Unfairness

[Carola]

When i see something that to me is unfair , i don't want to be part of it.
I will do things differently and i will preserve my integrity.I think that to me it is more important to not ''gieve up'' to how things are than integrity itself.

Usually it is not only a matter of integrity i guess, because i'm not satisfied of simply not being part of it . Even if i act differently i think again about it , and i will be angry for how the ''system'' is.
Is this a common thing for INFJs?

 

[arbygil]

Depends on what the "unfair" is. Sometimes I can think something is unfair, but my thinking can be clouded by my emotional state. And in retrospect, the thing I thought was "unfair" was actually more than fair. In other situations, such as people starving while I'm not or situations where it doesn't take much for me to tip the balance from "unfair" to "fair" I'll change the balance by being an active part of change. But sometimes we can be very privileged and spoiled, and we don't notice that what we think is "unfair" is actually extremely fair (to the point of it being "unfair" for someone else who bent over backwards to make it happen for you).

It truly depends on the situation for me, and I see myself as an "odd duck." If it doesn't include me at all, then I'm more likely to see something as "unfair." But if I'm in the middle of an "unfair" situation or if an "unfair" situation may concern me, I don't care if it's fair for me or not - I'll try to make it fair for the other person as much as I can, even if it makes it "unfair" for me. That's compromise...which I tend to do a lot of.

 

[invisible]

true injustice is my absolute number 1 pet hatred. it is unacceptable to me. there is no single other thing that motivates me more than the idea that i could make the world a more fair place.

 

[gps]

When i see something that to me is unfair , i don't want to be part of it.
I will do things differently and i will preserve my integrity.I think that to me it is more important to not ''give up'' to how things are than integrity itself.

Usually it is not only a matter of integrity i guess, because I'm not satisfied of simply not being part of it .
Even if i act differently i think again about it , and i will be angry for how the ''system'' is.
Is this a common thing for INFJs?

A common thing for INFJs?
Do mean when they are not actually promoting unfairness under the guise of enforcing rules,`for the greater good', or some other pretense or all-important ends allowing them to self-justify their means?
I certainly detest being subjected to unfairness and tend to not want to be apart of travesties of justice, but hey, here we are.
More-equal pigs can have their way with us in the name of whatever.

I empathize.
Though it seems that we're all left to cope as best we can when we experience unfairness.
It's pretty tough for me to not withdraw or spend my time elsewhere if i can't overcome those who self-righteously manifest injustice in the name of whatever pretenses they offer, if any.


I suspect that all the Introverted iNtuitives feel this way ... having grown up in societies dominated by Extroverted Sensates and the `Jungle Rules' this entails.
I've yet to see any social system in which rule of law was supposedly in place, yet Selective Enforcement by those responsible for enforcing the rules allowed the rule-enforcers to rule and promote their personal, subjective preferences in a decidedly unfair and less than even-handed way.

 

[invisible]

a common thing for infjs?
Do mean when they are not actually promoting unfairness under the guise of enforcing rules,`for the greater good', or some other pretense or all-important ends allowing them to self-justify their means?
I certainly detest being subjected to unfairness and tend to not want to be apart of travesties of justice, but hey, here we are.
More-equal pigs can have their way with us in the name of whatever.

muhuhahahahahahahahaha

 

[invisible]

honestly, i'll never get why some people seem to have such a total default problem with enforcing fairness through laws. of course laws can promote equality and of course that can be a good thing. if it worked when women and black people were allowed to vote, what's different now? are we going to pretend that there aren't still problems with social justice in general? no one's necessarily insisting on having all the answers.

 

[randomsomeone]

I also tend to notice unfairnesses and act accordingly, and even if I can't act I still take note. This tends to come up a lot with people who might get less consideration. I, too, have been known to act against the norm in this regard, but what else is new.

 

[gps]

honestly, i'll never get why some people seem to have such a total default problem with enforcing fairness through laws.

Think Rorschach Test. Now take a long look in the mirror.
Please notice WHO apperceived the theme `to have such a total default problem with enforcing fairness through laws'
Now mention one individual you can't project YOUR theme onto.
Please do. Just one.

of course laws can promote equality and of course that can be a good thing.

