Do you believe in Astrology? ? | Page 4 | INFJ Forum

Do you believe in Astrology? ?

The answer would be that - as for any natural ability one has such as the innate ability to dance or sing or to paint (art) or anything else for that matter - one would like to be able to live from these natural ablilities they have rather than, in order to live, doing something else not related to their natural abilities.

Would you ask a natural singer to work as a waitress (...or waiter) and require them to sing and not be paid for their natural ability to sing?
Would you ask a natural singer to work as a waitress (...or waiter) and require them to sing and not be paid for their natural ability to sing?
No...but then again I do not require anything of any one...but many do hold down service jobs while they persue other passions involving natural abilities. In the case of the example of a natural singer...many sing choir for free and work at something else while waiting for their "big break" which allows them to earn a living from their natural ability to sing. Often a person believes they can sing yet when heard they couldn't carry a tune in a bucket. Then there are others still that have voices which sound heavenly and have served me my scrambled eggs and coffee in more than one diner.
...what ever That may be...This context is akin to asking a woodcarver to wait 20 years for the trees he planted to be large enough to cut and whittle down...life is contextual and wrought with opinions. We are lucky to have such choices.
 
No...but then again I do not require anything of any one...but many do hold down service jobs while they persue other passions involving natural abilities. In the case of the example of a natural singer...many sing choir for free and work at something else while waiting for their "big break" which allows them to earn a living from their natural ability to sing. Often a person believes they can sing yet when heard they couldn't carry a tune in a bucket. Then there are others still that have voices which sound heavenly and have served me my scrambled eggs and coffee in more than one diner.
...what ever That may be...This context is akin to asking a woodcarver to wait 20 years for the trees he planted to be large enough to cut and whittle down...life is contextual and wrought with opinions. We are lucky to have such choices.
Though I do not disagree with the above, I do not see its relevance to your former quote...


Truth-This is where I get derailed. I've not understood why a person, if they truly have the gift of foresight, needs to be paid to give their insights. (?) Greed is a mighty powerful tool...Mutch heavier than any deviation one could muster. IMHO...it's folks looking to make a fast $$$buck on anothers niaevites and vulnerabilities.
Why shouldn't someone who has the natural ability to provide insights because of the 'gift' of foresight be reasonably paid for their talents and abilities?

Why do you liken a person who has natural foresight to being 'greedy' and 'looking to make a fast buck'?

I had read the Tarot 'professionally' - tea rooms, cafes, etc. (...I do not do parties or groups) and consider my time and abilities to be worth some modicum of exchange, though ethically, if the cards 'say' nothing to me - for whatever reason - then I inform the person and accept no exchange whatsoever.
Being as the Tarot, and related subjects - such as symbols, archetypes, dreams, the unconscious, the Qaballah in relation to the Tarot, etc. - is what I spend the most of my time studying, this is my 'chosen profession'.

I am not "looking to make a fast $$$buck on anothers niaevites and vulnerabilities". In terms of MBTI, my innate Fe demands that I provide assistance to someone seeking clarification to questions or situations that concern their life. The Tarot is my chosen 'tool' in order to reflect the person's own clarification back to them. The person already knows the answers to questions or situations - one merely need to 'see' them, and the Tarot provides that by going deeper than the surface.
Also, my Ni demands I seek wisdom and truth - for myself and the world at large.

I did not consciously go out seeking the Tarot... in fact, I had not even thought about the subject or the occult or arcane in general. My first two Tarot decks were given to me by people I knew. This is what threw me into studying the Tarot, and its history, in depth. It was later when I was asked if I could read for a friend of someone I knew by that friend that I first read the Tarot for someone - and that person insisted that I receive money in exchange for the clarification.

My apologies to the O.P. for the tangent this thread has taken...
Hello everyone.....I have recently started tsking interest in Vedic Astrology...
To my surprize....the predictions are matching my life story. ...... Is there anyone who also believes in it??? I definitely believe....:)
...I believe my previous post answered this question sufficiently.
And any further discussion on the subject of payment for natural abilities should probably be moved to a new thread.
 
Though I do not disagree with the above, I do not see its relevance to your former quote...



Why shouldn't someone who has the natural ability to provide insights because of the 'gift' of foresight be reasonably paid for their talents and abilities?

