Eric Garner | Page 5 | INFJ Forum

Eric Garner

sprinkles said:
It's called Broken Windows theory. NYC is notorious for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory

Basically what it boils down to is the theory that the way an area looks is a signal for crime. So yes, they do harass and profile people based on looks alone because the theory is that if you can get rid of the bums, thug looking people, etc etc and make the area look pristine, according to the theory it sends a message that the area is being watched and crime is not welcome.

In Broken Window theory it is often accepted to rough up anyone who doesn't fit in, and maybe even get them off the street on trumped up charges for the sole purpose of getting them out of view of the community.
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Interesting perspective I have never heard of it. You would think after enough time someone would see it doesn't work and re evaluate
 
sprinkles said:
It's called Broken Windows theory. NYC is notorious for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory

Basically what it boils down to is the theory that the way an area looks is a signal for crime. So yes, they do harass and profile people based on looks alone because the theory is that if you can get rid of the bums, thug looking people, etc etc and make the area look pristine, according to the theory it sends a message that the area is being watched and crime is not welcome.

In Broken Window theory it is often accepted to rough up anyone who doesn't fit in, and maybe even get them off the street on trumped up charges for the sole purpose of getting them out of view of the community.
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Thank you for this link. I did not know that it actually has a proper name. It's true though, despite your ethnic background around here, the way you dress has a huge factor in how you're treated by the cops. I've even see some young women dressed in "skimpy" clothing and cops around here scope them out and assume that they're prostitutes. All in the name of "trying to keep the city safe".
 
Eventhorizon said:
Interesting perspective I have never heard of it. You would think after enough time someone would see it doesn't work and re evaluate
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Actually....depending on how you read the number (i know u luv that) it can be effective. Where it runs into problems is when cops are required to fill a ticket quota, or an arrest quota or any other kind of quota. For policing to be effective the cop has to be engaged with the people being policed in a manner other than being the enforcer (or harasser).
 
Well for one we need to fire some district attorneys, then some prosecutors, and then some IA guys, and then some cops.
 
Barnabas said:
Well for one we need to fire some district attorneys, then some prosecutors, and then some IA guys, and then some cops.
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What if they are behaving exactly as the system wants them to behave?

What if the failure of the systemto punish clear wrongdoing is a form of communication from the system to cops which says:

''do what you like you are above the law. if you want to kill members of the public then go ahead we will protect you and don't worry if its caught on film we still won't penalise you''
 
Stu said:
Actually....depending on how you read the number (i know u luv that) it can be effective. Where it runs into problems is when cops are required to fill a ticket quota, or an arrest quota or any other kind of quota. For policing to be effective the cop has to be engaged with the people being policed in a manner other than being the enforcer (or harasser).
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They have quotas that they have to meet because:

Fines/tickets=$$$

It's an easy source of revenue for the gov't.

People should protest over doing away with this system. If they didn't exist, I believe there would be a significant drop in police/civilian altercations.
 
Anywhere But Here said:
They have quotas that they have to meet because:

Fines/tickets=$$$

It's an easy source of revenue for the gov't.

People should protest over doing away with this system. If they didn't exist, I believe there would be a significant drop in police/civilian altercations.
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In a small town on a highway, it is believable that the cops are ticketing people, and confiscating property and cash, as a source of revenue. But in a big city, even a medium sized city with a decent economy, the cons out way the pros for that sort of thing. It is just my opinion, but I am just not that kind of cynic.

As for the racism that pervades our society, I truly believe it is more subconscious, subliminal and instinctively behavior. That is not to say that there are not those who hold blatantly racist views.

It is fairly easy to be educated to the point that you accept intellectually that there is no difference on a human level between people, but to confront and alter our unconscious prehistoric belligerence to those who strike us as "other" takes something more than intellectual activity. In our case that innate xenophobia is compounded by a history of treating those not considered one of us as less then human.

This is precisely why those who are most successful at transcending this part of our nature tend to ascribe to religious lifestyles that emphasize love over anything else.
 
Stu said:
In a small town on a highway, it is believable that the cops are ticketing people, and confiscating property and cash, as a source of revenue. But in a big city, even a medium sized city with a decent economy, the cons out way the pros for that sort of thing. It is just my opinion, but I am just not that kind of cynic.

As for the racism that pervades our society, I truly believe it is more subconscious, subliminal and instinctively behavior. That is not to say that there are not those who hold blatantly racist views.

