Just a political rant | INFJ Forum

Just a political rant

Lerxst

Well-known member
Jul 3, 2010
2,380
750
0
MBTI
INFJ
I'm going to post this as a political rant, not an attack so don't take any of it personally.

I am sick of ultra-Conservatives! I'm not talking about the "work hard and take your family" types. I mean, the extreme worst of the worst, short of nationalistic dictators like Hitler.

The old belief in my family is that you hit first and you hit hard if/when you see a threat coming. You don't give your opponent the benefit of doubt or let them land the first blow. More and more over my adult life, I'm favoring this approach to politics as well.

When the "Liberals" dislike something you get protests, sit-ins, camp-outs and marches; general civil disobedience. When the "Conservatives" protest, you get threats and proactive measures of unrest - legal action, impeachments, etc. Which one, does common sense tell you, presents a bigger threat to a group of people? Tea-Partiers get to sit there and wage their verbal wars, marching on whomever they want, while Occupy Wall Streeters get forcibly vacated form public parks... see a bias here?

If it doesn't look like we're in a civil war of any kind, it's because the Conservative regime has stripped away the possibility for the Liberal side to wage a war (in terms of non-violence that is). The true Liberals in the country were "removed" from influence shortly after WWII. The muckraker journalists exposing unethical and harmful industries, the artists inspiring people to stand up for themselves and the politicians calling for more power being given to the people - McCarthyism destroyed them and along with them, that whole movement. If you even looked Liberal, you were declared a Communist and blacklisted form society.

People complain about the "Liberal Media". It's anything but Liberal. It's another example of how and where that war's already been waged. These reporters aren't going undercover and exposing business practices that harm people. They aren't raising questions about our government. They're fed information the government wants to feed them - the entire Iraq War was a media joke. The government set up rooms for them, conferences with them and videos to give them. These weren't Vietnam era reporters risking their lives in the field and showing gruesome images that might actually change public opinion about our government's actions.

Here's a note for all the Conservatives out there - WE ARE NOT LIBERALS. The USA is as far right on the political scale as you get damn near go! Any view... and I mean, any view that differs is going to be more liberal simply by default. Our politics have become a laughing stock to most modern countries - our workers have no rights, our people have no healthcare and for all the geeks out there, even our "high speed" communications system is sub-par (I worked in that field, I still receive the trade journals). What we call a "Liberal" the rest of the world would just call a little less conservative.

During the 19th and early 20th century, Republicans actually stood for and accomplished some incredible, long-lasting things: Lincoln, unified a country and freed slaves, Roosevelt established hundreds of National Parks, Monuments and promoted our natural beauty of the country. No one can argue their accomplishments. Since those days following WWII though, the majority of Presidents and politicians in our country have been the more modern-day version of Republican.

What happened?

We lost the other side. The "Devil's Advocate", the Yin that goes with the Yang. The other voice that was supposed to be incorporated in the system of Checks and Balances in our country. It's gone. We have the ultra-Conservatives, guiding the Conservatives with the not-as-conservative Conservatives in tow.

The Liberals have been benched and removed of any position that would provide a voice.

You think Obama is a "Liberal"? Really? He came form, worked through and grew up in the Conservative system. He didn't make waves, cause trouble or be branded a Communist. He received corporate sponsorships, that feed off the Conservative values. Do people honestly think any politician we elect into office can ever change the system in a positive way?

We've moved so far to the right end of the spectrum, we'd need Karl Marx himself to hold office in this country to even make a dent in our political structure!

We're at a point where the next global superpower moving up the ladder is a Communist country. So tell me, you think our Conservative, All-American agenda for the past 60 or so years has been a good thing???

I'm moving to Canada... :canada:
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Blind Bandit
I think you're getting your rights and lefts mixed up. People on both the right and left want big government, they just want to regulate different things. More government won't solve anything. If we know one thing from history, communism hasn't worked. The one system that has consistently made people richer and has given themselves the opportunity to improve their status is capitalism. Today, we do not live in a capitalist society. Not only are there elements of different economic theories within our form of market, the closest thing we come to capitalism is Crony Capitalism.

The problem with Crony Capitalism is reduced competition due to large firms paying something called rent. This manifestations of this relationship are what we see in current day America. Instead of having the market open for people to provide whatever good/service they want, we restrict entry into markets through regulations and make owning a small business harder through taxation. If you want to give people opportunity they don't have now, you need to increase competition. Get rid of rent. The best way to do this, in theory, is to have a government small enough such that it can't make laws for companies like Monsanto that screw small farmers over.

