What is the nature of female desire? | INFJ Forum

What is the nature of female desire?

Discussion in 'Relationships and Sociology' started by Keirouen, Jun 5, 2014.

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  1. Keirouen

    Keirouen Community Member

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    It's a controversial topic for many people. I'm reading several books on the subject. I'm a girl so I should know, right? :p

    I've observed that few people really understand the inner workings of human sexuality, especially a woman's desire.

    The book I recommend is
    What Do Women Want? Adventures in the Science of Female Desire by Daniel Bergner

    Here's some key points I've read on so far.​


    • Women get sexually aroused by the carnal desire of a partner (raw uncontrolled desire)
    • Overly romantic partners who are kind and understanding don't arouse a woman for long (she loves her partner with all her heart but the raw lust that initiates sex is gone)
    • If you want a woman to see you sexually, the impression you make on the woman strongly correlates with the phase of her menstrual cycle
    • A controlling and withholding partner is more sexually arousing than a giving and accepting partner
    • Bad relationships kill desire but for the above reasons, good relationships don't guarantee sustainable desire
    • Being the object of "primal need" is on a base level arousing for a woman
    • For a woman "melding" or being in a relationship with so much emotional closeness that you can say "you complete me" is like a flat line and there's no room for the climactic peaks of carnal desire (this explains why many long-term lesbian relationships have a decrease in the frequency of sex)
    • Female sexuality is viewed as innately demure and controlled but this is being proved to be a deeply rooted cultural construct
    • A woman's body and her mind are in discord (what she thinks is arousing and what her body is aroused by isn't in sync)
    • Women are physically aroused by a wide range of visual stimuli (men are aroused more discriminately)
    • In a confined space and in close proximity with a partner a woman will want sex more than in a widely open space

    Objectively I agree with everything I've read so far :)

    I value emotional connection above anything. For me at least, this gave me insight.

    I am really starting to understand that a perfect relationship with a woman isn't only about sharing a deep emotional connection. Things like asking "is this okay?" each time during sex is a turnoff. Being sudden, having an element of surprise -that's passion. Sustaining a both sexually and emotionally fulfilling relationship with a woman takes delicate balance and stepping out of your comfort zone.

    ~That's what I learned. What's your take on the nature of female desire?
     
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  2. the

    the Si master race.
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    This gave me the impression that desire is on a line with one extreme being overly romantic and the other being violent rape.somehow this making me see rape as "not as bad as I thought", and being overly accepting to be worse than I thought. Evolutionarily speaking this is worth noting as well.

    Definitly something to think about and dwell on for a bit. Thanks.
     
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  3. Rcs6r

    Rcs6r Must be the feeling~
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    Female desire is as complex and diverse as a males....

    And no one attracted to an indecisive push-over.
     
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  4. La Sagna

    La Sagna Trying to become a butterfly

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    Let's see, a book about women's sexual desires written by a man. I call total BS on that one. I am not going to take a man's opinion as to what my sexual desires are.

    In any case not all women are the same just like not all men are the same. Some men like women that have fake breasts and fake tans and other men like natural looking women who have small breasts. Some women like bad boys and some women like gentlemen. Some women are turned on by other women and turned off by men. We are not one-size-fits-all. Generalizing about female sexuality makes men think that all women are a certain way and women think 'I guess that's how I'm supposed to be'.

    As for your list:

    Women get sexually aroused by the carnal desire of a partner (raw uncontrolled desire) - Generally true for me (not to be taken as wanting a rough encounter but more that being 'wanted' is one of the biggest turn ons)

