What Does It Take For God To Save A Sinner? | INFJ Forum

What Does It Take For God To Save A Sinner?

We're already saved.

Now, seeing as how this is a statement thread, I figured I would make a few. Feel free to add angry scripture reading tones of voice and/or hands slamming in tables while reading them in your head:

I sold my iPhone a few weeks ago and bought a Nokia Lumia instead. That was a bad choice.

My parents have recently told me that they are not going to pay for my college prep tuition, even though they recently paid for my two brothers tuitions, and we're on very good terms. They offered no explanation. That hurt me.

I had to put my cat down a few months ago. That is still sticking with me.

I'm currently drinking water. It tastes good.

Earlier today I bought a sandwich. I thought it would be good. It wasn't.

These last few months, I have been taking vitamins. I asked a friend, I said "friend", I said "do you think they are working?" My friend he turned to me, he said "friend", he said. "Friend you don't know if it's helping. Maybe you would have felt even worse without them". And I said "thank you friend", I said, "Thank you for giving me that perspective"

Now, Sovey, for the last time - your faith is yours. My salvation doesn't depend on you. Your faith isn't the same as mine. The way I see it, you're reading Harry Potter and getting The Girl With The Dragon Tattoo out of it.

I truly wish you would read up on other forms of Christianity and other religions just one time. Realize that the world doesn't revolve around you, it just has you in it. God didn't create the world for you to revolutionize it. He created the world for us all to have our own revolutions. That's it. I can't help you any more than that. The Heavens await you, as it awaits all of us.
 
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A nice ass.
 
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A “Please” and a “Thank you”.
 
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blasphemy3.jpg


Once again...just as [MENTION=5601]vandyke[/MENTION] pointed out...it’s not a question when you supply the “answer” directly after it.
Can a suggest a blog again?
You dislike, and refuse to accept the beliefs of anyone who’s vary even slightly from your own...which is the definition of a “bigot”.
You will NOT convert anyone in such a way SG...people immediate shut you out the moment you start inferring they are “ignorant”, “false prophets”, “going to burn in Hell”, etc. etc.
Take your intolerance and hate somewhere else.
 
Skarekrow said:
blasphemy3.jpg


Once again...just as [MENTION=5601]vandyke[/MENTION] pointed out...it’s not a question when you supply the “answer” directly after it.
Can a suggest a blog again?
You dislike, and refuse to accept the beliefs of anyone who’s vary even slightly from your own...which is the definition of a “bigot”.
You will NOT convert anyone in such a way SG...people immediate shut you out the moment you start inferring they are “ignorant”, “false prophets”, “going to burn in Hell”, etc. etc.
Take your intolerance and hate somewhere else.
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Spot on.
 
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Skarekrow said:
blasphemy3.jpg


Once again...just as @vandyke pointed out...it’s not a question when you supply the “answer” directly after it.
Can a suggest a blog again?
You dislike, and refuse to accept the beliefs of anyone who’s vary even slightly from your own...which is the definition of a “bigot”.
You will NOT convert anyone in such a way SG...people immediate shut you out the moment you start inferring they are “ignorant”, “false prophets”, “going to burn in Hell”, etc. etc.
Take your intolerance and hate somewhere else.
Click to expand...

Even bigots need acceptance before they can learn acceptance. Relating this to the OP, what it takes for the redemption of anyone is love in the first place.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
Even bigots need acceptance before they can learn acceptance.
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Now we have to accept him? Isn't that the job of the people around him? How about this - we're teaching him not to be a bigot by telling him not to be a bigot.

Flavus Aquila said:
Relating this to the OP, what it takes for the redemption of anyone is love in the first place.
Click to expand...

We don't hate him, we just strongly disagree with him. I keep telling him how I wish him nothing but Heaven. In my opinion he's going to Heaven, as are you, and everyone, everywhere. I wish him all the best of luck in the world. This matter I just disagree with him on. How much more love can you give a person? By telling him that you love what he's doing and everything he's saying? I'm not "in" on that part of love.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
Even bigots need acceptance before they can learn acceptance. Relating this to the OP, what it takes for the redemption of anyone is love in the first place.
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I don’t “hate” SG...I just really have a hard time with people who use religion to preach the underlying message of intolerance and elitism (I’m going to heaven and you aren’t na-na-na-na).
SG may as well just come out and say that....he’s arrogant and gloating, and those things, along with the message he has, is NOT what Jesus was about.
Jesus was about loving and accepting everyone.
 
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[MENTION=5601]vandyke[/MENTION] and [MENTION=5045]Skarekrow[/MENTION] I know what you're saying. I suppose what I mean by acceptance is more akin to engaging with someone, than agreeing with him.