Why do you liken a person who has natural foresight to being 'greedy' and 'looking to make a fast buck'?

I had read the Tarot 'professionally' - tea rooms, cafes, etc. (...I do not do parties or groups) and consider my time and abilities to be worth some modicum of exchange, though ethically, if the cards 'say' nothing to me - for whatever reason - then I inform the person and accept no exchange whatsoever.
Being as the Tarot, and related subjects - such as symbols, archetypes, dreams, the unconscious, the Qaballah in relation to the Tarot, etc. - is what I spend the most of my time studying, this is my 'chosen profession'.

I am not "looking to make a fast $$$buck on anothers niaevites and vulnerabilities". In terms of MBTI, my innate Fe demands that I provide assistance to someone seeking clarification to questions or situations that concern their life. The Tarot is my chosen 'tool' in order to reflect the person's own clarification back to them. The person already knows the answers to questions or situations - one merely need to 'see' them, and the Tarot provides that by going deeper than the surface.
Also, my Ni demands I seek wisdom and truth - for myself and the world at large.

I did not consciously go out seeking the Tarot... in fact, I had not even thought about the subject or the occult or arcane in general. My first two Tarot decks were given to me by people I knew. This is what threw me into studying the Tarot, and its history, in depth. It was later when I was asked if I could read for a friend of someone I knew by that friend that I first read the Tarot for someone - and that person insisted that I receive money in exchange for the clarification.

My apologies to the O.P. for the tangent this thread has taken...

...I believe my previous post answered this question sufficiently.
And any further discussion on the subject of payment for natural abilities should probably be moved to a new thread.

This is my remarks/opinion regarding the issues in it's original context:
Yes, most readers have an intuitive filter or knowing to guide them through deciphering astrological actions. Astrology is a tool, useful as a guide to outline your current path. If one believes in reincarnation you can figure how many and when you were here before, what you have learned, and what you must learn in this life. Many "tools" such as astrology, water scrying, tea leaves, tarot, magic, runes, numerology, and many others were brought about as a means to make tangible the intangible. A form of "proof"."Knowing" is intangible and often unexplainable to some one who does not experience it.


Yes, this. :) Find the validity of what is there in the reading. Ask how it fits you personally. A reading can be done for someone and you can bet with a bit of skepticism that someone will do the exact opposite of what is read for them.


Truth-This is where I get derailed. I've not understood why a person, if they truly have the gift of foresight, needs to be paid to give their insights. (?) Greed is a mighty powerful tool...Mutch heavier than any deviation one could muster. IMHO...it's folks looking to make a fast $$$buck on anothers niaevites and vulnerabilities.
Many folks who seek out rag sheet horoscopes and charlatans should instead look within themselves...because there lies all they need no know. :)

"Many folks who seek out rag sheet horoscopes and charlatans should instead look within themselves...because there lies all they need no know."

I agree, to the OP an appology is due for the tail spin this thread has taken.
However, I do not understand how you twisted my opinion into a personal attack toward your abilities as a Tarot reader.
Please note this part in my quoted opinion:
...Many "tools" such as astrology, water scrying, tea leaves, tarot, magic, runes, numerology, and many others were brought about as a means to make tangible the intangible. A form of "proof"."Knowing" is intangible and often unexplainable to some one who does not experience it...
Meaning:
For those who are unable to "see", "read", or have the gift of "knowing", "second sight", clairvoyance, etc. These tools were designed by their originators to make thought (the intangible) come to light so they(the client) may "see" (tangible, for example the Four of Cups Tarot card, Or, Sun squared by Pluto) what it is the reader is trying to convey.

...Because there are bullshit con artists who take advantage of others' lack of knowledge in how these things(for example Horoscopes and Divination tools) work:

Many folks who seek out rag sheet horoscopes and charlatans should instead look within themselves...because there lies all they need no know.
Meaning: the client has the resources to seek truth in knowledge and not be taken advantage of.

...perhaps my statement was a bit over-the-top for some. However, it is my understanding that this forum and the threads within it (except for the selection of personal blogs) are just that...open to exchange of opinion, ideas, thoughts and insights.

if the cards 'say' nothing to me - for whatever reason - then I inform the person and accept no exchange whatsoever.
Thank you for your ethics in what you do.

