But, you do have to fit into the world to make your way and survive. And, that demands compromise and balance. Always be whom you are inside, but do what you have to, outside, in the external world. The world is unforgiving and being flexible is not only a matter of survival but, also, a way to get raises, not to mention, jobs. It's okay to sneer at and be annoyed by the bosses of the world, but, it's always good to acquire some acting skills. This doesn't have to obviate your principles.
Intuitives need not apply
- Thread starter Lerxst
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But, you do have to fit into the world to make your way and survive. And, that demands compromise and balance. Always be whom you are inside, but do what you have to, outside, in the external world. The world is unforgiving and being flexible is not only a matter of survival but, also, a way to get raises, not to mention, jobs. It's okay to sneer at and be annoyed by the bosses of the world, but, it's always good to acquire some acting skills. This doesn't have to obviate your principles.
I really don't think that's what analysts do. It depends on the type of analysis. If you're analyzing investment strategies, I wouldn't call that going from A to B, B to C ect. To me, analysis takes a wholeistic approach and the conclusions are deduced from the details. The seems like something Ni would excel at to me.
What about creatively?
Unfettered creativity is the catalyst for progress.
There's getting the job done effectively and efficiently, and then there's setting out to effect advancement. For some reason, I think they may tend to be mutually exclusive.
I'd personally prefer a job where I was paid to do research and contribute to the advancement of a particular field than one where I was applying findings already discovered. Just my idealism. Still, I know none of the jobs I've had have offered this kind of opportunity, and that I may, with luck, find one. Otherwise, realism beats idealism, most days, and I'll have to work effectively and efficiently. Keep the gears turning.
I don't agree that "unfettered creativity is the catalyst for progress." "Creativity," must have structure, otherwise it leads to chaos and nothing results. Just as a pianist cannot be creative without years of work developing technique, an artist cannot produce great art without hard work on the basics (see Van Gogh's earliest attempts at drawing). Discipline and "creativity" necessarily go together.
I'm an inventor with multiple patents and more ideas than I know what to do with. I started three companies based on my inventions. In my own way, I'm "creative" (I dislike the word) and I've brought at least some of my ideas to the market. Creativity is always part of it, but so is discipline, hard work, and the acceptance of risk.
Although creative people use their creativity in everything they do, usually, they have to pay their dues before they have enough freedom to really actualize their "creativity." But, it will never be unfettered.
i don't understand anything about the job search process. i feel like they want me to be constructed of solid platinum robotics mind body and soul.
There's the type of inventor that creates something like the Light Bulb and then there's the inventor that creates something like the Sham Wow; the one that can create something from a drawing on a page and the one that takes an object that already exists and adds a "spin" to it. The first requires a lot more creativity than the second... you might even call it "unfettered" creativity in terms that conventional wisdom of the time is too far behind the inventor's concept to be any help to them. Being able to "think outside the box" when common practices fail, is what I would translate "unfettered creativity" as, whereas structured creativity, would just be resizing the box and changing the shape a bit.
this is how sometimes mbti, or other information, poisons your mind. you're just looking for excuses on how you can not succeed. look for reasons for why you can.
Actually, Edison tried more than a 1,000 filament materials before he settled on using carbonized silk (if I remember correctly). And, Joseph Swan of the UK probably preceded Edison in inventing the light bulb. There is no such thing as an "unfettered invention." Ideas are a dime a dozen. The hard part, the really hard part, is reducing an invention to practice and getting it to market. And, that takes a broad set of skills, patience, discipline, and luck.
Even the most revolutionary inventions are comprised of known components. These components don't just appear out of nowhere but, rather, the invention becomes real when known components are arranged in some novel, non-obvious, and necessarily useful way.
In your mind, you can be completely unfettered. No one can tell you how and what to think. But, if you want to be "unfettered" in the real world (that is, to develop and own your ideas) you have to be willing to take risks, accept the consequences of likely failure, and then pick yourself up and try again. You have to concentrate on intelligent action, not excuses. Persistence is the most important quality a person must have to "create" new things. Without it, you lose.
"To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk" -- Thomas Edison.
You sound like somebody who needs to go into business for himself.
Im a business analyst (ie management consultant), and I can verify that it's xSTJ heaven. What I've learned about real world service oriented business is that the game is simply salesmen at the top, and drones at the bottom who mine enough data to cover the salesman's asses. Intuition really serves little purpose in this worldview. It would maybe help the higher ups, who are all glorified salesmen. It would be preferable that the drones simply do their work factory style. Intuitive thought would only be seen as a distraction, short cut seeking, laziness or insubordination. Sure, the training and the way these firms sell themselves to college grads is all about "creative business thinking for our clients". In reality, our clients aren't idioits who "need" consultants. They just need some automaton temp workers with a good reputation.