I never met laws. What are they like?
My point? Laws can't directly either promote or demote such abstractions as `equality' or `fairness'; individuals can.

And if, for example, equality of intelligence were a goal please forgive me if I take the stance of scofflaw and resist my intelligence being demoted pursuant to those less equal attaining equality through my deprivation.


"It is a wise man who said that there is no greater inequality than the equal treatment of unequals." -- Felix_Frankfurter

And the promotion of across-the-board equality by hobbling, hampering, or re-distributing of rights, abilities, or assets would entail the most Procrustean and inhumane of (mis)behavior vis-a-vis the individual.

if it worked when women and black people were allowed to vote, what's different now?

Different set of assholes in `law enforcement' selectively enforcing any number of laws? As it's your supposition let's suppose you tell us.
If and only If `it worked'?
What are your criteria for assessing how well a regimen of social engineering worked qua worked?
Can those in the categories `women' and `black people' transcend categorical discrimination by voting?
Yes, laws in the hands of law-enforcers CAN result in the rearrangement of deck chairs aboard a sinking Titanic;
though laws and their selective enforcers can't prevent the Titanic and all those who social engineer via such rules from sinking.

are we going to pretend that there aren't still problems with social justice in general?

I believe the theme of the OP was `unfairness' as a personal experience.
To subvert or pervert this theme into `social justice' might promote the experiencing of unfairness by the Original Poster, might it not?

no one's necessarily insisting on having all the answers.

I never met `no one'; If you're speaking on your own behalf why not out yourself as the author of such an opinion or supposition?

Do you actually have anything to say about personally experiencing unfairness which might be of use to @Carola ?
Or would you like to demonstrate how much more `social justice' means to you irrespective of the personal experiencing of unfairness?
Perhaps you'd like to formally admit that there is no person's experience of unfairness which you couldn't overlook while promoting `social justice' in the name of `the greater good'? Only if this is the case though.
I wouldn't want you to experience personal unfairness through an act which might promote social justice while demoting YOUR personal experience of fairness ;-)

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -- Ben Franklin

I suspect that individual liberties are more at issue with Carola than a form of `social justice' produced by two wolves -- be they members of the categories of `women' or `black people' -- voting on what to have for lunch ... regardless of how unfair the metaphorical lamb might feel about the resulting unfairness or `social injustice'.
Though I'd love to read how she feels about such matters in her own words.

 

[justeccentricnotinsane]

It truly depends on the situation for me, and I see myself as an "odd duck." If it doesn't include me at all, then I'm more likely to see something as "unfair." But if I'm in the middle of an "unfair" situation or if an "unfair" situation may concern me, I don't care if it's fair for me or not - I'll try to make it fair for the other person as much as I can, even if it makes it "unfair" for me. That's compromise...which I tend to do a lot of.

This. Although with me, it isn't really like self-sacrifice, it's just not seeing the point. I guess it's patronising really, but when something unfair happens to someone else I speak out without thinking, but when something unfair happens to me, it sort of doesn't occur to me to do it and if someone tells me I should - I just think it sounds petty. I react very differently depending on when I'm involved. It seems less important when it's about me, but I couldn't say why that is.

If you mean unfair in a less personal way, though - I will have nothing to do with something that is plain unfair. For example, I have always been a very conscientious employee - again, I don't see how it helps not to be. But I was asked to lie to steal information while I was in sales and I wouldn't do it. I mean, lying's one thing, but the point was that I was to lie to someone whose job it is to keep the info secure. So they could lose their job if I succeed. Lying in and of itself is stressful and I don't like it but I wouldn't walk out. t think it's just that I was thinking - the outcome of that act is pointless. It's not like you're breaking a moral rule to do something of worth - which I'd be on board with, depending on where I thought the balance lay - it's that you're breaking a rule for just - nothing. You might not even make money out of it and if you do it'll be pennies! And the person I lie to could lose their job if they realise info has been stolen. It just didn't seem worth it.

The same with direct sales. I quit on my first day. It wouldn't be too bad, I mean just embarrassing to pester people, but the only people giving us money were elderly or very depressed - desperate and lonely people that would do anything for us to come in their house and talk to them for a while. That was total unfairness and I couldn't be on with that.

