The Measure of a Life

[Radiantshadow]

I rapidly approach the winter hours of my life and, in reflection of my own triumphs and laments, am wondering by what measurement others weigh both their lives and that of others. I believe it an inevitable and important event in the evolution of one's development to question the worth of their existence; as we are finite, mortal creatures, it is natural to not only seek a clear benchmark of merit during the life cycle, but also to want to leave this life on good footing, whether for religious or spiritual purposes*.

So, what is the measure of your life? Upon what platform are your measurements formed? How did your views form? How strictly or loosely do you adhere to or construct such measures? Have you found them beneficial? If so, how and why? If not, how and why? Have your measurements changed? If so, how often, between what viewpoints, and why?



*By "spiritual", I do not necessarily mean "mystical", having to do with souls, deities, spirits, energy interactions, or similar things, though such constructions and motivations are, of course, welcome. Rather, I mean any transcendental aspect of human life capable of tying people together, whether it be hope, world peace, global annihilation, the awakening of human consciousness, enlightenment, or [insert ideal here]. I did not include 'moral purposes' because, in my mind, one's conception of morality depends upon the greater worldview through which one views reality, therefore placing morality as the manifest agent of either one's religious or spiritual beliefs.

 

[La Sagna]

I believe that everybody's life has inherent merit because I believe that everyone is a soul that is meant to touch someone somehow. I'm not sure where I got the concept from, except just as a way for me to soothe my own feelings and psyche as to why some people live long lives and some don't. I have to believe that a baby that lives only for a few hours still had a purpose for being born, and that purpose has to be to touch somebody's life, likely his or her parents, maybe a doctor or a nurse, or somebody that is reminded of how precious life is from hearing the story of the baby who died so young. I always think of children who are sick and die young were angels the whole time, because quite often they are the sweetest, most touching little human beings you could meet.

As for the merits of my own life, since I believe that everyone is here to touch somebody's life in some way I have to believe that about myself also. I used to believe that I needed to be the best person I could be, the kindest, most responsible and most worthy of respect from others and that this would give merit to my life. Unfortunatly, I have found out that in many cases, the nicer you are to people the more they take you for granted and in some cases it often leads to mistreatment from the people you are trying to be really kind and generous to...just my own experience. This has led me to change my view to one where I don't feel that I have to live such a 'saintly' life to have a life of merit, my life is of merit simply because I am human and I am alive, doing my best to be a good person is just my contribution but it doesn't change the amount of merit my life has.

 

[bagelriffic]

Its all about truth man, the success of my life is directly tied to how much of the truth in my life I can handle at a time and that means different things at different times but fundamentally its about seeing what's really here, what's really happening at any given time. Its not about ideas or happy feelings or clever spiritual conceptual frameworks. Itss about struggling against my natural tendencies to avoid the truth. I think I do it because its meaningful for me. The closer to truth I am, usually the more pain I feel, but its meaningful because its true, its what's really happening.

Death is a great example, were all gonna die, every single one of us, and furthermore that could be tomorrow, or tonight, I mean really, it could seriously be over, everything in our existence could be gone to-fucking-night. We are never guaranteed even one minute on this planet and yet how many humans have truly integrated this truth into who they are? I'm not talking about intellectually acknowledging it in some detached theoretical way, but really feeling our feelings about it. Embracing and struggling with it in a way that allows it to affect our lives and choices we make every moment of every day, so that whenever it does come we can truly be at peace with how weve lived, regardless of how long. Ill be the first to admit I have not done this, not in a complete way, if death at anytime were real for me right now I probably wouldn't be on this forum, but I've had glimpses, ive seen its implications and I know its possible to do.

Most people I've learned don't give a shit about truth, until they have to, so I don't usually bring things like this up, but its why I was interested in hearing about your experience of death. I don't need other people to make my inevitable death real for me, I can and probably have to go down that road by myself, but I saw that someone was confronting this monumental truth and wanted to know how it was going. I wanted to empathise in hopes I could share and explore this truth with you. Because if I'm being honest with myself, I don't have a future either, and that's really fucking painful, and terrifying, and frustrating. But its like, what else is there? Once you get that society is a total fucking lie I mean straight bullshit, all of it, and that simultaneously your own life, the way you've lived, who you think you are, want to be, all garbage, absolutely all of it, then how can you ever be okay with it again? Jed Mckenna has some awesome videos on this that have been really helpful for me, one of my favorite quotes of his is 'You don't hear it but there's a clock, and its ticking, and you never know how many ticks you have left. The game is on, whether you're playing or not.'

