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Discussion in 'Relationships and Sociology' started by Asa, Feb 13, 2019.

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  1. Pin

    Pin "Magnificent Bastard" / Ren's Counterpart

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    I could use something like that to fill me up too. :laughing:
     
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  2. BritNi

    BritNi Perceptive Optimist

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    Thanks!!!

    The guys I've been with have has much prettier eyelashes than myself. It sucked. Because, they were able to bat those stupid things at me and get whatever they wanted from me.

    Damn Brit, falling for the puppy face. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

    Now I curl my lashes, put mascara on, look in the mirror and bat my lashes at myself.

    It's sexy.

    Lol.
     
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  3. BritNi

    BritNi Perceptive Optimist

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    *Gives Pin an ice cream cone with all the sprinkles on top*
     
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  4. Hostarius

    Hostarius Thermobaric

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    So where'd you meet the lucky guy/gal?
     
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  5. BritNi

    BritNi Perceptive Optimist

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    I've known him for a while. We've been friends. It's just a fun night that both of us need. Nothing serious. But it's nice getting dressed up and hanging out. =}
     
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  6. Hostarius

    Hostarius Thermobaric

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    :) Indeed
     
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  7. Gaze

    Donor

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    Question: Do you find it easy, as a woman, to believe and acknowledge that you're good at something? Or do you often question it? Whether because of imposter syndrome or other reasons. Or do you just see what you do as "this is just how it's done," and move on? Do you think women don't get enough credit for the things they are good at because we don't see doing something well as special, maybe because we see it as something we should do or are supposed to do to prove that we can be good at it?

    To add to the conversation, I'm going to post a video by Michelle Obama about this topic. Note: I'm not posting this to be political. Not about agreeing with or liking the "Obamas." Not the point, just to be clear. I'm posting the video because of her description of the way she experienced in her words "imposter syndrome." So, do her points ring true? Or not? If so, what's missing from the conversation about women appreciating themselves more and acknowledging their strengths and talents?



    And here's a TED Talk by Lou Solomon on the Imposter Syndrome. What do you think?





     
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  8. OP
    Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    Great question @Gaze!

    Thanks for including these videos, too.

    I have imposter syndrome about my art. It's bad enough that I'm not even sure that is truthful to say.

    Being female has something to do with it, but I think personality and life circumstances factor in, which would be lengthy and off-topic to explain. Female artists are undervalued and overlooked and I've definitely been overlooked (for my art) due to gender while also being objectified. A lot of male artists talk down to me, which is simultaneously hilarious and aggravating. They'll speak to me like I'm completely new at making art, mansplain, etc, and the men who behave this way are usually the men with no formal training who are clearly less talented than I. Male artists, at least in my circles, also tend to peacock, and that isn't how I am.

    I really liked what Michelle Obama had to say about being told that she didn't belong in certain places, certain schools, etc, and how the men were raised to believe they belonged but that belonging isn't based on merit. I'm glad she challenged the nay sayers.
     
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  9. Sandie33

    Sandie33 Love Often & Absolutely ♡
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    Thanks for this @Gaze.
    I went and watched the entire Michelle and Julia video. Very strong points are covered. Being unfamiliar with Imposter Syndrome until hearing about it in the forum, I've gone on to analyse how it fits, or not, with some of my own life struggles.

    These are good questions to ponder. Thank you again for bringing this to us. ;)
     
  10. Sandie33

    Sandie33 Love Often & Absolutely ♡
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    This ^^^
    My self worth through my younger years had been stunted because of the words of others, not just males. I did not persue an Art degree in HS because the male guidance counselor said artists starve, and the secretarial program would suit me better. At the time, I scored highest on the mechanical and scientific section of our testing. To me that was high achievement, to the educational coaching staff it was an anomaly. I laugh thinking back to that. I didn't have the self-discipline to act differently, far too much value was put on what others thought of me. Even with proof in their hands, I was left feeling I still wasn't good enough to pioneer through a male dominated career like engineering, artist, or architect. I did take mechanical drawing, wood and metal shop, calculus, and elementary trigonometry as 'ellective' classes as a means to stick with what my plan was. As a result of the advisors wants, istead of having a general studies diploma at graduation to go into my chosen career, I had a business diploma. It did land me a job as a night office manager in a department store at 19, but I hated it.

