Could you live without your idealism

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Could you live without your idealism


I'm realising that as an NF, my idealism is an inherent part of my personality. This means, it's like a life force. Wishing or hoping or wanting things to be more, or better or exceed my expectations is a natural part of how I live and see the world. The belief in possibilities and things getting better, however naive it may seem, motivates me to feel and keep on going when everything around me seems to disappoint, or when I feel I've failed. To let go of idealism is to give up on life it seems. It's that part of you that makes you want to keep on living and dreaming. It keeps me alive.

So, could you live without your idealism. What would life be like without it
 
no. . .
it is so much a part of me. . I feel I would die without it. .it is the quest that defines who I am. .constatnly seekng . . growing. . .when I stop doing that it is because I no longer draw breath. .
 
One would have to buy into the idea that it is possible to let go of your idealism first. We all carry our own bias and worldview. It is up to us to see ourselves as clearly as we can and more often than not, we are just staring at shadows on the cave wall. By our very nature, we frail humans live within our own idealistic world--we are somewhat blinded with that idealism when we think about ourselves, others, the world...you name it. I don't think you should ignore it but I think you grow as an individual when you can see past it.
 
Carrie said:
Could you live without your idealism


I'm realising that as an NF, my idealism is an inherent part of my personality. This means, it's like a life force. Wishing or hoping or wanting things to be more, or better or exceed my expectations is a natural part of how I live and see the world. The belief in possibilities and things getting better, however naive it may seem, motivates me to feel and keep on going when everything around me seems to disappoint, or when I feel I've failed. To let go of idealism is to give up on life it seems. It's that part of you that makes you want to keep on living and dreaming. It keeps me alive.

So, could you live without your idealism. What would life be like without it
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i could live without it, physically. emotionally and psychologically i would be an empty shell.
 
Carrie said:
Could you live without your idealism


I'm realising that as an NF, my idealism is an inherent part of my personality. This means, it's like a life force. Wishing or hoping or wanting things to be more, or better or exceed my expectations is a natural part of how I live and see the world. The belief in possibilities and things getting better, however naive it may seem, motivates me to feel and keep on going when everything around me seems to disappoint, or when I feel I've failed. To let go of idealism is to give up on life it seems. It's that part of you that makes you want to keep on living and dreaming. It keeps me alive.

So, could you live without your idealism. What would life be like without it
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Life might be a lot easier without it, IMO.
 
subwayrider said:
Life might be a lot easier without it, IMO.
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I agree but only if it wasn't already a part of you. If you weren't born with it and never had it, then life would be different.
 
I don't think I could survive without it... I feel that hope (for real change/ for a better world/ for myself) is the only thing that keeps me going at times... without it I'd be completely lost. (Idealism often times seems naive to others, but I personally see it as a necessity)
 
subwayrider said:
Life might be a lot easier without it, IMO.
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We are so much closer to intjs than infps in this regard. I have always heard that I was an idealist from others, and thought I was, to an extremely high degree, until being involved with an infp. I, now find that I seem rather pessimistic, in that I lower my expectations, so as not to be disappointed, but pleasantly surprised, whereas he prefers the bar to be raised, so he can rise to the occasion. I have ideals for the world, and humanity in general, but do I believe in the possibility of world peace? No.

I'm not really sure how to specifically answer your question, Carrie, because I think I seem idealistic compared to thinking types, and though I think of myself as "realistic," I am often considered a pessimist by feeling types. *shrugs*
 
I tend to be on the fall on the "realistic" side as well; I really don't think world peace is a possibility (just by seeing/studying; history, morality, and human nature). I do, however, think that a hope for such things is necessary... even if that sounds a bit stupid and contradictory. I guess I'd classify my idealism as a realistic belief in people... certain individuals can go far beyond what's expected and they can bring real change(or simply keep things from degrading)... but this only remains true if people keep their idealism/hope alive. I guess I kind of have a "fake" idealism - I have views that rely/depend primarily on logic, but since I believe idealism is a necessary for humanity...I substitute/sacrifice my own beliefs for a fake (albeit necessary) one which ultimately serves a better purpose (if that makes any sense).
 
I dont think idealism is something you can just drop off in the garbage. Its a part of you. Even if I tried to just delete my beliefs from my robot ISTJ brain there would still be those beliefs lurking in there someplace. According to my computer class I had I would have to format my brain 7 times to be sure that info was gone, and even then it isnt for sure.
 
I feel blessed to be an idealist. I would be an entirely different (and less enlightened) person without it. Although we frequently have a more difficult path, I believe it is a much more rewarding path to walk through life in the shoes of an NF. If I had to have it any other way, I would hope I would have the drive to become enlightened enough to be an NF. :-)
 
Physically yes.
And actually, I don't like the word idealism.
I think it is kind of pejorative.

I prefer something along the lines of creative-thinking or progressively-minded.
It's hard to label it. You know it when you live it.
And, anyway in those instances where I felt those qualities were being squelched, I ended up feeling even more inspired
to think my thoughts or take action.

But I do agree that any characteristic that is central to your personality, that you regard positively--well,
it would be difficult to go on without it. But I also agree with dear @Hoggle over here that those kinds of qualities are not things that you just lose or rid yourself of..
So I guess the nature of the question is confusing.
/ramble
 
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GoofyGirl said:
I feel blessed to be an idealist. I would be an entirely different (and less enlightened) person without it. Although we frequently have a more difficult path, I believe it is a much more rewarding path to walk through life in the shoes of an NF. If I had to have it any other way, I would hope I would have the drive to become enlightened enough to be an NF. :-)
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Sorry you dont become enlightened and then transform into an NF.
 
Nope. It's what keeps me looking for the silver lining when life gets in the way.
 
I just think that without my idealism, I'd be satisfied living a fairly mundane life.
 
I agree that idealism is a part of me (and, presumably, all NFs ─ that's why they are typed as NFs!). I love idealism. While it can sometimes lead to anger when I am agitated by the limitations that others display, I realize that my own idealism is in itself a "limitation" (i.e., some level of insistence on a certain direction for the world). Idealism means I do little things to display my ideal for the future ─ the future of my relationships and the future of a society, social group, or institution. This is by far preferable to direct confrontation with established institutions via discussion and debate. People can disapprove of the intent behind my behavior, for example, rather than what I am saying, because what I'm saying sometimes doesn't match what I do.

My idealism allows me to transcend institutions (this being true for all Ns and SPs). It allows me to be part of institutions for a time, because technically I do not think in terms of (current) institutions. It allows me to change affiliations and to be affiliated with multiple entities at any time. It allows me to blur the distinctions between socially constructed identities, while, for a time, being dependent on social categories (gender, class, sexual orientation, MBTI type, mental disorders, etc) ─ again, not that these social categories should necessarily define people (I draw more from a person's self presentation than on social categories as such).

However, there is one complexity:

1. I have my idealistic self, the one that wants to improve on the world in some way and to contribute to the ideas that are being discussed in society or in my social communities.

2. But I also have my ideal self, the one that is busy defining and redefining myself in terms of how I want to behave as an individual ─ the soft, spontaneous, warm, affectionate side of my personality that I want to live out in the presence of my close friends, acquaintances, community, or in general society.

The two aspects of myself seem to conflict, my "idealistic self" seeming to be more formal, argumentative, executive, definitive, diplomatic, and negotiable (within limits); while my "ideal self" is intimate, vulnerable, (moderately approval-seeking and admiration-seeking), sentimental, and fun-loving.
 
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