 

[LucyJr]

I rapidly approach the winter hours of my life and, in reflection of my own triumphs and laments, am wondering by what measurement others weigh both their lives and that of others. I believe it an inevitable and important event in the evolution of one's development to question the worth of their existence; as we are finite, mortal creatures, it is natural to not only seek a clear benchmark of merit during the life cycle, but also to want to leave this life on good footing, whether for religious or spiritual purposes*.

So, what is the measure of your life? Upon what platform are your measurements formed? How did your views form? How strictly or loosely do you adhere to or construct such measures? Have you found them beneficial? If so, how and why? If not, how and why? Have your measurements changed? If so, how often, between what viewpoints, and why?



*By "spiritual", I do not necessarily mean "mystical", having to do with souls, deities, spirits, energy interactions, or similar things, though such constructions and motivations are, of course, welcome. Rather, I mean any transcendental aspect of human life capable of tying people together, whether it be hope, world peace, global annihilation, the awakening of human consciousness, enlightenment, or [insert ideal here]. I did not include 'moral purposes' because, in my mind, one's conception of morality depends upon the greater worldview through which one views reality, therefore placing morality as the manifest agent of either one's religious or spiritual beliefs.

First, one question: Why did you placed this thread here, and not in the philosophy thread?

The measures of my life are ground solely on the existence of God. I am a Christian. I believe there is a different world, a spiritual world, that is prior and drives the physical world.

The physical world is subject and has a changing nature on the base of the spiritual world.

I believe we have a soul, and that we humans have a moral agent. Our moral agent is "written on the heart", and it can not be denied by any man.

I also believe that based on our conscience, every human being will be judged for their actions before God, the Creator of heavens and the earth.

I also believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, who died crucified on a cross and raised from the death at the third day, "to lift the sins of the world".


All my life measurements are formed on this, and on the commandaments written in the Bible.

How did my views formed?

I grew up as a Christian, then on the age of 19 I end up being an atheist, one who would believe in morality. After a few months, I would came to the conclusion that life has no meaning, that morality is a ilusion, and that existence itself is absurd. I also thought that to create meaning and a subjective morality, to try to believe in humanity was also just deceiving myself, and create a world in my head that has no link to reality.

Because in the end nothing would have matter, not even love, and it would all turn in darkness and void.

After some time, I begin to read many books, especially classic philosophy, that got me reconsidering my position. I found that nihilism is self-contradictory, and can not be rationally affirmed.
Then I begin reading the Bible again, and my faith would have been stronger than ever. Thus I became a Christian again.

I adhere and hold strongly at my measurements. I am what one might call a conservative Christian.
I think we humans have a moral duty to love each others unconditioned. Only this love if it would be followed, we humans we'll be much more happy.

Yes, I think christian values are beneficial and can save the life of any man for misery.

I was a self-seeking person. I was hating many people. I believed that I was always right. I despised many people for absurd reasons. I thought I was very smart, a genius. That was my secret pride for a long time. I would put all my hopes in my smartness, as if I would be something really great and special, something rare.

But I read in the Bible that all that we have is from God. Given this, only a fool could pride with something that does not belongs to him. In fact, the Bible even call these people like me 'fools', rightly so.
I also read in Bible that moral persons whithout mercy can easily behave like dictators, because they forget mercy in their zeal for justice.

And so I humbled before God. I became a much more happy person, more content and joyful. I didn't experienced any depression or anxiety from then.

So, yes, christian measurements for life are very beneficial. They changed my life.

I hope this answers somehow your questions.
I know, maybe is not something that sounds intelligent, maybe it seems silly for a modern mind. But, like Bible says, "there is nothing new under the sun".

 

[barbad0s]

I was just an empty vessel, then someone sold their soul on ebay and I bought it for $10 USD

jk

Why question the worth of your existence? What does that even mean? Apparently it does mean something to some people... but I'm not sure if I see things that way.

The winter hours of your life, RS? Sounds like you need some spiritual vitamin D...

 

[Nixie]

LOL [MENTION=3998]niffer[/MENTION] Uh yes, it sounds like a bit of an existential crisis.

The driving belief in my life is balance. The daily, hourly struggle to be emotionally, intellectually, spiritually and physically balanced. Life is a circle. There is no hierarchy and as we are all connected, no need to worry about "merit"....we ARE and that is enough.

 

[muir]

LOL @niffer Uh yes, it sounds like a bit of an existential crisis.

The driving belief in my life is balance. The daily, hourly struggle to be emotionally, intellectually, spiritually and physically balanced. Life is a circle. There is no hierarchy and as we are all connected, no need to worry about "merit"....we ARE and that is enough.

