Can you evolve into an INFJ? | Page 2 | INFJ Forum

Can you evolve into an INFJ?

I'm not sure an INTJ will change into an INFJ

I think there are certain things going on in the mechanics of the cognitive functions that make them different in a number of ways

I think an INTJ will just be an INTJ who has developed their mushier side

I don't think they will suddenly develop the traits associated with being an INFJ
 
I tested as an intj when I was younger and first,was tested on the MBI,i also was in a severe depression for many years and had a difficult child hood,when I started going to therpy and trying to get better and feel happier I began testing as infj everytime,I was in a state of self denial as a intj I was obessed with being a scientist and accomplishing all this stuff in a short amount of a time but this was just a façade I put up because I wanted to feel smarter then other and was focused on material gains to try to ignore my depression,my true self has always been INFj,when I was little I would always right poems and stories,im a vegatraian,medatiate every day and like looking stuff up on personal growth,i have always been emotional to,I am moved to tears easily and im empathetic and I don't have problems talking about how I feel on a subject,im definitely an enneagram 4w5 to which is an enneagram type assoacted with infj.So yes I think an intj can change to an infj.
 
You are who you are, and you can deny who you think you aren't. You can still see your face in the dim mirror, clearly if, you find the meaning of your life. Recall how you think and feel since in your childhood. When your start to realize the shape of your soul, you'd freed yourself. When this things have come to pass, you will clearly see things that only you can comprehend. You have to unlock yourself to unlock not only the world, but beyond the heavens.
 
I don't know.

When I was deeply repressed I used to test as ENTP.
 
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Nope. You can certainly focus on, accept and develop strengths and weaknesses- but you're pretty much hard wired as is. Sounds like it's time you looked into the actual functions themselves and went down the list.
 
Evolving into other types is practically impossible in my opinion. Since it will require extreme deviations from your innate nature and even rearanging your functions (if possible at all) will not change the functions themselves. If you are 100% sure introverted intuition is your number one function it is not that hard to find your auxiliary. Are you good with and relying on your own logic (Ti) or would you rather trust information that can be checked and proved (Te)? Are you constantly looking for approval and feedback (Fe) or are you more concerned with your own oppinion (Fi)? Te/Fi is INTJ Fe/Ti is INFJ. You can make a more thorough research on the functions but they are the most reliable way to type yourself when you have narrowed down the possibilities.
 
Evolving into other types is practically impossible in my opinion. Since it will require extreme deviations from your innate nature and even rearanging your functions (if possible at all) will not change the functions themselves. If you are 100% sure introverted intuition is your number one function it is not that hard to find your auxiliary. Are you good with and relying on your own logic (Ti) or would you rather trust information that can be checked and proved (Te)? Are you constantly looking for approval and feedback (Fe) or are you more concerned with your own oppinion (Fi)? Te/Fi is INTJ Fe/Ti is INFJ. You can make a more thorough research on the functions but they are the most reliable way to type yourself when you have narrowed down the possibilities.
Yep...it's not merely a T vs. F thing, as on a MBTI test...INTJ and INFJ are wired differently.
 
The challenge of individuation leads one to develop all their functions.

Unconscious content usually finds expression through the weakest function, the more successful the integration, the stronger the function.

The theory of personality types in a Jungian sense recognizes change.
 
I think that [MENTION=9113]Wayfahrer[/MENTION] has a point. Since you know you're Ni-dom are you more Te-Fi than Fe-Ti? Although it's not an easy question to answer (I'm confused with my own functions as well). When you say you have developed your F side is it something what's happened inside your head or is it also visible to others? Don't know if I'm misleading you but I guess Ni-Fi combo would be super introspective...
 
I not consider a change in your MBTI to be an evolution.

Its not progress because no type is good, bad or an improvement over others.


That said, I think MBTI tests are influenced by thoughts and feelings at the time you take them.
I believe it's perfectly natural to test as something else every once in a while as your perception of yourself is often influenced by your environment.
I assume though that the test result you feel most reflected in and get most frequently reflects your type though.


Then again I have yet to type as something other then INFJ and I'm no expert ^^"
 
I wouldn't call it evolve, but can you "change type"? Yes and no. If you could change, what that means is the type you were functioning as wasn't so innate to you.

Carl Jung thought the type could change, and said so in several people, it seems even including himself. Originally he typed as a thinking and sensation type, later by thinking and intuition (it's unclear even today which was dominant -- there are speculations and hearsays). Originally he thought thinking dominant though.

Type is very similar to your psychology -- aren't we "sort of the same underneath" but with significant different features to our psychologies as we grow and face life? The type is a dynamic entity that keeps developing. The extent to which you can say there's "one original fixed you that you grow within the boundaries of" is not something we know. The MBTI leans towards hardwired/innate as their stance, but that's not the stance of every offshoot of Carl Jung's psychology.

I think the closest to true is some things remain sort of fixed, and other things seem to vary. For instance, maybe you could never not be an intuitive, yet the other things are more flexible. The right answer in these cases is that you don't have a strong distinctive preference but that you develop a coherent pattern in one or the other direction (e.g. favor more thinking or less) over time.

There's also the thing that you might have a reasonably set habit it's hard to break even if deep down you feel that you developed into this due to your life progression, circumstances, etc. The real truth is we have an innate nature that we need to fit to circumstances to function coherently, and so our manner of functioning also gets fixed somewhat as we need a pattern generally that works to not be wildly unstable. How much variation that pattern contains depends a lot on the individual.

As a comment, Isabel Myers didn't believe you had to have this model:

blacklight said:
are you more Te-Fi than Fe-Ti

You could be Te-Fe as your aux/tertiary and Fe-Te as your aux/tertiary. By this model, actually, the only difference between INFJ and INTJ would be if they're feeling types over thinking types!
They'd both have inferior-Se.