It is fairly easy to be educated to the point that you accept intellectually that there is no difference on a human level between people, but to confront and alter our unconscious prehistoric belligerence to those who strike us as "other" takes something more than intellectual activity. In our case that innate xenophobia is compounded by a history of treating those not considered one of us as less then human.

This is precisely why those who are most successful at transcending this part of our nature tend to ascribe to religious lifestyles that emphasize love over anything else.
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Interesting take on religion. Of which do you speak? Because my take on religion is the opposite. As an example lets use Iran and Egypt whose governments have a marked interest in religion that I think everyone will agree is based on anything but love.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Interesting take on religion. Of which do you speak? Because my take on religion is the opposite. As an example lets use Iran and Egypt whose governments have a marked interest in religion that I think everyone will agree is based on anything but love.
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‘ Compassion’ is the most frequently occurring word in the Qur’an. Each of its 114 chapters, with the exception of the 9th, begins with the invocation ‘In the name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful
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http://www.wccm.org/content/love-and-compassion-islam

In my personal experience, those individuals whom have demonstrated the least amount of bigotry and racism have ascribe to personal belief systems that emphasis love and compassion for all of humanity if not for all of life.

I may be foolish but it is my belief that for a religion to have any real success over the course of time those beliefs must be intrinsic.

I would also point out that Malcom X's view on the compatibility of white and Black Americans radically softened after his visit to Mecca.
 
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Skarekrow said:
This is happening already.
People who are 100% innocent are being harassed by police based on predictive policing algorithms.
http://www.economist.com/news/brief...ot-likely-wrongdoers-dont-even-think-about-it
The future of harassment is here.
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We just had a major police chief in the Uk come out on record and say that he felt we were drifting into a police state because the police are being asked to make judgements about what constitutes 'hate crimes'

You know how this works.....

The government word the law vaguely by outlawing 'hate speech' but who defines what 'hate speech' is?

Basically the government then use 'hate speech' laws to silence dissenters against the government because they are hating on the government

The government pressures the police to apply the 'hate speech' laws but because the guidelines are so vague it then gets left upto the police person to interprete the law however they like

So if a cop is throwing their weight around and you tell them that you are within your rights they then just arrest you under 'hate speech' laws and if they're having a particularly bad day because they spilt their coffee in their crotch that morning and their donut tasted a bit bland and they're in a foul mood they decide to choke you to death for good measure

The guy who choked out eric garner hasn't been charged but the guy who filmed the police choking him out has been charged for supposedly possessing a firearm
 
muir said:
We just had a major police chief in the Uk come out on record and say that he felt we were drifting into a police state because the police are being asked to make judgements about what constitutes 'hate crimes'

You know how this works.....

The government word the law vaguely by outlawing 'hate speech' but who defines what 'hate speech' is?

Basically the government then use 'hate speech' laws to silence dissenters against the government because they are hating on the government

The government pressures the police to apply the 'hate speech' laws but because the guidelines are so vague it then gets left upto the police person to interprete the law however they like

So if a cop is throwing their weight around and you tell them that you are within your rights they then just arrest you under 'hate speech' laws and if they're having a particularly bad day because they spilt their coffee in their crotch that morning and their donut tasted a bit bland and they're in a foul mood they decide to choke you to death for good measure

The guy who choked out eric garner hasn't been charged but the guy who filmed the police choking him out has been charged for supposedly possessing a firearm
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Yep…that guy is still trying to maintain his innocence.
His wife has been harassed too.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/03/ramsey-orta-indictment-eric-garner_n_6264746.html
It doesn’t make sense that someone who was carrying an illegal firearm would stay there filming in close proximity to the police, knowing there is a good chance he could be questioned as a witness.
I find it incredible that these “charges” have been trumped up.
 
Skarekrow said:
Yep…that guy is still trying to maintain his innocence.
His wife has been harassed too.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/03/ramsey-orta-indictment-eric-garner_n_6264746.html
It doesn’t make sense that someone who was carrying an illegal firearm would stay there filming in close proximity to the police, knowing there is a good chance he could be questioned as a witness.
I find it incredible that these “charges” have been trumped up.
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Really?

You started 'the police are out of control' thread....you know the score!

here's another recent story from NYC where a police man shot a guy 'by accident'

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/22/n...officer-fatally-shoots-brooklyn-man.html?_r=0

Officer’s Errant Shot Kills Unarmed Brooklyn Man

By MICHAEL WILSONNOV. 21, 2014
 
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[video=youtube;w8KqDIPdCOg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=w8KqDIPdCOg[/video]
 
SNL’s take.
[video=youtube;fUQ5iZcPMgM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=fUQ5iZcPMgM[/video]
 
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