+1

 

[muir]

[video=youtube;FhyzQe3KhGk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhyzQe3KhGk[/video]

 

[Radiantshadow]

I believe that everybody's life has inherent merit because I believe that everyone is a soul that is meant to touch someone somehow. I'm not sure where I got the concept from, except just as a way for me to soothe my own feelings and psyche as to why some people live long lives and some don't.

Chance, unfortunately. Everyone is born into a game already in motion and we do not get to pick the rules, merely our response to them (sometimes). It is bittersweet, to be sure.

I used to believe that I needed to be the best person I could be, the kindest, most responsible and most worthy of respect from others and that this would give merit to my life.

The perfect embodiment of ideals is a terrible burden to bear, and, because ideals are human conventions, an illusion as well.

Unfortunately, I have found out that in many cases, the nicer you are to people the more they take you for granted and in some cases it often leads to mistreatment from the people you are trying to be really kind and generous to...just my own experience.

It grieves me to hear that you have experienced this response to good intentions. It is definitely difficult to know upfront who will behave with sensitivity and appreciation; we all take the chance when meeting and interacting with people, whether they are old friends or complete strangers, that our efforts will be abused and our selves disregarded. It is easy in such cases to feel hurt, personally attacked, and even victimized, but the chances are that the response of the person on the other end probably has little or nothing to do with you and more to do with their own view of themselves and the world at large. Not everyone can or wants to be helped and one must acknowledge when they are dealing with either situation lest they be sucked dry without anything to show for it. People must be open to change before anything productive can happen - they/we are both problem and the cure.

This has led me to change my view to one where I don't feel that I have to live such a 'saintly' life to have a life of merit, my life is of merit simply because I am human and I am alive, doing my best to be a good person is just my contribution but it doesn't change the amount of merit my life has.

=) It's liberating, no?

Its all about truth man . . . The closer to truth I am, usually the more pain I feel, but its meaningful because its true, its what's really happening.

How do you know if you have found truth? I do not mean to be either pedantic or dismissive, but, philosophically, it is impossible to absolutely prove the truthfulness of any axiom or premise. According to Kurt Godel's theorems of incompleteness, the rules of logic have nothing holding themselves together besides useful convention. Everything is estimated, approximated - asymptotic, if you will.

. . . Embracing and struggling with it in a way that allows it to affect our lives and choices we make every moment of every day, so that whenever it does come we can truly be at peace with how we've lived . . .

You nailed my view of the matter quite nicely. I live in the present and am content. The past simply informs us and the future is uncontrollable and uncharted.

Jed Mckenna has some awesome videos on this that have been really helpful for me, one of my favorite quotes of his is 'You don't hear it but there's a clock, and its ticking, and you never know how many ticks you have left. The game is on, whether you're playing or not.'

Agreed!

First, one question: Why did you placed this thread here, and not in the philosophy thread?

Because I am explicitly interested in how people evaluate themselves, their lives, and that of other people. This is the sharing, discussion, and analysis of motivation, which is a psychological construct. I did not ask for conceptions of what constitutes a good life, though the two subjects are related.

I grew up as a Christian, then on the age of 19 I end up being an atheist, one who would believe in morality. After a few months, I would came to the conclusion that life has no meaning, that morality is a ilusion, and that existence itself is absurd. I also thought that to create meaning and a subjective morality, to try to believe in humanity was also just deceiving myself, and create a world in my head that has no link to reality.

Because in the end nothing would have matter, not even love, and it would all turn in darkness and void.

After some time, I begin to read many books, especially classic philosophy, that got me reconsidering my position. I found that nihilism is self-contradictory, and can not be rationally affirmed.

No statement or platforum can be completely affirmed. Have you read up on any modern or contemporary philosophy and mathematics? Nietzsche, Schopenhauer, Heidegger, Kurt Godel, Wittgenstein, Bertrand Russell, Alfred Whitehead, and Simone de Beauvoir are all candidates, among others whose names escape me. Though they created the arguments that continue to this day, the positions put forth by the classics have since been greatly refined and their conception changed. Humanism and existentialism in particular have come to the foreground.

As for nihilism: I don't want to go there because I'd rather the thread not denigrate into bickering between theists, atheists, and everyone else with a bone to pick.

Then I begin reading the Bible again, and my faith would have been stronger than ever. Thus I became a Christian again. . . And so I humbled before God. I became a much more happy person, more content and joyful. I didn't experienced any depression or anxiety from then.

So, yes, christian measurements for life are very beneficial. They changed my life.

I am glad to hear that your life has taken an upward turn =)

I hope this answers somehow your questions.

It does, thank you for responding.

I was just an empty vessel, then someone sold their soul on ebay and I bought it for $10 USD

jk

Bahaha! Amusing, as always.