I don't know if SG is a bigot, or just hyper-enthusiastic about a subject, without any means other than urgent fear to try and communicate it. But entering into dialogue is already a move away from bigotry.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
@vandyke and @Skarekrow I know what you're saying. I suppose what I mean by acceptance is more akin to engaging with someone, than agreeing with him.

I don't know if SG is a bigot, or just hyper-enthusiastic about a subject, without any means other than urgent fear to try and communicate it. But entering into dialogue is already a move away from bigotry.
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If he were actually engaging in dialogue then you are right...he would be moving away from being a bigot...but he isn’t doing that.
Every single post he has started here begins with a supposed “question” after which he immediately answers himself, making it more of a “statement”.
Anyone who then replies to his “questions” is subsequently told how they are wrong and are going to burn in Hell.
If this were the first instance of him doing that, I would probably ignore him...but this isn’t his first time.
There is already too much intolerance and hatred in this world, we don’t need him adding to it.
I have tired to explain to him how his approach turns people off to his message but he keeps going with it.
So I, in turn will keep pointing out how he is acting like a “bigot”.
 
Skarekrow said:
If he were actually engaging in dialogue then you are right...he would be moving away from being a bigot...but he isn’t doing that.
Every single post he has started here begins with a supposed “question” after which he immediately answers himself, making it more of a “statement”.
Anyone who then replies to his “questions” is subsequently told how they are wrong and are going to burn in Hell.
If this were the first instance of him doing that, I would probably ignore him...but this isn’t his first time.
There is already too much intolerance and hatred in this world, we don’t need him adding to it.
I have tired to explain to him how his approach turns people off to his message but he keeps going with it.
So I, in turn will keep pointing out how he is acting like a “bigot”.
Click to expand...
A multi-sided approach is always better. You keep at him; and I'll keep giving long answers, which he won't answer.

Surely [MENTION=11142]SovereignGrace[/MENTION] has to start engaging with someone sooner or later.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
A multi-sided approach is always better. You keep at him; and I'll keep giving long answers, which he won't answer.

Surely @SovereignGrace has to start engaging with someone sooner or later.
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Oh, he’ll reply to you...but he won’t consider any sort of belief other than his own...even if that person is Christian.
If it doesn’t match his message of 0.01% of the population going to heaven while the rest of us poor saps are going to Hell, then he just starts telling you all about how incredibly wrong and ignorant you are, how you will burn for all eternity, or how you are a false prophet.
 
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I don't think God can save a sinner, UNLESS the sinner makes up in his mind that he needs helps, asks for help then he will RECEIVE help. Free will people!

free will is the "ability to make choices without any prior prejudice, inclination, or disposition,"^[1]^ and specifically that these "free will" choices are not ultimately predestined by God


God gave it to humankind. HE DIDN'T EVEN WANT TO "POLICE-CONTROL" EVERYBODY!"
What does that mean to you guys?
Hitler would've destroyed us if we wouldn't do what he wanted!
 
I honestly just don't get it. I'm not trying to put down anyone's beliefs here, but the concept of original sin and the need to be saved or redeemed from this sin makes very little sense to me. Why would God create this whole universe just so we can be judged? Why send a soul to hell for all eternity? Wouldn't a creator show compassion toward humans and wait until everyone found their way back to him?
 
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Jimmers said:
I honestly just don't get it. I'm not trying to put down anyone's beliefs here, but the concept of original sin and the need to be saved or redeemed from this sin makes very little sense to me. Why would God create this whole universe just so we can be judged? Why send a soul to hell for all eternity? Wouldn't a creator show compassion toward humans and wait until everyone found their way back to him?
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Hey Jimmers! As someone who believes in the Lutheran Protestant interpretation of original sin, let me try to answer your very sensible and logical questions the best I can.

Why would God create this whole universe just so we can be judged?
I've wondered that many times myself. Why are we here? What's the point? Many of these questions we might never know the true answer to. The Bible explains in the analogy of Adam and Eve that humans angered God, and we were punished to be alone and away from God for that reason. The answer I can give you is that I don't know why He chose to do it. Refer to the judgment in the next question

Why send a soul to hell for all eternity?
Hell isn't mentioned in the Bible. God chose and led a group of people from slavery to freedom through the desert. To guide them towards a civilized state, not too far removed from the ones we have today, God's son was sent to remove the old rules and die for the sins that the original people committed. We were all saved through the acts and behavior of Jesus. We should celebrate Jesus and his contributions, and try to emulate his way of life and way of treating others to the best of our abilities. We cannot buy a ticket to Heaven through merit in mind or body. We are all equally saved, equally sinful in nature. We're just lucky that sin doesn't exist any longer.

