Youth Housing and mandatory Bible studies.

[sprinkles]

Romans 2
New International Version (NIV)
God’s Righteous Judgment

2 You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things. 2 Now we know that God’s judgment against those who do such things is based on truth. 3 So when you, a mere human being, pass judgment on them and yet do the same things, do you think you will escape God’s judgment? 4 Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?

5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. 6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism.

12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

 

[wonkavision]

I'm sorry, but I don't see that mentioned here.

Actually, the Scripture you quoted supports what Im saying.

Christ is not talking about doing good deeds to people in general. He's talking about doing good to his brothers and sisters. And Christ only refers to believers as his brothers and sisters.

And he identifies with his people so much that if you do good to a believer, its equivalent to doing good to him. And if you do harm to a believer, its the equivalent to doing harm to him.

Contrary to popular belief, Christ does NOT love everyone, only those for whom he died.
The rest of the human race is under the curse of sin and death, and are merely awaiting their eternal condemnation.

People automatically assume that doing good deeds is what makes one right with God. But the Scriptures make it plain: sinners are saved by grace, through faith in Jesus Christ.

I'll provide Scripture references if you like, but not right now. its late and i have wirk tomorrow. plus, its difficult to type all this on an Android phone.

 

[sprinkles]

Actually, the Scripture you quoted supports what Im saying.

Christ is not talking about doing good deeds to people in general. He's talking about doing good to his brothers and sisters. And Christ only refers to believers as his brothers and sisters.

And he identifies with his people so much that if you do good to a believer, its equivalent to doing good to him. And if you do harm to a believer, its the equivalent to doing harm to him.

Contrary to popular belief, Christ does NOT love everyone, only those for whom he died.
The rest of the human race is under the curse of sin and death, and are merely awaiting their eternal condemnation.

BS, see my post above.

 

[wonkavision]

Romans 2
New International Version (NIV)
God’s Righteous Judgment

2 You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things. 2 Now we know that God’s judgment against those who do such things is based on truth. 3 So when you, a mere human being, pass judgment on them and yet do the same things, do you think you will escape God’s judgment? 4 Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?

5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. 6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism.

12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

Again, just like Matt, you are misinterpreting the Scriptures.

you are apparently trying to imply that Christians should not declare the truth about sin and judgement because they are sinners themselves. but that is completely untrue.

God has always used fallible men to preach the infallible truth of God. case in point, the book of Romans was written by Paul who, despite being a sinner, was used of God to preach the Gospel.

Same with ALL of the prophets and Apostles and preachers, as well as every Christian who shares the truth of God' s Word.

 

[sprinkles]

Again, just like Matt, you are misinterpreting the Scriptures.

you are apparently trying to imply that Christians should not declare the truth about sin and judgement because they are sinners themselves. but that is completely untrue.

God has always used fallible men to preach the infallible truth of God. case in point, the book of Romans was written by Paul who, despite being a sinner, was used of God to preach the Gospel.

Same with ALL of the prophets and Apostles and preachers, as well as every Christian who shares the truth of God' s Word.

No, I'm not implying that.

What I'm implying is what that scripture says.
1. God doesn't have favorites. Jesus did die for everyone.
2. Hearing the law is not required if a person has naturally obeyed the law without hearing it in their heart.

Nowhere did I say that a Christian should not speak the truth.

 

[wonkavision]

[MENTION=6917]sprinkles[/MENTION]...

Furthermore, the passage you quoted is saying that all the human race is guilty of sin and will be judged by Christ.
So once again, quoting the Scriptures is only going to support what I'm saying:
that The Scriptures are dogmatic, and therefore Biblical preaching is dogmatic.
It's either Christ or Hell. There is nothing in between.

 

[wonkavision]

No, I'm not implying that.

What I'm implying is what that scripture says.
1. God doesn't have favorites. Jesus did die for everyone.
2. Hearing the law is not required if a person has naturally obeyed the law without hearing it in their heart.

Nowhere did I say that a Christian should not speak the truth.

then once again, you are misinterpreting the Scriptures.

Christ did NOT die for everyone. Most of the human race is going to hell.

And your blood would be on my hands if i did not tell you that the only way to be saved is by the grace and mercy of God, through faith in his Son Jesus Christ.

 

[sprinkles]

[MENTION=6917]sprinkles[/MENTION]...

Furthermore, the passage you quoted is saying that all the human race is guilty of sin and will be judged by Christ.
So once again, quoting the Scriptures is only going to support what I'm saying:
that The Scriptures are dogmatic, and therefore Biblical preaching is dogmatic.
It's either Christ or Hell. There is nothing in between.

I understand that it is dogmatic, and I know that it says this.

I also know that it is either Christ or Hell.

I may not be Christian now but I was educated as one, and I will still continue to speak the truth - truth being in this case what scripture indicates.

Another thing that is true is that you cannot force one to believe the truth because God knows their secrets. Their paying lip service to get what they want means nothing in the long run.

 

[wonkavision]

I understand that it is dogmatic, and I know that it says this.

I also know that it is either Christ or Hell.

I may not be Christian now but I was educated as one, and I will still continue to speak the truth - truth being in this case what scripture indicates.

Another thing that is true is that you cannot force one to believe the truth because God knows their secrets. Their paying lip service to get what they want means nothing in the long run.

i just told you that salvation is by grace, through faith in Jesus Christ. So why would you need to tell me that a false or forced profession wont do a person any good?
Or was that statement just to everyone in general?