    Overly romantic partners who are kind and understanding don't arouse a woman for long (she loves her partner with all her heart but the raw lust that initiates sex is gone) - I don't believe this to be true for me. A man who is not kind and understanding is a turn off. I would suggest women that are turned on by that have self-esteem issues.
    If you want a woman to see you sexually, the impression you make on the woman strongly correlates with the phase of her menstrual cycle - I have no idea about this one, possibly but discussing the menstrual cycle is not much of a turn-on
    A controlling and withholding partner is more sexually arousing than a giving and accepting partner - Definitely NO WAY is this true for me. It doesn't make any sense to me. If he wants to control and withhold he can go do it to somebody else, that's not fun
    Bad relationships kill desire but for the above reasons, good relationships don't guarantee sustainable desire - Of course, for both men and women
    Being the object of "primal need" is on a base level arousing for a woman - Like the first point, I would agree with this.
    For a woman "melding" or being in a relationship with so much emotional closeness that you can say "you complete me" is like a flat line and there's no room for the climactic peaks of carnal desire - Definitely not true for me. Emotional closeness is a huge turn-on for me,
    Female sexuality is viewed as innately demure and controlled but this is being proved to be a deeply rooted cultural construct - I agree with this, female desire varies according to individual preferences and 'demure and controlled' seems very old-fashioned
    A woman's body and her mind are in discord (what she thinks is arousing and what her body is aroused by isn't in sync) - I disagree with this. It's all about the mind really, if the mind isn't willing the body isn't either.
    Women are physically aroused by a wide range of visual stimuli (men are aroused more discriminately) - Perhaps, again it depends on individuals.
    In a confined space and in close proximity with a partner a woman will want sex more than in a widely open space - I'm not sure about this one. Maybe. If he means I prefer having sex inside than outside for all to see, then yes I would agree. Probably some women exhibitionists feel differently.
     
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  5. Gaze

    Gaze My word . . . hmm
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    yes, it is complicated. I don't even think women are necessarily aware of what makes them tick. Most of the time, you learn along the way what clicks. For example, being in close quarters with someone tends to create desire for intimacy. I'm not turned on by how skilled someone is. I'm more appreciative if a partner takes time to understand what I like or need, and not assume they know because they feel they know what all women want. :D I don't usually expect someone to have it all figured out. What's important to one woman may not be important to another. But in the end, how a partner treats you everyday can have far more importance than how skilled they are in the bedroom. As a partner, being responsive, open, understanding, available, and respectful, supportive, assuming there's already a strong attraction, can make intimacy more intense than anyone thought possible.

    Edit: agree with @La Sagna being wanted is a huge turn on. This is not the same as someone simply wanting to have sex with you, because anyone can want sex for any reason. It's more that someone wants to be with and close to you, the woman, the person that's a turn on. That way you know the experience they want to have with you is not something they would expect to share or have with someone else.
     
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    #5 Gaze, Jun 5, 2014
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  6. DonTaushMe

    DonTaushMe Well-known member

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    Alright, lets not use the term 'female desire' it aims to put female sexuality up on a pedestal and in you're -I'm guessing- new found lesbianism you really wanna do yourself a favor and not do that. Women want to fuck just like any other man, mammal and creature on earth that has a sex drive. Now if you meet a woman who does not have a sex drive, well then you're shit outta luck, but until then! Just fuck 'em, it's not all that complicated.

    As far as that book you've quoted, that pertains to a specific kind of woman and if you want to fuck an INFJ woman it does not necessarily pertain to those kinds of women at all. F's, for the most part, are sweet and sensual in the bed room. They move around a lot and they moan the loudest and in my own personal experience they seem to prefer a cooperative dynamic. T's want to be dominated. I fucked a girl once, my ex girl friend -not just once- and she... well, to say the least I have nothing good to say about her in terms of in the bed room or out of it but after a while she wanted me to throw her up against the wall and fuck her, like a man would. I could not for the life of me figure out why and then I did it and I still don't know why, I mean yeah it turned her on but she couldn't hold herself up and neither could I smh stupid... And then she decided she wanted to buy under the bed restraints and have me restrain her. Now this idiot didn't move around all that much to begin with, she pretty well just lied there and moaned. Now I may have said in high school, "So long as they shut up and moan I'm good" but that was in high school, once someone does that it ain't cute. So now this-_- may as well have been an inflatable doll of a woman that moaned wants me to restrain her further, I ask everyone what the fuck. Granted she was young and didn't know her own twat much less mine, probably watched way too much s&m porn, but that's just not someone I'd want to fuck ever again.

    The good thing about her is that she took a while to cum. My last girl friend before her took about five minutes. So lets distinguish this here, there are women who can pretty well have you rip their cloths off and go down under and then there are women who need a warm up before you decide to go down, regardless of both always warm up unless specifically told otherwise.