My comments were not directed as a personal attack toward any one for any purpose. My issue with being paid for claiming to be gifted lies on the desk of those that get paid for script reading or preplanned answers to folks that sincerely believe the person can help them in some way and have faith in that person to help them find an answer to their issue.
To respond to this request if one has the ability to do so, is and should be an act of kindness. When doing kindness there are no expectations of payment...if there is you are then doing business not kindness. I'm hopeful this clarifies things a bit better in regards to my postings. Perhaps the OP is not the only one due an appology?
 
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However, I do not understand how you twisted my opinion into a personal attack toward your abilities as a Tarot reader.

I did not take it as such, but if I came across as that way ...my apologies.

This is the section I had concern with, in particular, the first sentence...

Truth-This is where I get derailed. I've not understood why a person, if they truly have the gift of foresight, needs to be paid to give their insights. (?) Greed is a mighty powerful tool...Mutch heavier than any deviation one could muster. IMHO...it's folks looking to make a fast $$$buck on anothers niaevites and vulnerabilities.
Many folks who seek out rag sheet horoscopes and charlatans should instead look within themselves...because there lies all they need no know. :)

What I did not see, was that this was an answer to an original statement not in the quote I saw, which was this statement from ImaginaryBloke...

"Crap astrology. As others have mentioned, papers publish crap astrology. They are there to make money, they have no interest in their readers. Readers are cash cows" (http://www.infjs.com/threads/do-you-believe-in-astrology.31276/page-3#post-919283)

...so, your statement did not read to me as refering to Imaginary Bloke's statement, but as a blanket statement.

My comments were not directed as a personal attack toward any one for any purpose.

I did not take it as such, but if I came across as that way ...again, my apologies.

My issue with being paid for claiming to be gifted lies on the desk of those that get paid for script reading or preplanned answers to folks that sincerely believe the person can help them in some way and have faith in that person to help them find an answer to their issue.

I would agree with this. This was the part that I missed somehow (and Imaginary Bloke's statement) and which led to my misinterpretation of your statement. So, my fault here.

Getting back to the original post concerning opinions on Astrology, I do not consider Astrology a useful tool at all, as its foundations are arbitrary, culturally biased, and based on conjecture and assumptions - as I stated in my above post. Any form of Astrology is not helpful at all as it only defines an individual in accordance to its unfounded and out-dated historical information.
This is not based on opinion, rather on years of questioning, research, and testing.

The Tarot is a much more useful 'tool' for discovering 'what lies beneath', as it does not define, it illuminates, especially taken in the light of the work of people such as Carl Jung, Clarissa Pinkola Estés, Jean Shinoda Bolen, and Joseph Campbell.
Basic Numerology is helpful as well, but only so far as illuminating an individuals general path and the expression of that path.

As far as 'definitions' of personality are concerned, I put much more stock in MBTI than Astrology.

But again, I digress, as I am wont to... so, these subjects are for other threads.
 
I believe on Astrology. Definite NO!!!!

What they come up with are so shamefully superficial, biased, and very assumption based. Subconciously they put in some "truth" to try to make you believe in a certain personality that you are born a particular way, so I never tell nor mention others about the date of my birthday just in case prejudges come, as people go look at my horoscope.

What ended up was, people got my horoscope wrong. "Hey you are Planet *.. Are you sure your birthday is right?!" But if I say they are totally not real, then it's not something that is entirely good. However totally judgemental and distorted beyond a lot of things.
 
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I do not know much of Vedic Astrology but I practice just plain Western Astrology. Do I believe in it?

I'm afraid so.

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I know this is not a popular choice among my INFJ colleagues but I would be lying if I said I did not believe. Interpreting Astrology charts has always come easy to me.

This is Hillary Clinton's chart. Give it a try.


ZF4jZmcVGGHlpTuBA2tlIwHjZQNjZQNjZQNj.png
 
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I guess it wouldn't be fair if I didn't include Donald Trump's Astrology chart.

