Left or Liberal?

[kinglear]

I apologise as I'm responding to your post without having read every other post - please allow for possible overlap.

How did you come to this conclusion/this way of thinking about what you wrote above?

Critical appraisal has a very valid role within any society as long as it is in its true form ie students are encouraged/taught to approach an issue from every angle.

yes i have no problem with people taking a critical look but the problem comes when two things happen

firstly if students are only encouraged to criticise without offering any solutions that then becomes simply a downward spiral of negativity

secondly if false or simplistic narratives of history are offered it can conceal from people the true dynamics at work behind events

For example I used to be a big fan of noam chomsky. At that time i would probably have described myself as an 'anarchist' or a 'libertarian socialist'

However i noticed that chomsky would always speak in very vague terms such as blaming 'the US' or if pressed for more details the 'power elite'

But are the american people steering US policy? No they aren't. So how can entire country be blamed for the things that for exmaple the US military does? The power elite are controlling policy. So then we have to ask who the power elite are? Do you think critical theory classes in university teach students who the power elite are? No of course not because the power elite are funding much of the education system through tax exempt charities.

So at the moment we have a lot of negativity towards britain for its colonial past and this is sometimes taking expression through politics that have a racial dimension. But if you look historically at what was happening in britain during the empire building days you can find that the vast amount of british people were themselves shackled to the imperial machine for example in the factories of the industrial revolution (where they ended up after being driven off their lands during the agricultrual revolution)

So once again we really need to be digging deeper into who the power elites were that were building the british empire if we want to point a finger of blame but the simplistic narratives being taught to students in universities as part of recent incarnations of critical theory such as :

'african studies'
'islamic studies'
'asian studies'
'womens studies'

and so on do not dig that deep. Instead they cultivate victimhood narratives that are then encouraging an anger and resentment at the rest of society instead of at the few people who were actually pulling the strings to make those resented events occur

I'm saying that this is done by design by those very same power elites in order to distract the anger away from themselves and back onto society as a whole. This is called 'identity politics' and i see it as a way in which powerful people are dividing and ruling the public

 

[Misty]

lulzz

 

[Skarekrow]

Instead they cultivate victimhood narratives that are then encouraging an anger and resentment at the rest of society instead of at the few people who were actually pulling the strings to make those resented events occur

That is very much just speculation man.
Perhaps it is different in your country (wherever that is since you won’t say)?

I agree that there is a group of people begging to be “victims” of this or that to justify their bad behavior or actions.
I disagree however, that our university education system is creating false narratives and encouraging “anger and resentment”.
Sometimes people get angry on their own when they are educated on things they were previously ignorant about, that is not strange or the intentional cultivation of “victims”.
I think people already don’t blame “the US” as a whole as you stated...that is kind of focused nowhere.
People are very aware who is to blame...at least indirectly, and that is still a pathway to change things.
Yes Congress are mostly paid for by their donors and are more likely to vote with said lobbyist groups’ interest even over the interests of their constituents.
We have fairly clear data of that.
It’s going to take people voting in a bipartisan and compromising way...both of which are in short supply the past few decades.
I have hope though...people are pushing back against damaging societal decisions that are making their quality of life worse.
We have WAY more social inequality now in the US than France did before they started to chop everyones’ heads off.
Just saying...lol.

 

[kinglear]

That is very much just speculation man.
Perhaps it is different in your country (wherever that is since you won’t say)?

I agree that there is a group of people begging to be “victims” of this or that to justify their bad behavior or actions.
I disagree however, that our university education system is creating false narratives and encouraging “anger and resentment”.
Sometimes people get angry on their own when they are educated on things they were previously ignorant about, that is not strange or the intentional cultivation of “victims”.
I think people already don’t blame “the US” as a whole as you stated...that is kind of focused nowhere.
People are very aware who is to blame...at least indirectly, and that is still a pathway to change things.
Yes Congress are mostly paid for by their donors and are more likely to vote with said lobbyist groups’ interest even over the interests of their constituents.
We have fairly clear data of that.
It’s going to take people voting in a bipartisan and compromising way...both of which are in short supply the past few decades.
I have hope though...people are pushing back against damaging societal decisions that are making their quality of life worse.
We have WAY more social inequality now in the US than France did before they started to chop everyones’ heads off.
Just saying...lol.

no you're wrong there are professors and courses that cultivate anger and resentment through over simplified narratives

maybe you don't hear about them as much as i do but i'm very much aware of them

 

[kinglear]

divided society...

How Shitty was Barack Obama as President? Ben Shapiro EXPLODES!

 

[kinglear]

At the part where he says "they're rapists."

Edit: Fair enough, he's apparently assuming some of them are good rapists.