    The thing you gotta understand about twat is it's complicated if you don't have one. You have one, go play with it. If I had a dollar for every idiot I've fucked who didn't know where their own clit was, well, I'd hold up all those dollars and cry. I'll cry anyways, it's fucking depressing.
    So here's some rules-

    Rules to Being a Sexually Active Lesbian:
    1. Cut your god damn fucking fingernails! If you've got fake manicured nails longer than a couple millimeters I don't want you going near my vagina because I don't trust you with those damn things and you know what, I'm right not to!
    2. Take care of your hands. Put lotion on them, massage that shit, work out all the kinks cause you will get carpool tunnel. And do not touch me with that hand if you've got a callus or a bandied, use your other hand. Also, learn how to be ambidextrous.
    3. Brush and floss your teeth. I do not need some woman who just ate a bag of Doritos to munch on my cooch. Twat and Doritos do not mix, neither does the smell.
    4. Do not SHAVE you're vagina. Trim it with a electric trimmer. I do not need a face full of stubble every time I want to taste you.

    And last but not least, play with yourself! If you get to me and you don't know what you're doing, I'm pissed!!!
     
    #6 DonTaushMe, Jun 5, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2014
  7. dwr46y

    dwr46y Well-known weirdo

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    I'm male. I'll answer this one.


    (redacted)
    [​IMG]
     
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  8. LucyJr

    LucyJr Well-known member

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    So a woman's desire is another desire? Interesting... The nature of a woman's desire is to desire another desire, usualy the desire of a man...well no wonder women are so confusing sometimes...


    In think the "raw uncontrolled desire" part is possible in very specific situations:
    -when there is no restraint in sexuality, which implies that the man who is subdued to this uncontrolled desire will have this desire toward any woman that looks good, not just one, no matter what he would say;
    -the second option I think is possible within a mutual love and respect between a man and a woman, as is classicaly understood by marriage, or a vow; in this situation, I think the desire is just between that man and that woman;
     
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  9. jimtaylor

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    Human sexuality is complicated; can we all agree on that? Not just for women but for men as well. There is no structured, instruction manual to appeal to all women or men sexually, or to please them sexually. Sorry, we aren’t that boring. Each of us has little quarks and though there may be similarities, we can’t really be put into a box like this book tries to do.

    However, I will tell you this, from my experience, confidence is a huge turn on for both men and women. But what is confidence? Is it being an asshole? Is it being a heartbreaker? A caveman that knocks out the girl before he takes her back to his cave?

    Please see my responses below to the list.
    · Women get sexually aroused by the carnal desire of a partner (raw uncontrolled desire)
    More important point… Who doesn’t? Who wants sex to be structured like the rest of our lives mostly are? Most people clock-in, clock-out and most of their day is organized. I couldn’t imagine sex being planned and being that boring. I want it to be animalistic, exciting and unpredictable. I don’t want it to be controlled.
    · Overly romantic partners who are kind and understanding don't arouse a woman for long (she loves her partner with all her heart but the raw lust that initiates sex is gone)
    I can understand this and it is true. Overly romantic get to creepy levels quickly. I am dating a girl right now who got totally turned off by this guy who called her co-workers to find out where she lived so he could send her a bunch of roses after their second date. He took it way too far. Me showing up to one of our dates with a single simple rose and holding the door for her was appreciated and rewarded. It’s about balance. Listening when your love interest is having a really bad day is a good idea and healthy. Insisting on your love interest to share how their day went and going way out of your way to, “be there for them” is creepy and desperate.
    · If you want a woman to see you sexually, the impression you make on the woman strongly correlates with the phase of her menstrual cycle
    So should I ask a girl about her menstrual cycle so I can be at my peak attractive level when I hit on her? Even if this is true, it’s pointless.
    · A controlling and withholding partner is more sexually arousing than a giving and accepting partner
    Expand please.
    · Bad relationships kill desire but for the above reasons, good relationships don't guarantee sustainable desire
    This comment seems contradictory. If there isn’t sexual desire in the relationship between the two partners, how could that be called a good relationship? Bad relationships kill desire and good relationships do guarantee sustained desire. The frequency might decline because of work, school, kids, etc… but if the attraction and desire is not there, it isn’t a good relationship. Unless they are defining a good relationship as one where the guy is basically her girlfriend? If that is the case, I would rather not be in a relationship.
    · Being the object of "primal need" is on a base level arousing for a woman
    Yep, kind of a no brainer here.
    · For a woman "melding" or being in a relationship with so much emotional closeness that you can say "you complete me" is like a flat line and there's no room for the climactic peaks of carnal desire (this explains why many long-term lesbian relationships have a decrease in the frequency of sex)
    See above comments about good and bad relationships. A strong sexual relationship helps reaffirm feelings of closeness and attachment through the release of chemicals in the brain. This sounds like that anytime a woman gets close to a man they get friend zoned or again assuming that a good relationship is one where the man is her girlfriend.
    · Female sexuality is viewed as innately demure and controlled but this is being proved to be a deeply rooted cultural construct
    As is the male sexuality which portrays men as sex fiends who think about sex every six seconds. Culture portrays both wrongly and might be a cause of much of the confusion.
    · A woman's body and her mind are in discord (what she thinks is arousing and what her body is aroused by isn't in sync)
    Ever heard of a no reason boner?
    · Women are physically aroused by a wide range of visual stimuli (men are aroused more discriminately)
    Please explain further
    · In a confined space and in close proximity with a partner a woman will want sex more than in a widely open space
    You invade anyone’s personal space, of course this is true. Being close to anyone is very intimate.
     
