Very sad INTP....

[Calvin222]

Hi thanks for letting me post here I just am confused and wanted to see if I could get some help from you guys. I am INTP and recently I met an INFJ and started dating. (This was before I knew about MBTI.) We were both pretty much amazed with each other right form the start. We were both highly imaginitive, somewhat antisocial, really goofy sense of humor and both terribly akward in pretty much every area of life. I think the fact we were both introverted inutitive was the main factor. Anyway, I really liked her becuase she was intellectual and I could talk to her about things that interested me. She liked me becuase I was thoughtful but also becuase she would always talk about how I had integrity and she would mention examples of other people she saw through the week who were "compromising" so to speak and how much she appreciated I did not do that. (I did not understand the big deal with this until I read the Idealist description in Kearsey.."authenticty" factor). Anyway we talked all the time, we laughed a lot, were were great friends. I mean we really enjoyed just hanging out, but then one fateful night......

I got mad at her.

Okay I am INTP, I like things to make sense. I was pretty sure she was not making sense, so I told her. And I guess I was sorta mad. I tend to be arumentative. I wasn't being mean, but I am pretty confrontational, and I confronted her. I sent her a note to do this. She didn't respond so I sent another one, she responded but I felt like she was making excuses so I sent her another one telling her not to make excuses (turns out she wasn't and it was all in my imagination, I felt like an idiot).

SHE DID NOT APPRECIATE THIS. She told me we needed a break (crying) and we stopped talking.

We have not picked it up to this day (but we are still friends).


Man what is the deal?! It's hard not to feel like she never really cared about me in the first place if she could bail out that fast!

I'm just a stupid INTP! I don't mean any harm!


My question I guess is should I still pursue her after a bit of time or just let it go. Would she come back or was that pretty much it?

Thanksssss

 

[Shai Gar]

*hug*

I've been there as well.

 

[Sever]

The fact that the bailed out that fast does not mean she never cared about you. It's probably because you hurt her and she quickly put some distance to avoid further getting hurt. The fact that you told her she's making excuses could have been interpreted by her as lying and accusing an INFJ of lying is a big :nono: . As you said, they value authenticity (and integrity) very much.

If some time has passed, I think it's Ok now to tell her you're sorry and explain to her things from your perspective (that you didn't want to be mean, etc..). You may have to work a little to earn her trust back but from what you described of your relationship, I think it's worth it. Good luck!

 

[Duty]

Hi thanks for letting me post here I just am confused and wanted to see if I could get some help from you guys. I am INTP and recently I met an INFJ and started dating. (This was before I knew about MBTI.) We were both pretty much amazed with each other right form the start. We were both highly imaginitive, somewhat antisocial, really goofy sense of humor and both terribly akward in pretty much every area of life. I think the fact we were both introverted inutitive was the main factor. Anyway, I really liked her becuase she was intellectual and I could talk to her about things that interested me. She liked me becuase I was thoughtful but also becuase she would always talk about how I had integrity and she would mention examples of other people she saw through the week who were "compromising" so to speak and how much she appreciated I did not do that. (I did not understand the big deal with this until I read the Idealist description in Kearsey.."authenticty" factor). Anyway we talked all the time, we laughed a lot, were were great friends. I mean we really enjoyed just hanging out, but then one fateful night......

I got mad at her.

Okay I am INTP, I like things to make sense. I was pretty sure she was not making sense, so I told her. And I guess I was sorta mad. I tend to be arumentative. I wasn't being mean, but I am pretty confrontational, and I confronted her. I sent her a note to do this. She didn't respond so I sent another one, she responded but I felt like she was making excuses so I sent her another one telling her not to make excuses (turns out she wasn't and it was all in my imagination, I felt like an idiot).

SHE DID NOT APPRECIATE THIS. She told me we needed a break (crying) and we stopped talking.

We have not picked it up to this day (but we are still friends).


Man what is the deal?! It's hard not to feel like she never really cared about me in the first place if she could bail out that fast!

I'm just a stupid INTP! I don't mean any harm!


My question I guess is should I still pursue her after a bit of time or just let it go. Would she come back or was that pretty much it?

Thanksssss

INFJs, and all NFs, are most concerned with their validity. If you make an INFJ feel "invalid," they're going to run. It sounds like you weren't precise enough with how you were coming across to her. This is always a potential pitfall in this relationship as an INTP feels they're just being honest, and an INFJ feels as if they aren't valid or "good enough" for the INTP.

Although it's unusual for an INFJ to just run from a relationship so quickly (they often will stick with bad relationships for a long time...although INFJs very often will display this behavior when underdeveloped and looking for "the perfect, ideal relationship"), it is not unusual for them to be very final after they have left. Sorry to tell you, but it's likely that she won't want to pick the relationship back up if she feels it is done and not what she wants. It's likely she may not even want to be friends with you, but instead just move on.