ZF4jZmcHFaWyJaNmrJEkDyNjZQNjZQNjZQNj.png
 
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I like astrology. Everyday horoscope pages are pretty lame. But otherwise I think there is some value in it I think (If you don't take it too literally). There's a lot there if you think about the various categories of cardinal fixed and multiple signs and the elements earth water air and fire. Plus where the moon and ascendant are.
 
I do not know much of Vedic Astrology but I practice just plain Western Astrology. Do I believe in it?

I'm afraid so.

16253476739_65058a25ac_z.jpg


I know this is not a popular choice among my INFJ colleagues but I would be lying if I said I did not believe. Interpreting Astrology charts has always come easy to me.

This is Hillary Clinton's chart. Give it a try.


ZF4jZmcVGGHlpTuBA2tlIwHjZQNjZQNjZQNj.png
Hilliary has a lot of watery influence with all that Scorpio and Pisces influence...and she is a Scorp to boot! Explains why she is such a determined (Scorp is stubborn &driven) idealist (big dreaming Pisces). Will be interesting to see where she drives the US once she's elected Commander In Chief :)
 
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I guess it wouldn't be fair if I didn't include Donald Trump's Astrology chart.

ZF4jZmcHFaWyJaNmrJEkDyNjZQNjZQNjZQNj.png
He can't really be a Gemini?? Wow.

Thank you for sharing this! With all his energy focused in one quadrant (NW) no wonder he is limited in his thinking...it explains all the boarder talk and his need to tighten things inward when it comes to the country.

Since many, if not most Gem's are on an infernal search for 'The Missing Twin'...perhaps Donald should refocus his efforts on finding the other half (nice side) of himself, find integration and persue the presidency in his next lifetime :p
 
Maybe we could have a sun sign thread @Zen, your the expert, maybe if you think it's a plan it'd be good for you to oversee it?

Sorry not intending to micro-manage!

I think it's funny that I'm Sagittarius but my virgo moon is a very strong factor. I think they're really different signs but also strike me as quite similar in some particular ways. Sagitarrius is expansive and restless and virgo is finicky and a bit of a worrier, but also dedicated, into serving others, introspective and likes writing etc. I think they're both quite particular and individualistic signs though.

Sorry I just noticed that this thread was started by @Ila and not @Zen, apologies.
 
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I know this is not a popular choice among my INFJ colleagues but I would be lying if I said I did not believe. Interpreting Astrology charts has always come easy to me.

This is Hillary Clinton's chart. Give it a try.


ZF4jZmcVGGHlpTuBA2tlIwHjZQNjZQNjZQNj.png


Double Scorpio...that explains some things...

scorpius-smile.jpg
 
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I've noticed that sometimes I'll get a similar vibe from one person as what I get from someone else, and quite often they will turn out to have the same astrological sign. So yeah I think there is truth to it.
 
I just cannot understand how people can believe in astrology.

I find it funny that people think that their future is being predicted, when these "predictions" are just biasing their attention, and subconsciously influencing their choices.

I'm tempted to experiment with some different quasi-hypnotic suggestions on astrology suckers.
 
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I just cannot understand how people can believe in astrology.

I find it funny that people think that their future is being predicted, when these "predictions" are just biasing their attention, and subconsciously influencing their choices.

I'm tempted to experiment with some different quasi-hypnotic suggestions on astrology suckers.

Chill out Flavus... if I can call you Flavus? What you need my friend is a little R&R. What you need to feel good about yourself is a new hairdo! That's it!

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Rock it Flav....Ooh!Lala!

The chicks love it!

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I just cannot understand how people can believe in astrology.

I find it funny that people think that their future is being predicted, when these "predictions" are just biasing their attention, and subconsciously influencing their choices.

I'm tempted to experiment with some different quasi-hypnotic suggestions on astrology suckers.

I just cannot understand how people can believe in MBTI... :p
 
Nope, I don't.
I personally believe astrology is something madeup and generalized in order for everyone to relate to it. We all have different sides to our personalities so you will naturally overlook whatever's not true about yourself and focus on what's relatable to you when reading about your astrological sign.

I once wrote up horoscopes and people got a kick out of them. With practice you can learn to know what people want to hear when they read their horoscopes...and it seems pretty believable.

I'm such a downer today lol ...arg
 
Deleted... wrong thread. No delete option anymore?
 
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