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  10. OP
    Keirouen

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    "Female desire" = pedestal? My bad, I don't like pedestals :p

    I'm not a "new found lesbianism" sort of girl. I knew I was a lesbian since I was like 3. I know. It's weird but it's true :)

    I've had an interest in stuff like psychology and human sexuality since forever. I feel like I limited my perspective too much in the past. It's interesting to read about studies on sexuality and learn the background of the researchers. Actually though the author is a man, most of the scientist followed in the book are female.

    That is the best comment ever!

    This might be true... at least sometimes ;)

    Regarding myself, I don't particularly think the violent stuff is that satisfying. Eroticism is a very delicate art. Imitating porn like your ex did sounds like the wrong approach.

    That's kind of funny. My first girlfriend was like that... not that I've had many XD

    That's another thing -moving around is important. To be satisfied a woman needs to move around, to squirm and lean into the touch

    That is a good thing! It's pretty boring if it happens right away... unless she wants to go again?

    That is beyond depressing. Seriously? How can a girl NOT know where her clit is? I didn't know such a thing was possible. Makes me want to go bang my head against a desk.

    Long fingernails? What a turnoff. Lol, I've always had short fingernails. Wouldn't it be nice if all the girls with short fingernails were lesbians?

    That's such a bad idea that it made me laugh! Who would do that??

    Wonderful advice! I have to work on this one :D

    This was definitely offtopic but interesting!
     
  11. the

    the Si master race.
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    My favorite part was where you discounted it because a man wrote it, then agreed with about a third and didnt know for another third of it.
     
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  12. Sriracha

    Sriracha Not here.
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    Read my signature. That is all.
     
  13. sassafras

    sassafras Well-known member

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    Especially if you had a some sriracha sauce with your dinner last night. Whew.



     
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  14. muir

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    So treat em mean, keep em keen? But not too mean cos that's...well...mean and that's a turn off

    Also women like to be noticed but don't look too hard or long that's creepy...just the right amount

    Time your behaviours to fit her menstrual cycle....remember EVERYTHING must revolve around her

    Be strong also and take charge but at the same time don't be too strong or you will be overpowering and also you will infringe on her personal power as a free and independant woman

    So be nice but nasty at the same time and notice but don't stare

    Be strong but not so strong that you overpower! But also at the same time be a good provider, solid and reliable but also be a total bastard to keep the passion alive...but not too much of a bastard because that's just nasty

    So be nice at the right times and be a bastard at the right times or the passion will die; this must be acheived using telepathy as the woman won't let you know what she wants...you must just know

    Be equal but you pay for everything and you must carry all the heavy shit...and fix everything that she breaks

    It's easy being a modern guy...

    Also you must be honest but also lie when her vanity is at stake eg when she's trying on clothes and asks ''does my bum look big in this?''