2017 criminal illegal alien I.C.E arrests statistics:
September 15, 2018 by IWB

2017 criminal illegal alien I.C.E arrests:

Assaults…48,000
Sexual offenses…12,000
Weapon offenses…11,000
Homicides…1,900

Total…125,000
http://www.investmentwatchblog.com/2017-criminal-illegal-alien-i-c-e-arrests-statistics/

 

[Sloe Djinn]

2017 criminal illegal alien I.C.E arrests statistics:
September 15, 2018 by IWB

2017 criminal illegal alien I.C.E arrests:

Assaults…48,000
Sexual offenses…12,000
Weapon offenses…11,000
Homicides…1,900

Total…125,000
http://www.investmentwatchblog.com/2017-criminal-illegal-alien-i-c-e-arrests-statistics/

Is this supposed to prove that all Mexican immigrants are rapists? What does a video about a Salvadoran gang have to do with anything?

Edit:sp

 

[Wyote]

Assaults…48,000
Sexual offenses…12,000
Weapon offenses…11,000
Homicides…1,900

Total…125,000

Math is hard

 

[kinglear]

Is this supposed to prove that all Mexican immigrants are rapests? What does a video about a Salvadoran gang have to do with anything?

no of course not!

All it proves is that if you have no controls over who enters the country some of the people who come in will be criminals

so one of the 6 issues raised by the clip in the OP is that the 'left' (communists) want open borders while liberals don't

if you have open borders you do not know who is going to enter your geographic area

 

[Sloe Djinn]

no of course not!

All it proves is that if you have no controls over who enters the country some of the people who come in will be criminals

so one of the 6 issues raised by the clip in the OP is that the 'left' (communists) want open borders while liberals don't

if you have open borders you do not know who is going to enter your geographic area

Well why is this a response to my last post? That’s not what we were discussing.

 

[kinglear]

Well why is this a response to my last post? That’s not what we were discussing.

its a response to your last post where you are implying that trump said all mexican immigrants were rapists

i'm saying he did not say that. i'm saying he said that some of them are criminals and then i posted ICE stats to prove that was the case

I'm also rooting the discussion in the thread by pointing out that the communists want to destroy national borders so that they can destroy nation states

 

[kinglear]

"Resist Everything": Socialist Within State Department Exposed In Veritas "Deep State" Sting

by Tyler Durden
Tue, 09/18/2018 - 09:00
James O'Keefe and his undercover investigators have once again exposed extreme left-wing activists pursuing a progressive agenda within a position of power - this time infiltrating the State Department.

O'Keefe's team has previously released undercover videos revealing radical leftists at Twitter bragging about "shadow banning" conservatives, Democrat operatives paid by the Clinton campaign engaging in voter fraud, CNN employees admitting that the Trump-Russia story was a "fake news" ratings bonanza, and the "culture of anti-Trump bias" at the New York Times.

In their latest installment, Veritas met Stuart Karaffa - a State Department employee who is also a ranking member of the Metro DC Democratic Socialists of America who is "engaged in radical socialist political activity on the taxpayer's dime," while actively advocating for "resistance to official government policies," according to Project Veritas.

Mr. Karaffa’s loyalties seem to be with DSA, not with his employer.

Karaffa told an undercover Project Veritas journalist that he performs DSA activism while at work for the State Department. He explained that he drafts DSA communications while on the job at State Department: -Project Veritas

"… I’m careful about it. I don’t leave a paper trail, like I leave emails, and like any press s**t that comes up I leave that until after 5:30. But as soon as 5:31 hits, got my like draft messages ready to send out," says Karaffa, who doesn't believe he'll get caught for pursuing his own agenda within the Department of State.

"Maybe someday I’ll go to board of elections jail, probably not," he said, adding: "I have nothing to lose. It’s impossible to fire federal employees." Karaffa says "nobody knows" about his activism - and that it's easy to circumvent State Department ethics disclosures because "… somebody just rubber stamps [the form] and it goes forward… I don’t know if [the ethics officer is] all there. He’s so checked out…"

Watch:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018...n-state-department-exposed-veritas-deep-state

 

[Sloe Djinn]

its a response to your last post where you are implying that trump said all mexican immigrants were rapists

i'm saying he did not say that. i'm saying he said that some of them are criminals and then i posted ICE stats to prove that was the case

I'm also rooting the discussion in the thread by pointing out that the communists want to destroy national borders so that they can destroy nation states

Posting ICE stats is completely irrelevant to our difference of opinion on what Trump said.

 

[Skarekrow]

no you're wrong there are professors and courses that cultivate anger and resentment through over simplified narratives

maybe you don't hear about them as much as i do but i'm very much aware of them

Great argument!
“You’re wrong."
Oh yeah...but I thought you didn’t live in the US?
Did you go to college here?
Otherwise - it’s still just speculation and malcontent from the far right who believe “alternative facts” and don’t like the truth to be taught.