And furthermore, why halt between two opinions?
if Christ is God worship him. if he's not, then dont.
But be warned, Christ IS God, and those who will not bow down and worship him will be cast into eternal hellfire.

im not trying to force a profession, im just warning you of the facts.
you may be a hair's breadth away from going to hell.

 

[sprinkles]

i just told you that salvation is by grace, through faith in Jesus Christ. So why would you need to tell me that a false or forced profession wont do a person any good?
Or was that statement just to everyone in general?

And furthermore, why halt between two opinions?
if Christ is God worship him. if he's not, then dont.
But be warned, Christ IS God, and those who will not bow down and worship him will be cast into eternal hellfire.

im not trying to force a profession, im just warning you of the facts.
you may be a hair's breadth away from going to hell.

I already rejected God while I believed in him so in all likelyhood I'm quite thoroughly in hell already.

 

[wonkavision]

I already rejected God while I believed in him so in all likelyhood I'm quite thoroughly in hell already.

Thats not true. as long as youre alive theres still hope.
God may be gracious and give you faith in his Son.

but if you DIE without faith in Jesus Christ, then, yes, all hope is lost.
i suggest that you seek his mercy right now.

theres no magical formula. and theres no special prayer.

just trust in Jesus Christ that he ACCOMPLISHED salvation as the Scriptures plainly declare that he did. BELIEVE the testimony of God, regarding Christ:

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM should NOT PERISH, but HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE." (John 3:16)

 

[sprinkles]

[MENTION=6017]wonkavision[/MENTION]

Why thumbs down? It's the truth whether you like it or not.

I decided that I could not reconcile myself with mercy or sacrifice. I decided that I cannot accept it, and that if I deserve hell then I should get all of what is coming to me.

Just because I am that damn fearless, but at the time I also felt worthless, horrible, and not worth saving.

Now I kind of hope that there isn't a hell but if I come to find that there is one, I will remember that decision and that it is not retractable.

 

[wonkavision]

[MENTION=6017]wonkavision[/MENTION]

Why thumbs down? It's the truth whether you like it or not.

I decided that I could not reconcile myself with mercy or sacrifice. I decided that I cannot accept it, and that if I deserve hell then I should get all of what is coming to me.

Just because I am that damn fearless, but at the time I also felt worthless, horrible, and not worth saving.

Now I kind of hope that there isn't a hell but if I come to find that there is one, I will remember that decision and that it is not retractable.

sorry, im on an Android phone. if i gave you a thumbs down it was an accident.

 

[sprinkles]

sorry, im on an Android phone. if i gave you a thumbs down it was an accident.

It's ok.

Anyway for me the reason this is not retractable is that I never got to be asked if I wanted Jesus to die for me.

However if it were just me and Jesus, before he was crucified, and Jesus said to me "I love you and I want to take your place, because you will be punished otherwise." I would say to Jesus "I love you back, but because of that, and because you are innocent and I am not, I won't let you take from me what I deserve."

 

[wonkavision]

@ SPRINKLES....
Your fatalism is not necessarily correct.

you dont actually know whether Christ died for you, so you dont know whether youll be saved or not.

if he died for you, youll be saved. if he did not, you will not.

"ALL that the Father giveth me SHALL come to me, " Jesus said.

Christ CANNOT FAIL. If youre HIS , youll be saved.

But dont be fatalistic. BELIEVE in him.

If he chose to die for you, then it would have been impossible to talk him out of it.

He's God. He accomplishes everything he says he will do.

 

[wonkavision]

Its not just an offer....Christ COMMANDS you to believe.

He said: "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye and BELIEVE the GOSPEL." (Mark 1:15)

He's not asking, he's commanding. Its not optional. BELIEVE.

 

[wonkavision]

@ Sprinkles

Seek Christ while he may be found.

And may God give you faith to believe his Son.

 

[sprinkles]

[MENTION=6917]sprinkles[/MENTION]

Please think about these things.

And may God give you faith to believe his Son.

I thought about it for years and I find it unconscionable.

May God do as God sees fit to do.

 

[this is only temporary]

Well, this clarified things for me somewhat!

I'm not even anything close to being an 18-22 year old male with authority issues and emotional problems, nor am I in need of housing assistance, but the whole "you're going to hell!" thing even makes me feel like an oppositional-defiant teenager. I can only imagine what that style of bible study would do to the residents. Probably make them go "fuck you." If that's the way the bible study classes are (which it doesn't sound like they are, to be fair...) then I'm sure the residents won't benefit from it at all.

 

[sprinkles]

Its not just an offer....Christ COMMANDS you to believe.

He said: "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye and BELIEVE the GOSPEL." (Mark 1:15)

He's not asking, he's commanding. Its not optional. BELIEVE.

Sorry I've been missing your posts.

Either it is optional, and I can refuse, or it is not optional and my refusal does not matter. Just like people can refuse to be in this place if the don't like it, no?

The alternative being horrible does not mean that I MUST avoid it. Many, many people neglect this fact.

It reminds me of this scene from MIB:
Bug: Place your projectile weapon on the ground.
Edgar: You can have my gun, when you pry it from my cold dead fingers.
Bug: Your proposal is acceptable.