    So let's re-cap...

    strong but not too strong

    nice but also a total shit....but each must be done at the right times

    notice but don't stare

    honest but also dishonest

    sympathetic but also a total bastard because being too nice is a turn off....its a sign of weakeness. So listen at the right times but also know when to ignore and be aloof

    Also their arousal is not as physical as men, it's more mental so you must get just the right balance of all the above and spark her imagination not to mention probably getting repetitive strain injury to get her to that special place

    ...fuck it...i give up
     
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  15. La Sagna

    La Sagna Trying to become a butterfly

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    Eh, I'm honest, but seriously would you read a book written by a woman that explained all about what men wanted sexually? Ok, you probably would just because it's a woman talking about sex, but I have enough men telling me they know more than I do about just about everything, but what turns me on is one subject they definitely don't know more about than I do. He was wrong about some pretty important ones so that if some man read that trying to figure me out they would be out of luck.
     
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  16. BrokenDaniel

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    Hah, pretty much this, it still pisses me off how much this has become a stereotype, leaving no room to individuals. Men are just as finicky and bitchy as women are made out to be sometimes and even more!.
     
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  17. Gaze

    Gaze My word . . . hmm
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    One thing I keep hearing is that planned intimacy is not fun or exciting as spontaneous intimacy. I disagree. Honestly, I prefer planned events, especially if partners put the effort into making it special or building up to the event. I don't like it when it's too spontaneous or someone expects it on the spur of the moment. I like being prepared so planned intimacy is fine with me.
     
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  18. niffer

    niffer Well-known member

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    Well, I think the list applies to me.
     
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  19. SpecialEdition

    SpecialEdition Well-known member

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    I will respond to the points you made:
    Women get sexually aroused by the carnal desire of a partner (raw uncontrolled desire):
    Yes, because I want to be desired. I want to know that he was thinking about me and just wants to have his way with me. I want to feel like I am the ultimate desire for him and I want to see that expressed.

    Overly romantic partners who are kind and understanding don't arouse a woman for long (she loves her partner with all her heart but the raw lust that initiates sex is gone): I am not attracted to soft men. I don't want a man gushing over me, trying too hard to please me or going above and beyond to try to win my affections. It's not that I want a man to be mean to me, it's that I want him to stand on his own and not put me on a pedestal. I don't need to be treated as some special soft gem. I want us to see each other for the people we are. Sometimes that means NOT understanding. I know a lot of the times my BF has no fucking clue what goes on with me emotionally even when I explain because he is so calm and stoic and rational. That doesn't mean he'll dismiss me or devalidate my feelings. He will listen, and offer a solution if he sees one. That is good enough for me.

    If you want a woman to see you sexually, the impression you make on the woman strongly correlates with the phase of her menstrual cycle: TRUE. If there are women who don't understand this then you seriously need to get in tune with your body. Your menstrual cycle has a massive impact on how you feel throughout the month. That is not an excuse to be a raging bitch during or before your period, it means recognizing what your body is going through in order to prepare to conceive a child, even if you are not trying to conceive. Women often want sex more and feel more desirable during the times their body is primed to conceive. It's science.


    A controlling and withholding partner is more sexually arousing than a giving and accepting partner:
    I don't like the word controlling so much but I understand what it's trying to communicate. I like men who are in control. I like men who are good decision makers, who can leave their emotions at the door to make tough choices. I like men who can lead, who can teach, who can make others around him be better people just by being strong in who he is. To me, that is a man in control. I don't really know what context "withholding" is being used in, though.

    Bad relationships kill desire but for the above reasons, good relationships don't guarantee sustainable desire: Depends on how you define good and bad. I have dated people who on paper were "good." But I wasn't that into it. I have dated people who were "bad" and I held onto them. I am dating someone who is amazing and who I work well with and it's great. Sexual desire has not dropped.


    Being the object of "primal need" is on a base level arousing for a woman: YES.

    For a woman "melding" or being in a relationship with so much emotional closeness that you can say "you complete me" is like a flat line and there's no room for the climactic peaks of carnal desire (this explains why many long-term lesbian relationships have a decrease in the frequency of sex): True. To me that is just boring but also bizarre. I understand identifying as a couple, but I don't think it's a good idea to meld yourselves so closely together that you no longer resemble your individual selves. You can be fully and completely in love with a person, but you don't have to become them.

    Female sexuality is viewed as innately demure and controlled but this is being proved to be a deeply rooted cultural construct
    A woman's body and her mind are in discord (what she thinks is arousing and what her body is aroused by isn't in sync)
    Women are physically aroused by a wide range of visual stimuli (men are aroused more discriminately)
    In a confined space and in close proximity with a partner a woman will want sex more than in a widely open space: Yes to all of the above.
     
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