I've been where you are now, except my INFJ and I were together for well over 3 years. It really sucks, I know. You just have to see the mistake made: you weren't pedantic enough in picking your words so as not to make her feel invalid, yet still be honest about getting your point across. INFJs have a very hard time with criticism!

 

[Calvin222]

Oh I did talk to her we talked and I told her I felt like an idiot and was embarrassed and admitted I was just being really prideful and felt bad and she forgave me but she still wanted to just have distance. Like I dunno I just find that confusing it seems a bit extreme to me. I'm also not sure if it's worth going back in some ways! I am not perfect I have my moments and if INFJ's break off that quick man I'm kinda nervous about starting anything back up again.

 

[sumone]

Now that some time has passed it might be good to explain it from your viewpoint. I'm not exactly sure what you did but it appears you managed to trigger quite a big reaction.
Let us know how it goes.

 

[sumone]

Oh I did talk to her we talked and I told her I felt like an idiot and was embarrassed and admitted I was just being really prideful and felt bad and she forgave me but she still wanted to just have distance. Like I dunno I just find that confusing it seems a bit extreme to me. I'm also not sure if it's worth going back in some ways! I am not perfect I have my moments and if INFJ's break off that quick man I'm kinda nervous about starting anything back up again.

INTP's are rare and it takes time to figure you guys out. I hope she's interested enough to keep trying because I think INFJ/INTP combos are great, once understanding/boundaries etc. are worked out.

 

[Calvin222]

I've been where you are now, except my INFJ and I were together for well over 3 years. It really sucks, I know. You just have to see the mistake made: you weren't pedantic enough in picking your words so as not to make her feel invalid, yet still be honest about getting your point across. INFJs have a very hard time with criticism!

Hm. Well she says she wants to keep in touch and meet again so I dunno, there might be hope. But ya I appreciate your input. I actually do think she endured a lot from me though over time because I was very detached and intellectual about our relationship and I think that really drained her. Me getting upset may have been the straw the broke the camels back. My intellectualism wasn't that I didn't care though that's just what I do as an INTP when I really take something seriously. I think she knew that.

 

[Duty]

INTP's are rare and it takes time to figure you guys out. I hope she's interested enough to keep trying because I think INFJ/INTP combos are great, once understanding/boundaries etc. are worked out.

It is indeed a very good combination. Both types bring viewpoints that are *very* stimulating to personal growth for the other, and they both LOVE SEX.

 

[Calvin222]

INTP's are rare and it takes time to figure you guys out. I hope she's interested enough to keep trying because I think INFJ/INTP combos are great, once understanding/boundaries etc. are worked out.

How different are we? I think one bad thing about our relationship is I thought we were exactly the same becuase we had so much in common so I sorta treated her like another INTP instead of an INFJ. I think that was bad. I would like to redo that because I think our relationship really lacked warmth because of that and drained her. Also she was very...submissive...in the sense that I would be too intellectual and she woudln't speak up, so it sorta spiraled out of control.

 

[corvidae]

I just read a long post by another INTP (http://forum.infjs.com/showpost.php?p=69252&postcount=6) which was pretty insightful. I think there was a clash between your Ti and her Ni:

The dominant INTP cognitive function is Introverted Thinking:

Analyzing; categorizing; evaluating according to principles and whether something fits the framework or model; figuring out the principles on which something works; checking for inconsistencies; clarying definitions to get more precision

The dominant INFJ function is Introverted Intuition:

Foreseeing implications and likely effects without external data; realizing "what will be"; conceptualizing new ways of seeing things; envisioning transformations; getting an image of profound meaning or far-reaching symbols

As for the solution to the problem, I think that if she understands that you weren't being malicious, you've done your part. INFJs get hurt easily, and there's not much you can do about that. After I broke up with an ENFP I started avoiding her, even though there wasn't even a conflict. We invest a lot of emotion energy into relationships, and I guess she didn't want to risk getting hurt again.

 

[Duty]

Hm. Well she says she wants to keep in touch and meet again so I dunno, there might be hope. But ya I appreciate your input. I actually do think she endured a lot from me though over time because I was very detached and intellectual about our relationship and I think that really drained her. Me getting upset may have been the straw the broke the camels back. My intellectualism wasn't that I didn't care though that's just what I do as an INTP when I really take something seriously. I think she knew that.

You'll be telling yourself this for a while...that there is hope (Ne will tell you: it's possible!), and later you'll tell yourself that no one else is worth the effort...or that no one at all is worth the effort. If I'm any indication, and from what I've read in general, we INTPs have a very difficult time moving on from a relationship we really liked. We pick the people in our life so carefully that we tend to be extremely loyal even after the relationship is long dead.

 

[Sever]

well then you gotta show her that you realize this, that another relationship with you will be different this time. I think that's the only thing that might get her to decide to get back together .