Wouldn't a creator show compassion toward humans and wait until everyone found their way back to him?
I believe that God has given us more compassion than we could ask for. We should just be grateful to the sacrifices made, and the time we have here. Let's go out and work to make the world a better, more peaceful place for future generations to enjoy. Let's go out and look t the birds in the trees, smell the newly cut grass. Look at the magnificent sky.

That's what I was raised to believe, that's what I've come back to believing. I've read up on most religions and ways to look at religion and people. A lot of people are going to tell you that they know the absolute truth about everything and quote you the Bible or the Quran. Just remember that they know as little as we know. We're all equally allowed to believe what we want.

I hope that answered your questions.
 
vandyke said:
Hey Jimmers! As someone who believes in the Lutheran Protestant interpretation of original sin, let me try to answer your very sensible and logical questions the best I can.

Why would God create this whole universe just so we can be judged?
I've wondered that many times myself. Why are we here? What's the point? Many of these questions we might never know the true answer to. The Bible explains in the analogy of Adam and Eve that humans angered God, and we were punished to be alone and away from God for that reason. The answer I can give you is that I don't know why He chose to do it. Refer to the judgment in the next question

Why send a soul to hell for all eternity?
Hell isn't mentioned in the Bible. God chose and led a group of people from slavery to freedom through the desert. To guide them towards a civilized state, not too far removed from the ones we have today, God's son was sent to remove the old rules and die for the sins that the original people committed. We were all saved through the acts and behavior of Jesus. We should celebrate Jesus and his contributions, and try to emulate his way of life and way of treating others to the best of our abilities. We cannot buy a ticket to Heaven through merit in mind or body. We are all equally saved, equally sinful in nature. We're just lucky that sin doesn't exist any longer.

Wouldn't a creator show compassion toward humans and wait until everyone found their way back to him?
I believe that God has given us more compassion than we could ask for. We should just be grateful to the sacrifices made, and the time we have here. Let's go out and work to make the world a better, more peaceful place for future generations to enjoy. Let's go out and look t the birds in the trees, smell the newly cut grass. Look at the magnificent sky.

That's what I was raised to believe, that's what I've come back to believing. I've read up on most religions and ways to look at religion and people. A lot of people are going to tell you that they know the absolute truth about everything and quote you the Bible or the Quran. Just remember that they know as little as we know. We're all equally allowed to believe what we want.

I hope that answered your questions.
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Thank you for your response. It was helpful.

I find that Genesis is a wonderful, even beautiful story, if not taken literally. I've always like the way Judaism has interpreted the fall of Adam and Eve, as more metaphorical of our relationship to God and to them original sin does not exist. Anyone know how those that are Jewish interpret sin in general, compared with Christians?
 
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vandyke said:
Hey Jimmers! As someone who believes in the Lutheran Protestant interpretation of original sin, let me try to answer your very sensible and logical questions the best I can.

Why would God create this whole universe just so we can be judged?
I've wondered that many times myself. Why are we here? What's the point? Many of these questions we might never know the true answer to. The Bible explains in the analogy of Adam and Eve that humans angered God, and we were punished to be alone and away from God for that reason. The answer I can give you is that I don't know why He chose to do it. Refer to the judgment in the next question

Why send a soul to hell for all eternity?
Hell isn't mentioned in the Bible. God chose and led a group of people from slavery to freedom through the desert. To guide them towards a civilized state, not too far removed from the ones we have today, God's son was sent to remove the old rules and die for the sins that the original people committed. We were all saved through the acts and behavior of Jesus. We should celebrate Jesus and his contributions, and try to emulate his way of life and way of treating others to the best of our abilities. We cannot buy a ticket to Heaven through merit in mind or body. We are all equally saved, equally sinful in nature. We're just lucky that sin doesn't exist any longer.

Wouldn't a creator show compassion toward humans and wait until everyone found their way back to him?
I believe that God has given us more compassion than we could ask for. We should just be grateful to the sacrifices made, and the time we have here. Let's go out and work to make the world a better, more peaceful place for future generations to enjoy. Let's go out and look t the birds in the trees, smell the newly cut grass. Look at the magnificent sky.

That's what I was raised to believe, that's what I've come back to believing. I've read up on most religions and ways to look at religion and people. A lot of people are going to tell you that they know the absolute truth about everything and quote you the Bible or the Quran. Just remember that they know as little as we know. We're all equally allowed to believe what we want.

I hope that answered your questions.
Click to expand...

You are now officially a false prophet.

And your hands are officially soaked in the blood of your hearers.
 
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