So yeah, I guess there's rules I don't break but it depends on the situation. If the balance goes too far one way then it bothers me. But then I don't go standing up to it either There's not point, really.

 

[Radiantshadow]

I imagine anyone can be angry with "the system" if they have felt slighted by it. Personal validation, "shoulds", and all that jazz.
'Tis said anger is an excellent motivational tool, though not the most efficient one. Change what you can change by yourself, make ripples for what what you can't.

 

[grt$5vb]

When i see something that to me is unfair , i don't want to be part of it.
I will do things differently and i will preserve my integrity.I think that to me it is more important to not ''gieve up'' to how things are than integrity itself.

Usually it is not only a matter of integrity i guess, because i'm not satisfied of simply not being part of it . Even if i act differently i think again about it , and i will be angry for how the ''system'' is.
Is this a common thing for INFJs?

YES. I will absolutely remove myself. Especially in personal situations with loved ones. Personal injustice is too painful for me.

I have learned to tolerate it in a workplace. Issues on a global scale do move me to action, but I can't always rush to the line of fire, as I'd like to, being a mother. :/

 

[the]

I never met laws. What are they like?

Seriously? Quit trolling.

 

[Trifoilum]

That really depends on how we call fair. All of which is a personalized attributes, IMO.

For me, aside from basic equal rights (to live, to love anyone, to have their voice listened and mattered, to be protected, and the usual), people in different status, position, and will have different responsibility, rights, and perspective. Which makes certain degrees of fairness really hard (whose fairness, do tell?) if not detrimental (one's fairness can be another's injustice. And people often justified that by putting the other group as 'beneath' them)

However, certain levels of injustice are indeed intolerable.

 

[invisible]

there is zero way i am going to bother actually answering any of that crap.

 

[gps]

Seriously? Quit trolling.

Trolling? Do you mean like snipping part of a complete paragraph out of one of my quotes and presenting it as if complete?

That sort of trolling?

Once again,

I never met laws. What are they like?
My point? Laws can't directly either promote or demote such abstractions as `equality' or `fairness'; individuals can.

How sweet that you pull this prank in a thread on `unfairness'.
Any other bit of unfairness you'd care to use to try to prove my point?
Yes, individuals CAN promote fairness or not; by your deed you've demonstrated that no law could stop you from unfairly misrepresenting a coherent thought that individuals -- not laws -- promote or demote fairness.

How clever to troll by suggesting someone ELSE is trolling rather than oneself ... just not very.

 

[Majesty]

That's having a conscience, not being INFJ.

Stop thinking every single thing about your personality is related to being INFJ, because it's not.

 

[This]

I think everything on the face of the planet is unfair, Oh well I guess.

Fairness is actually subjective, for me it depends on how locked into a situation I feel and whether or not there our others I can compare myself to directly.

 

[Matariki]

IMHO
Nah, I don't believe its an MBTI thing at all. I can't see it having anything to do with what label you have stamped on your forehead. Morals (regardless of what some say) is the part of you of whats 'right' about our nature as a species, though they are much harder to maintain as they require a sense of humility. Those that live in pride are arrogant towards the needs of others, in our society self-pride (if I can be blunt) appears to be the mainstream religion of today's age. Proud people can't recognize the unfairness that is put onto others, they can only see the opportunities which they can build themsevles up upon, even if it means helping the individual in need, however not to the extent that would them more cost than the reward. That's actually, if not all, most of us that have walked on the planet. I believe its that denominator between the level of pride and humility in out hearts that decides between the difference of what is fair or not.

 

[Flavus Aquila]

I try to be fair - and I know that many other people try to be fair. That keeps me from getting frustrated.

As for unfairness that I can't do anything about - I'll work within it, instead of trying to avoid it. The only way to improve a situation is sometimes to persevere in trying to fix it.

 

[donkeybals]

Sometimes during monopoly when I pass go instead of collecting two $100 bills I collect two $500 bills. I also hide my money under my property before trading with people. Also I announce "advance token to the nearest railroad" when the card says 10 dollar beauty contest. What were we talking about again? I love that game.