    I was removed from art class in 9th grade for behavioral issues as said by the teacher. I have always been sassy and defiant under certian circumstances...however, hindsight has led more to my belief she felt threatened somehow by my level of talent, and she removed the threat.

    It's my belief every person has an artist in them, with the right medium it's very apparant. I'm drawn to mixed media, to me that is closer to my reality. Until I found out that label boxed one into a certian 'style' of expression, and that isn't me ... labels and boxes turn me off. I'm still unable to critique others work honestly because I see all art as how it's intended to convey a message, even stick figures tell a story.

    There were many life circumstances that prevented me from getting the education I wanted; however, I can thumb my nose at all of those coaches and advisors from my school days. I have a administration degree and a graphic arts degree. The result of self-determination and rebellion to being told I can't.

    Now that I know about Imposter Syndrome much of my younger life makes absolute sense now. To some extent, I still question my self worth. However, I don't spend much time there, erasing the conditioning of others takes time, ... a lot of time. :D
     
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  11. OP
    Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    @Sandie33 much of what you said resonates with me, particularly because we are close in age and we also grew up in the same general area. I almost laugh at how these early building blocks (childhood, teen years, high school, etc) influence the adult we all became. I think women born a decade later had a different experience, at least in the US.
     
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  12. Sandie33

    Sandie33 Love Often & Absolutely ♡
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    I would agree Asa. The key is recognizing opportunity. I'm referring to honest opportunites, not the cutthroat type of modern day.

    ***My mother was a huge catalyst and early support for me to reach for my dreams. A short story about her is, back when she was 16 she made half of the front page on the big town's newspaper. Being a girl, it was frowned upon to shoot any type of gun. No lady would do this according to her mother and peers at the time. At 16 she landed the largest Whitetail, with one shot, recorded against all entries in the whole county. Thus the newsclipping in her picture box now. She pissed a lot of the good ole'boys crowd off. Fast forward to me at 14 asking my Dad to take me out for small game hunting. He said I had no business in the woods, even calling me a sissy and said I couldn't hit the boadside of a barn a couple of times. You see, I wanted to go with camera and 22. He still said no. He was indeed partly correct. I had no inkling to kill animals. The only ones I ever had to kill was at a time the animal was suffering and I felt no recourse or the occasional coyote because it was a danger. I did want to film animals in their natual homes though.
    Dad found out I inherited my mothers keen sight, because one day we were shooting up clay pigeons and I beat him hands-down. He'd grown up in an area and era that if you couldn't hunt you didn't eat. He shook my had that day with a well done Daughter...I held his hand a little longer and told him not to tell me I can't do a thing, lol.

    And so it has been since an early age when some one says I can't, my reply generally is, I can, and I will, it may take me a little longer, but I do. ;)
     
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  13. OP
    Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    @Sandie33,

    That is an interesting story. Your mom sounds awesome! Way to go, Sandie Mom! Everything about this story seems so "Sandie" to me as well. Keen eye, a good shot, with no desire to harm but an ability to do so as needed.

    My grandfather was an award winning sharp shooter and a gunsmith. Everyone in my family knew/knows how to shoot, including his first wife in the 1920s all the way through my generation of grandchildren. The women were both ladylike and knew how to handle horses and guns.
     
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  14. Sandie33

    Sandie33 Love Often & Absolutely ♡
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    Dawn. Fitting name for her ;)

    Too cool :D
     
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  15. OP
    Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    I'm waiting for @Gaze's input on the topic, too. :) What's your experience with Imposter Syndrome, Gaze?
     
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  16. Gaze

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    Thank you @Asa and @Sandie33 for sharing!

