've only done it to another person a couple of times in my life. But the inner rage I feel at times is downright scary. When I feel it boiling up I have to fight very, very hard to keep it in because unleashed, I don't know, I fear it might never end. What usually helps me is getting out into the countryside, breathing and just being alone with nature. People will describe me as a gentle soul and laid back and although those are nice things to hear I often think, "Oh man if you knew the beast that lurks beneath!"
 
The beast within . . . well put. I used to be an angry child. I don't know that anyone knew it, but I would just explode sometimes for many reasons, most of which, now that I look back, should and could have been dealt with at the time the annoyance occurred. I've learned to control my temper, but to such a degree that sometimes it takes me awhile to realize when something has made me mad.

For example, years ago a friend of mine was telling a story about someone she knew, and stated " . . . she's worse than you! She actually is dumber than a box of rocks!!" At the time I got this funny feeling, but shrugged it off. . . however . . .

Two months later I'm in the kitchen making, oddly enough, Amish friendship bread. When it hits me. She had basically just told me that my level of intelligence barely exceeded that of pile of stones. I wasn't dumb, but I was pretty darn close.

I blew up. I was mad at her for the next two weeks, avoiding her, naturally, because I knew my anger was irrational. Eventually told her in a very calm manner how she had inadvertently offended me months before. And we had a discussion about what I percieved was her subconscious perception of me.

It's funny, looking back, but sometimes I cannot tell when I'm offended or upset. Unfortunately, though we are still the best of friends, sometimes she's on eggshells because of that one incident. And I can't help her b/c it's hard for me to identify my own intense anger.

Anyone else experience this delayed reaction to emotion stimuli?
 
I had been through a lot of the same issues she had (minus the sleeping around part). The world isn't built for INTJs or INFJs, so she quite literally had no other resources to help her rare type out.
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speak for yourself, the stars shine in the sky above for this INTJ.

Stay away from INFJ women is all I can say Gaius if you can't comprehend them. As to all the stereotypes for a INTJ.... not true. As a INTJ, we have the most maneuverability in beliefs and sticking to them. I can become fanatical about a religion, and reason myself out of it. It's the NTJ, and being introverted makes it a bit easier to be all over the spectrum, cause the relative lack of social pressures to corral us.

If you see your failing, INFJ rage or not, and you value your relations with these women, it's time to look at yourself, and adapt. Become different. Learn a system of behavior or of values different from the one you currently possess, and hopefully the field tests of the new you will be more successful.

Adapt and overcome
 
sumone said:
People will describe me as a gentle soul and laid back and although those are nice things to hear I often think, "Oh man if you knew the beast that lurks beneath!"
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I can relate to that all too well. It took years before I could learn to express my anger in a healthy way instead of immediately suppressing it. I used to get so incredibly angry at people for various situations where they put me down and reimagine those situations so that I would come out on top instead. Sometimes I would imagine "saying the right thing" and others it would just be me busting into some ninja moves and rearranging their face. It certainly made me feel better about my rage, but it may have also prolonged it. And I fear that I was sometimes much more accepting of the fantasy than the reality, so I was probably pretty close to a psychosis.

Kwistalline said:
Anyone else experience this delayed reaction to emotion stimuli?
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My old friends used to play with it. I think INJ children need time to process things and so "faster" children can easily manipulate or make fun of them.

Onasander said:
Adapt and overcome
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Them sounds like INFJ words there. ;)
 
First off I would like to remind you that the INFJ can TOTALLY flip on their values in a time of crisis. This seems so awful to those that are "lucky" enough to be close to an INFJ because it is totally opposite of why you like them.. ironic huh

In story 1 its not that you did really anything wrong.. you just did something wrong to her. We INFJs process right and wrong based on our own needs. What happened in story 1 is common for most INFJs, so here ya go... She was a private person.. she believed in you and believed you believed in her... Her beliefs pertaining to this, well, loud guy we evidently not communicated to you.. BUT she believed they were. This woman probably was in a rescue mission... I know it could be hard for you to see this... but most likely she was with this man because he wasn't right for her. Here is where you come in. You made light of her rescue mission and made a truthful comment or two about her relationship. She knows what you said was true... she knows what you said was probably because you cared. The problem arises is that you TOLD OTHER PEOPLE SHE DID NOT TRUST. YIKES!!! INFJ will befriend everyone to an extent.. but TRUST maybe 1% of their friends... You were in this trust group and spilled the beans to the notrusted group.. Her flip was totally to show you why she or any INFJ really, trust 1% of their friends. Rather than tell you she was disappointed or mad.. etc.. she decided to make you hate her (temporarily even).. It doesnt help that the INFJ knows how to hurt their friends to their core... but it is something that happens naturally. I hope you learn that the INFJ trusts very few people. If you are in this trust group. Fight, accept, or help support their mission. If you dont know what that mission is... that does not mean they dont believe you do.

Basically if you can see there is something wrong... you are trusted to some extent.

I hope this helps ya out.
 
I thought this would be a good one to bring back..
 
I don't understand why you care so much.

Hrm.

You need to adopt a new mind frame. A more apathetic, objective, all encompassing and thus, healthier mentality.:)
 
Melkor said:
I don't understand why you care so much.

Hrm.

You need to adopt a new mind frame. A more apathetic, objective, all encompassing and thus, healthier mentality.:)
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Yeah, I could probably use a lot of life-style changes.
 
Bitter much? The OP must really have wanted an INFJ. Honorable, selfless, objective and objective? wow... i was lol-ing at my desk!
 
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