On the views of our government becoming more conservative, I agree in a sense. Our government is moving towards statism, which is a part of conservatism (big wars, regulating speech, PATRIOT Act). But economically, I would disagree on the basis of how many regulations we have enacted that restrict a free flowing economy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: toska
I think the terms "liberal" and "conservative" are now just meaningless labels tossed around by the media in a stupid game to keep people divided. (I think that is part of what you were saying???) They try to portray the Tea Partiers as old, racist, ignorant, privileged white people who don’t have a clue and don’t care about the poor and OWS protesters as lazy hippies who don’t want to work. In reality many of the things they are both angry about are a result of the collaboration between government and big business…I mean most sane people everywhere who have any grasp of human history just want to be free.
 
Well, some of you are right and 1 dimensional line doesn't describe our politics. If you think in terms of a square chart, though (Political Compass chart) this country has 90% of the politicians in the upper-right quadrant, a couple hold-outs in the upper left quadrant and the rest, like Ron Paul, in the lower right quadrant. We have almost no voice left from those in the lower left quadrant (Libertarian Left) - that's where your true Socialism lies.

Here's a simplified image:

300px-Political_chart.svg.png


The ones we consider "Liberal" are still in that blue section. Once corporations became involved in politics, the ones in that green section became a threat to their way of life - profits. If you're on the Right, you believe in profits, if you're above the line, at least you believe in absolute control. But... shun profits and support personal freedoms and alarms start sounding!
 
Yeah right, liberals dont just protest and sit in, they also kill people, rob peoples houses etc... the same as every fanatical group.
 
I'm sorry, what's that? I couldn't hear you from and over the sound of my AWESOME MOON BASE
 
[MENTION=2890]Lerxst[/MENTION]

take note, they're all aliens.
 
You may like Canada. Know anything about their politics like you think you know about ours?

Ranting can be healthy. Rant on.

Changing office is a checks and balance mentality that can harm as much as help.
 
Yeah right, liberals dont just protest and sit in, they also kill people, rob peoples houses etc... the same as every fanatical group.

I'm sorry, at what point did the NRA switch to the "Liberal" end of the spectrum? Local militias... exactly where do they fall again?

Who's the higher threat, a guy with a knife or 20 people with automatic weapons?
 
We've moved so far to the right end of the spectrum, we'd need Carl Marx himself to hold office in this country to even make a dent in our political structure!

Dude.... it's fucking Karl Marx. If you're going to make a rant, at least make sure that you correctly name the philosopher you mention.

Long live Friedrich Engels!
 
While both the liberals and conservatives (which are merely just labels now IMO) in Congress are to blame for the corrupt state of our country, I am really appalled by the cognitive dissonance in the Republican party. It's just ASTOUNDING how they make their decisions based on how much they get paid or just in spite of the other party. Some of their decisions even conflict with their own views on those issues.

I'm beginning to think we need term limits for congress members, as inside trading and lobbyists have taken over a government that is supposed to represent the people, not the corporations.
 
I'm sorry, at what point did the NRA switch to the "Liberal" end of the spectrum? Local militias... exactly where do they fall again?

Who's the higher threat, a guy with a knife or 20 people with automatic weapons?

depends really on who does what with their weapons, you aren't less dead from being stabbed than shot.
 
Dude.... it's fucking Karl Marx. If you're going to make a rant, at least make sure that you correctly name the philosopher you mention.

Long live Friedrich Engels!

Firefox's type-o correction for "Jarl". Clicked one option too soon...
 
I'm moving to Canada... :canada:

You do know that our current Prime Minister attended an extremely right-wing university, came up through a right-wing Western separatist party that accepted donations from neo-nazis, was extremely anti-immigrant, is working to censor the media, LOVES big oil, wants to build more prisons even though the crime rate is at its lowest point since the 70s, wants to expand the Canadian military, is ruining our reputation abroad, is probably autistic, and is basically creating the same social rifts in Canada that Bush created in America, right? Oh yeah, and we have a full-blown socialist opposition party full of kids who didn't even expect to win the election because their party never wins.

I would even say that America is also socially left-- you still have things like equal opportunity, gay marriage, women's rights… there are other first world countries that don't have that much. The whole censorship thing is scary, the patriot act stuff is terrifying, and there are a lot of reasons why I would never want to live in America, but in relation to a lot of other countries, I think it's still fairly moderate.