 

[Calvin222]

You'll be telling yourself this for a while...that there is hope (Ne will tell you: it's possible!), and later you'll tell yourself that no one else is worth the effort...or that no one at all is worth the effort. If I'm any indication, and from what I've read in general, we INTPs have a very difficult time moving on from a relationship we really liked. We pick the people in our life so carefully that we tend to be extremely loyal even after the relationship is long dead.

Yeah and I think it's hard to find girls that understand us. I think that's the thing for me. I haven't really met someone like her before so it's kinda depressing to have it end.

I'm actually not too terribly upset, just confused. I'm not sure why the relationship ended. INFJ's are complicated. But you know what looking back I'm not sure either of us were really ready for a relationship. Probably this time off is inevitable.

 

[Duty]

How different are we? I think one bad thing about our relationship is I thought we were exactly the same becuase we had so much in common so I sorta treated her like another INTP instead of an INFJ. I think that was bad. I would like to redo that because I think our relationship really lacked warmth because of that and drained her. Also she was very...submissive...in the sense that I would be too intellectual and she woudln't speak up, so it sorta spiraled out of control.

Classic pitfalls of this relationship...many of the exact ones I had with my INFJ. This is a good thing because the path is easier to diagnose.

The types are different in their concerns and views. INTPs see "what is" in an objective, detached sense, while INFJs see "what is good" in a much more emotional and involved sense. INTPs are observers, INFJs are participants. INTPs are intellectuals...theorizing, conceptualizing, trying to figure out truths about the world, while INFJs are idealists...hoping, trying to find validity for themselves and their emotions, feeling a situation instead of perceiving it for its more objective values.

The INFJ will tend to view the world for what it makes them and others feel...if the world is right or wrong in what it is doing, while the INTP will just tend to view the world for what it actually is. The styles of communication of the types will often be like this too...INFJs will communicate what they view is pleasent, good, bad, right, wrong, valid, invalid, what they have the right to do, etc; while an INTP will tend to just explain the world for what they think it IS.

The problem between these types is often that, when the INTP is explaining how they think the world actually is and that they don't think the INFJ is making sense, the INFJ tends to take it as, "This is what he views about me...he is saying I don't make sense and am invalid."

 

[Duty]

Yeah and I think it's hard to find girls that understand us. I think that's the thing for me. I haven't really met someone like her before so it's kinda depressing to have it end.

I'm actually not too terribly upset, just confused. I'm not sure why the relationship ended. INFJ's are complicated. But you know what looking back I'm not sure either of us were really ready for a relationship. Probably this time off is inevitable.

Not to depress you more: but IIRC, I've read a study that showed that INTPs are not only the least likely type to find a partner and get married, but are also the type most likely to get a divorce if they do get married. I guess others just have a hard time understanding a type that is so simple that they just view the world for what it is...

 

[Calvin222]

Interesting. Would you say an INTP/INFJ relationship is even worth it or are we a bit too different?

 

[Calvin222]

Not to depress you more: but IIRC, I've read a study that showed that INTPs are not only the least likely type to find a partner and get married, but are also the type most likely to get a divorce if they do get married. I guess others just have a hard time understanding a type that is so simple that they just view the world for what it is...

HAHa probably. Are INTP's like the weidest NT's?

Are INTP's weirder than INTJ's or INFJ's?

 

[Duty]

Interesting. Would you say an INTP/INFJ relationship is even worth it or are we a bit too different?

It's extremely worth it, and along with ENTPs and some ENTJs, I'd say it's the most fruitful of INTP relationships. Both partners just have to learn their weaknesses and strengths and try to come to an understanding. ANY relationship will require that.

You just need to learn that she values being "valid." Be honest and open with her, but put it in such a way that you are saying, "I'm just confused, could you perhaps explain it better?" instead of "You don't make any sense to me." Also, know that she requires more attention then you do. Often we INTPs get so engrossed with our interests that we can ignore our partner's needs. Remember, relationships take work, and you have to give her the attention she requires sometimes...even when you're not in the mood.

She has to learn that you often require space...she has to not be too dependent on your constant attention. Although she requires attention and affirmation that she is a good person, she has to learn to be dependent on her own devices for this too, not just your's. Additionally, and this is often a pitfall closer to the early part of the relationship then later, she has to learn that you often really, truthfully, don't have an alterior motive...that she doesn't have to be paranoid about you...that you're of a personality type that is VERY loyal in a relationship, and very honest in how you perceive the world.

 

[Calvin222]

Also, know that she requires more attention then you do. Often we INTPs get so engrossed with our interests that we can ignore our partner's needs. Remember, relationships take work, and you have to give her the attention she requires sometimes...even when you're not in the mood.

I screwed that up hugely. I talked about my ideas too much.