Why question the worth of your existence? What does that even mean? Apparently it does mean something to some people... but I'm not sure if I see things that way.

The winter hours of your life, RS? Sounds like you need some spiritual vitamin D...

I stopped questioning my worth and found contentment a long time ago. As stated in the OP, I'm seriously just curious how other people weigh their own, why, and if any common patterns emerge. This thread was meant to be an inquiry in the range of others' perspectives.

Though you did not answer any of the questions I put forth, you ask a very good question in return: why do people question the worth of their existence? Is it productive or beneficial? What purpose does it serve and what circumstances may bring such questioning about? Conversely, what can end it? What do you think?

As for the vitamin D: my mind is fine, my body is failing. Sunshine every day cannot push cancer away.

The driving belief in my life is balance. The daily, hourly struggle to be emotionally, intellectually, spiritually and physically balanced. Life is a circle. There is no hierarchy and as we are all connected, no need to worry about "merit"....we ARE and that is enough.

Why do folks assign value judgments to neutral information? I'm genuinely curious, because I re-read the original post and found nothing that substantially indicated emotional distress or anxiety. I actually edited the hell out of that post to guard against such interpretations. I did not initially include the introductory bit about mortality and development, but later felt some context to otherwise nebulous questions would help focus the thread.

Anyway, we hold the same view on this matter, which I find somewhat interesting.

 

[say what]

Be happy in the moment, that's enough. Each moment is all we need, not more. -Mother Teresa

 

[JGirl]

merit to whom?
my life has value to me, whereas my existence has advantages (or disadvantages as the case may be) for others.
i think it's useless to try and overanalyse it especially now that i am in the winter of my life as well. (just went through a helluva storm recently too!)
live each day. truly live it. that's all i aim for.

 

[bagelriffic]

[MENTION=4108]Radiant Shadow[/MENTION]

Yeah I hear what you're saying about philosophies and stuff. What I meant was more like what's actually here right now and what can I know for certain. Its more like a question than an answer. I do have a practice and I do use its ideas to help explain my experiences but a lot of times that tendency in me feels like a barrier between me and the truth of what's really happening and what I can know for certain.

 

[sprinkles]

[MENTION=4108]Radiant Shadow[/MENTION]

Yeah I hear what you're saying about philosophies and stuff. What I meant was more like what's actually here right now and what can I know for certain. Its more like a question than an answer. I do have a practice and I do use its ideas to help explain my experiences but a lot of times that tendency in me feels like a barrier between me and the truth of what's really happening and what I can know for certain.

Why do you need to know?

Let's say that one day you learn the truth of absolutely everything. Then I bonk you over the head with the Magic Squeaky Mallet of Forgetting and it all goes away. What has changed?

 

[Flavus Aquila]

I find measuring my life futile, as I am highly biased.

One either over-values, or under-values oneself; and even if one is even-handed, what does that bring?


I think taking time and distance from distractions, pressures, allurements, etc. is important in determining what you want to do with what life/time/opportunity one has - and make the decisions necessary to make the future better than the past.

 

[bagelriffic]

[MENTION=6917]sprinkles[/MENTION]

I hear what you're saying and don't really know for sure why. I think seeing I wasn't true was a pretty big deal for me. I'd always believed in myself and the way I lived my life. Seeing I was fake was pretty devastating, but also meaningful, because it was the truth. I think meaningful is different than happiness, but it can feel more fulfilling for me.

As far as your scenario goes I don't know. I mean if we replaced your magic wand with Alzheimer's, dimensia or a brain aneurysm I'd say its a fair question that I don't really have an answer for. I know it could all be for nothing, and maybe that is even the truth I find if I don't die or forget. At the same time its like well I'm gonna die, no getting out of that truth, what else am I gonna do with my life?

 

[sprinkles]

[MENTION=6917]sprinkles[/MENTION]

I hear what you're saying and don't really know for sure why. I think seeing I wasn't true was a pretty big deal for me. I'd always believed in myself and the way I lived my life. Seeing I was fake was pretty devastating, but also meaningful, because it was the truth. I think meaningful is different than happiness, but it can feel more fulfilling for me.

As far as your scenario goes I don't know. I mean if we replaced your magic wand with Alzheimer's, dimensia or a brain aneurysm I'd say its a fair question that I don't really have an answer for. I know it could all be for nothing, and maybe that is even the truth I find if I don't die or forget. At the same time its like well I'm gonna die, no getting out of that truth, what else am I gonna do with my life?

I've felt similar but then I realized: If I made it this far without certain answers, not knowing if I'd ever find them, am I then really living to find answers? I've gotten this long without them, what's a bit longer?