I think that PEOPLE everywhere seem to be a lot more polarized than they used to be.

I'm pretty big on socialism and to be honest I hope that we get there someday-- I don't think that communism 'hasn't worked' any more than capitalism hasn't worked. There are problems with both… and the 'failure' of communism isn't in any way absolute. There were problems with the Soviet model, but capitalism can't go on as it is forever either-- sooner or later, all growth is going to stall, resources will dwindle, the strain put on the environment will take its toll, and we're all going to have to learn how to live with less. A centrally planned economy IS inevitable… and to be honest, I'd much rather ease into it during a time of relative stability as opposed to chaos-- because it's during chaos that the fascists rise up.
 
Last edited:
You do know that our current Prime Minister attended an extremely right-wing university, came up through a right-wing Western separatist party that accepted donations from neo-nazis, was extremely anti-immigrant, is working to censor the media, LOVES big oil, wants to build more prisons even though the crime rate is at its lowest point since the 70s, wants to expand the Canadian military, is ruining our reputation abroad, is probably autistic, and is basically creating the same social rifts in Canada that Bush created in America, right? Oh yeah, and we have a full-blown socialist opposition party full of kids who didn't even expect to win the election because their party never wins.

Bickelz is correct--America isn't as right as you seem to think-- the wall street debacle was actually caused by government interference, as well as a few opportunists
 
Communism hasn't been tried yet

The USSR had a centrally controlled market economy so was a state capitalist country. It suited the elites of the US to call it 'communism' as that allowed the demonisation of an alternative to the corporate fascism that exists in the US and it suited the state capitalist centralised dictators of the USSR to call it 'communism' as it gave their regime a certain egalitarian currency when in reality it was anything but. Modern China is also a state capitalist country.

I have some sympathies with capitalists who argue for greater competition because like them i want to see the current coercive hierarchy challenged but their system is still flawed because it is essentially driven by fear

Its easy for young wannabe hotshots to talk up 'competition' but once they've progressed a bit further in the game of life and had opportunities to reflect on priorities they might realise that although they have a nice car and a big house they actually have no one around them that they can truly trust because they have put themselves in a dog eat dog environment where trust is in short supply and they may begin to question whether they have done anything of worth

I've seen this happen to people. Competition is vicious; competition be damned

Concerning the current political system, the reality is that talk of 'left' and 'right' are redundant as both of the main parties are part of a much larger 'business party' or as Marx put it 'the government is the committee of the bourgeoisie'

It should be clearer today than ever before to people as wealth disparity grows, unemployment rises, living costs rise, whilst bankers bonuses are still huge and no bankers are punished for the 'crisis' that Marx's assertion that the government merely reflects the interests of the ruling class is bang on the money.

Politics is largely just a surface layer of theatre to distract the public from the real manouverings behind
 
Back on the main subject again...

Here's another example of what we get when Republicans disagree with society : North Carolina Republican Calls For Publicly Hanging Abortion Providers

Doesn't exactly give me a warm and fuzzy feeling about this group of people. Why is their knee-jerk reaction instinctively a call to violence, or setting examples through violence?

In addition to that, notice how those on the more Conservative end of an argument in politics are some of the first to resort to name calling and mudslinging? Look at Fox News and then Look at the NY Times or CNN.
 
Last edited:
I was on the main subject!

I'm saying that the political system in the US is largely guided by money and by certain allegiances. When you take these into account it becomes apparent that the politicians are for hire and work for the monied interests behind them

If the people want politicians who represent their interests then they need to stop voting for parties that clearly represent the interests of the 1%. However even that is ultimately futile as if a viable alternative was created it would in time be subverted by the money of the 1%

System change is the answer

In the meantime people need to wise up to the fact that the politicans don't represent their interests they represent the interests of their financial backers.

Have you given a politician millions of dollars recently in funding? If the answers no then they don't give a fuck about your interests. That's how 'democracy' works in the US....its all about the money
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lerxst
As an outsider, I don't even see the Republicans as a legit political party anymore. Just like Bill Maher once said, they have long moved from the right to mental hospital.
 
Here's another example of what we get when Republicans disagree with society : North Carolina Republican Calls For Publicly Hanging Abortion Providers

I think the problem is mostly that people respond to this kind of extreme polarizing thinking and it probably snaps them out of their apathy… I'm not completely convinced that this is something where he actually expects to be in a position where he would have to follow through-- which is what happens most of the time anyways.