Intuitives need not apply". Well put. ENTPs INTJs can lean on their thinking for "those" kind of careers (engineering, entrepreneur, shrewd business in general). ENFPs and ENFJs that I've known are pretty good at dealing with details at least enough until they rise up into the salesman/manager type roles of various careers. ENTJs: self explanatory.
INFPs and INFJs? Psychology, education, religion and underemployment. What else is there?
I think a big part of the problem is that INFJs tend to be "good at" college and get good grades and come off as smart, engaging and wanting to learn. People then expect us to show up to real work with those traits nit realizing that real life is actaully a lot more like high school where you're graded on doing everyhing on everyone else's time, little free time and being organized, diligent and socially savvy count for the most. It makes college a cruel joke. At least if people went straight from HS to work people wouldn't over inflate their expectations of the smart, less organized and less subordinate intuitives who get good college grades.
Very true, and not just INFJs alone. I think it's the same for INFPs as well. The same thing happened in my case where I did fairly well academically, but when I went into the work world, I was very unprepared for the drone work expected. People didn't really care about you standing out or doing better than anyone else unless you're making the company money. So, you're right, most places just want someone who can work in a factory setting -follow the assembly line. Creative thinking is not all that appreciated. Give them what they expect or want; don't try to change things or revolutionise. If you do, you're a trouble maker or you're trying too hard. And don't excel in anything except what they value. If you work too hard at things they don't care about, they'll seem appreciative but then return to status quo. They'll compliment you but then expect you to continue being or doing what they want. They don't really care about improving things.
I think that people would be able to wrap their heads around the idea of working in a corporate structure better if they think of it as slavery: You are meant to do whatever shit or menial tasks that are required of you and you are supposed to do so without complaining or harboring expectations that it somehow "gets better" commensurate with your efforts, talents, efficencies, etc. If you're the type of person who likes to think, who likes to make positive changes, who wants to realize their full potential, then a dead end street is really not for you; you'll need to blaze your own trails.
As for corporate HR's spiel about wanting the recruit "the best and the brightest", it's done for bragging rights rather than wanting to put your brains or talents to good use. But INFJs are shock-proof bullshit detectors; you already know this...
As for corporate HR's spiel about wanting the recruit "the best and the brightest", it's done for bragging rights rather than wanting to put your brains or talents to good use. But INFJs are shock-proof bullshit detectors; you already know this...
Could not have said it better! I love how INFJs have that ability/drive to just "sum it all up" and strip away the pretentiousness.
I still think the biggest issue for me though is that while I recognize that it's modern slavery, everyone else just accepts it. The worst are the people who eier put on the act of "liking it" because of all the shit it buys them, or somehow :gasp: actually like it! They must be robots. These people who dont "get it"..They assume that anyone who doesn't want to be slaves is just lazy or not well in the head.
Slavery = A system of servitude imposed upon oneself by others
Materialism = A system of servitude imposed upon oneself by oneself
Materialism= thinly veiled slavery, a system where people are subverted into equating their self worth with the worth of their material possessions as a means of keeping people in dissatisfying, low-wage jobs for the sake of keeping the machine going and the wealth (not money) flowing upwards ;-)
[MENTION=2890]Lerxst[/MENTION] It is a difficult job market no matter how you slice it and I'm going to assume it is worse in Bumblefuck Utah than the city that rapes your dreams, New York. Even so, maybe consider that in categorizing and defining yourself in such a rigid manner is not the best for internal or external growth. I don't see any clear reason why a predominantly intuitive person should inhibit themselves from developing their sensing abilities in order to adapt, even if it requires Oscar-worthy acting at fist. I think you retain a healthier mindset if you regard both polarities equally, that is to retain balance. It sucks having to go through the growing pains of developing our less evolved characteristics but I always find that it's worth the struggle and is enriching.
[MENTION=2890]Lerxst[/MENTION] It is a difficult job market no matter how you slice it and I'm going to assume it is worse in Bumblefuck Utah than the city that rapes your dreams, New York. Even so, maybe consider that in categorizing and defining yourself in such a rigid manner is not the best for internal or external growth. I don't see any clear reason why a predominantly intuitive person should inhibit themselves from developing their sensing abilities in order to adapt, even if it requires Oscar-worthy acting at fist. I think you retain a healthier mindset if you regard both polarities equally, that is to retain balance. It sucks having to go through the growing pains of developing our less evolved characteristics but I always find that it's worth the struggle and is enriching.