    My experience with imposter syndrome is iffy. Growing up, I wasn't told I couldn't do things. In high school, I went to an all girls high school. We were competitive but didn't have the typical concerns of fighting or competing with boys/men for recognition. We were pretty much taught we could do anything as long as we worked hard. However, it was still a traditional culture with many conservative customs about a women's place in the home. But my father is the one who suggested I take classes in Computer Science, to give me an advantage, at a time when technology wasn't really yet an integral part of the everyday world, early 90s.

    Actually, in some ways, I was expected to be good at things I really didn't like or care about that much e.g. math. I really wasn't good at math. :D The things I was good at, were things that put me in the spotlight, were not always easy to embrace because it's seen as different or unusual for introverted personalities. For me, that was performing. Sometimes, doing the things you like or love makes you feel good but to others can make you look like or feel like a caricature or childish. I just remember not being taken seriously when I was young, which makes it harder to think you have anything to contribute. I loved reading and literary analysis, except when it's dry.

    I spent most of my childhood to college age judging who I was by everyone else's standards or estimations, so I didn't think much of myself except religiously since that was a huge part of my life until then, or think much of what I liked or enjoyed until I got into my late 20s and 30s. Again, late bloomer. This meant, I didn't think much of my own knowledge, understanding, or intellect outside of repeating what was taught to me. It's only when I left the educational system and started connecting people in the real world, processing my own experiences through my own lens, understanding more through personality theory, and receiving positive comments about thoughts I've shared that I realized I was smart enough and had good insights.

    I don't think I ever thought I was truly smart. I think I wanted to feel smart. I wanted to believe I was quite intelligent, but never really believed it. If I knew anything, I just assumed that of course, it was from what was told to me. I didn't think I had natural talents or cognitive ability.

    The closest I've gotten to impostor syndrome is doing well on something and people being surprised by it. It was sooo unexpected. I think there was the sense that someone socially awkward as I was wouldn't be able to think critically or reason well.

    So, for me, I'm never quite sure, impostor syndrome applies to me because having the impostor syndrome means you are far more capable than you know or are lead to believe. For me, I feel like an impostor because I am still not sure if I can be confident in a set of abilities I may or may not have. I think it's like anyone else, you do what you know how to do. I'm also fearful of someone telling me something is great, because I think, maybe they're just saying that to be nice. But I'm more fearful of the idea that there's always someone who is going to be able to say, "It's not good enough." And then I have to remind myself that it is. :)
     
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    #156 Gaze, Jan 16, 2020
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  17. Sandie33

    Sandie33 Love Often & Absolutely ♡
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    Thank you for sharing about you Gaze ;)

    Have you continued on with performing? What I mean is, do you have opportunities now to continue doing this? I recall our discussions about your jewelry making, do you still work at it?
     
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  18. Gaze

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    Thanks Sandie! :)

    Well, performing is something I like but don't do seriously, just once in a while. I did restart making some jewelry recently and I'll share in my blog. For a while, I wasn't doing any because work got busy, but I'm trying to get up the courage to think I can sell online, though it hasn't worked out before. I'm trying to make nicer and better pieces. So, we'll see. Thanks for asking!
     
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    #158 Gaze, Jan 18, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2020
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    Asa

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    Thank you for sharing, Gaze. I will check out your blog to see the jewelry.

    Both of these quotes sound like you have imposter syndrome, but also like you had self esteem issues.
    I'm sure you do some things well and that you are intelligent, BTW. <3 There will always be people who will praise you to make you feel good and say someone else can do it better because they like tearing others down. It doesn't mean what you're doing isn't good or worthwhile.
     
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  20. Gaze

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    Thanks. I guess it's just that calling myself an impostor sounds like I'm hiding some secret genius I haven't fully embraced yet. I think it's healthier in general for us all to feel we can be good at the things we do, without thinking it's some kind of fluke. A lot of what we do is hard work and effort. Still not sure what % can be chalked up to natural talent or ability, (speaking for myself).
     
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