 

[kinglear]

Posting ICE stats is completely irrelevant to our difference of opinion on what Trump said.

how so?

what i was saying is that open borders allows anyone in and that would then include criminals, extremists, terrorists etc

trump was saying the same thing as far as i'm concerned

now don't take this to mean that i support trump or agree with everything he's doing. I've given you a more balanced look at things by saying what stuff i think makes sense and what stuff i think is wrong

I'll give you another example. WEAPONS MANUFACTURING. Trump is being good to the merchants of war and helping the war economy in the US

However i am able to look at this is in a balanced way and to also see that preceding presidents ALSO did that and that it is a bipartisan issue because while the republicans receive around 60% of the funding given by the weapons manufacturers (or whats called in the US the 'military industrial complex') the democrats receive around 40% of their funding

So both sides of the house are beholden to the war machine

So what i'm saying is that both sides should be held accountable for that but what i'm seeing is a worrying trend of partisan democrat supporters seemingly being pro-war because they know that their leaders also support that

So i'm saying to people: how about speaking from your own moral compass instead of the political colours pinned to your lapel?

 

[kinglear]

Great argument!
“You’re wrong."
Oh yeah...but I thought you didn’t live in the US?
Did you go to college here?
Otherwise - it’s still just speculation and malcontent from the far right who believe “alternative facts” and don’t like the truth to be taught.

it's more that i can present you with a lot of evidence to prove my point but it would take a certain amount of effort and when i wrote that post to you i didn't much feel like embarking on that process

I could do it but it would take up a lot of space and people would have to be ok with me posting a lot of articles on the forum

 

[Sloe Djinn]

how so?

what i was saying is that open borders allows anyone in and that would then include criminals, extremists, terrorists etc

trump was saying the same thing as far as i'm concerned

now don't take this to mean that i support trump or agree with everything he's doing. I've given you a more balanced look at things by saying what stuff i think makes sense and what stuff i think is wrong

I'll give you another example. WEAPONS MANUFACTURING. Trump is being good to the merchants of war and helping the war economy in the US

However i am able to look at this is in a balanced way and to also see that preceding presidents ALSO did that and that it is a bipartisan issue because while the republicans receive around 60% of the funding given by the weapons manufacturers (or whats called in the US the 'military industrial complex') the democrats receive around 40% of their funding

So both sides of the house are beholden to the war machine

So what i'm saying is that both sides should be held accountable for that but what i'm seeing is a worrying trend of partisan democrat supporters seemingly being pro-war because they know that their leaders also support that

So i'm saying to people: how about speaking from your own moral compass instead of the political colours pinned to your lapel?

I’m not interested in how you’ve decided to interpret wording that is concrete. He screwed it up and didn’t apologize. It’s one of the million reasons he’s hated. That’s all I’m saying and all I’m engaging in conversation about.

 

[kinglear]

I’m not interested in how you’ve decided to interpret wording that is concrete. He screwed it up and didn’t apologize. It’s one of the million reasons he’s hated. That’s all I’m saying and all I’m engaging in conversation about.

what he's done is triggered commies by saying that america should monitor who crosses its borders

the facts prove that many criminals cross the border illegally and kill, maim and rob americans causing loss of life and property and also a loss for taxpayers who then have to foot the clean up job and law enforcement needed to pick up the pieces of that

commies don't care about damage caused because they want nation states to fail so they wish all kinds of terrible things to befall people; they believe the ends justify the means

 

[kinglear]

“If you wanted to control the nation's manufacturing, commerce, finance, transportation and natural resources, you would need only to control the apex, the power pinnacle, of an all-powerful SOCIALIST government. Then you would have a monopoly and could squeeze out all your competitors. If you wanted a national monopoly, you must control a national socialist government. If you want a worldwide monopoly, you must control a world socialist government. That is what the game is all about. "Communism" is not a movement of the downtrodden masses but is a movement created, manipulated and used by power-seeking billionaires in order to gain control over the world ...”
― Gary Allen, None Dare Call It Conspiracy

“socialism is not a share-the-wealth program, as the socialists would like you to believe, but a consolidate-and-control-the-wealth program for the Insiders.”
― Gary Allen, None Dare Call It Conspiracy

 

[kinglear]

“The American middle-class is being squeezed to death by a vise. (See Chart 9) In the streets we have avowed revolutionary groups such as the Students for a Democratic Society (which was started by the League for Industrial Democracy, a group with strong C.F.R. ties), the Black Panthers, the Yippies, the Young Socialist Alliance. These groups chant that if we don't "change" America, we will lose it. "Change" is a word we hear over and over. By "change" these groups mean Socialism. Virtually all members of these groups sincerely believe that they are fighting the Establishment. In reality they are an indispensible ally of the Establishment in fastening Socialism on all of us. The naive radicals think that under Socialism the "people" will run everything. Actually, it will be a clique of Insiders in total control, consolidating and controlling all wealth. That is why these schoolboy Lenins and teenage Trotskys are allowed to roam free and are practically never arrested or prosecuted. They are protected. If the Establishment wanted the revolutionaries stopped, how long do you think they would be tolerated? ---- Chart 9 [Insert pic p125]”
― Gary Allen, None Dare Call It Conspiracy