Sorry for quoting you on a few points BTW if the information is not helpful to you, but I hope it is, and you seem to be searching and I figured dispelling some of the limiting notions of type sometimes helps people get the requisite flexibility to type themselves as they are, not as a model forces.
 
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You could be Te-Fe as your aux/tertiary and Fe-Te as your aux/tertiary. By this model, actually, the only difference between INFJ and INTJ would be if they're feeling types over thinking types!
They'd both have inferior-Se.
Hmm. I must say I'm a bit confused here. Are you saying that when typing people it doesn't matter whether the auxiliary and tertiary functions are introverted or extraverted, only thing that counts is the order?
 
INFPs evolve into Charizard.
 
I wouldn't call it evolve, but can you "change type"? Yes and no. If you could change, what that means is the type you were functioning as wasn't so innate to you.

Carl Jung thought the type could change, and said so in several people, it seems even including himself. Originally he typed as a thinking and sensation type, later by thinking and intuition (it's unclear even today which was dominant -- there are speculations and hearsays). Originally he thought thinking dominant though.

Type is very similar to your psychology -- aren't we "sort of the same underneath" but with significant different features to our psychologies as we grow and face life? The type is a dynamic entity that keeps developing. The extent to which you can say there's "one original fixed you that you grow within the boundaries of" is not something we know. The MBTI leans towards hardwired/innate as their stance, but that's not the stance of every offshoot of Carl Jung's psychology.

I think the closest to true is some things remain sort of fixed, and other things seem to vary. For instance, maybe you could never not be an intuitive, yet the other things are more flexible. The right answer in these cases is that you don't have a strong distinctive preference but that you develop a coherent pattern in one or the other direction (e.g. favor more thinking or less) over time.

There's also the thing that you might have a reasonably set habit it's hard to break even if deep down you feel that you developed into this due to your life progression, circumstances, etc. The real truth is we have an innate nature that we need to fit to circumstances to function coherently, and so our manner of functioning also gets fixed somewhat as we need a pattern generally that works to not be wildly unstable. How much variation that pattern contains depends a lot on the individual.

As a comment, Isabel Myers didn't believe you had to have this model:



You could be Te-Fe as your aux/tertiary and Fe-Te as your aux/tertiary. By this model, actually, the only difference between INFJ and INTJ would be if they're feeling types over thinking types!
They'd both have inferior-Se.

Sorry for quoting you on a few points BTW if the information is not helpful to you, but I hope it is, and you seem to be searching and I figured dispelling some of the limiting notions of type sometimes helps people get the requisite flexibility to type themselves as they are, not as a model forces.
According to Jung, you cannot be both Te and Fe at the same time because those functions are in opposition (they would compete with each other for judgment). The functions exist in the order they exist for a reason. An extraverted judging function has a corresponding introverted judging function...An introverted perceiving function has a corresponding extraverted perceiving function. If you are Te-auxiliary, then that means you chose to leave feeling introverted (Fi)...ditto for Fe vs. Ti...both extraverted Judging functions trying to express themselves simultaneously in the same "space" would likely elicit confused judgment. The face that such an individual presented to the world would likely be seen as convoluted and irresolute.
 
blacklight said:
Hmm. I must say I'm a bit confused here. Are you saying that when typing people it doesn't matter whether the auxiliary and tertiary functions are introverted or extraverted, only thing that counts is the order?

I'm saying that not all theorists even believe the tertiary of an INFJ is Ti. Myers would say it is Te. The model NiFeTiSe has caught on, but there have been other models out there, and the one adopted today is not the one CG Jung had in mind.

What this tends to suggest is type yourself by what functions you identify with, not by what they're "supposed" to be.
 
Basildon said:
According to Jung, you cannot be both Te and Fe at the same time because those functions are in opposition (they would compete with each other for judgment). The functions exist in the order they exist for a reason. An extraverted judging function has a corresponding introverted judging function...An introverted perceiving function has a corresponding extraverted perceiving function. If you are Te-auxiliary, then that means you chose to leave feeling introverted (Fi)...ditto for Fe vs. Ti...both extraverted Judging functions trying to express themselves simultaneously in the same "space" would likely elicit confused judgment. The face that such an individual presented to the world would likely be seen as convoluted and irresolute.

Actually the funny thing is this has caught on, but shows how much the theory of functions has undergone modifications in focus since Jung. If you look up a famous Jungian analyst named John Beebe, it is in his theory that the tertiary and auxiliary alternate in orientation (if one is introverted, the other is extraverted).

CG Jung would've said in many say, introverted thinking types, the rest of the functions could be all extraverted, i.e. "Ne, Se, and Fe", and this was also Isabel Myers' bias, except she focused on individuals with a developed secondary function only, not ones with only a developed dominant.
It's understandable that you think this is Jung's view, since you'd expect a famous Jungian analyst to perhaps have parallel views. However, there isn't agreement among them on how to type people.

The reason for this is that, in reality, Jung viewed the primary thing being the attitudes of introversion/extraversion, and the functions were at most a sub-expression of those things --- so in his model, the psyche doesn't alternate. He would say the conscious psyche is introverted in an introvert, and everything else is extraverted. The dominant function thus attains the introverted attitude, but the rest may all be extraverted.

Also, when you speak of Te and Fe being used "in the same domain" roughly, well in Jung's view, to the extent someone develops Te, they actually repress Fi the MOST. Because, quite simply, thinking and feeling are opposed in his theory, and introversion and extraversion are also opposed in his theory. Just because feeling is introverted doesn't mean it somehow doesn't conflict with thinking anymore --- and why would it be so?

The big difference is you might be thinking, extraverted functions "deal with the outer world" so as long as you don't "deal with the outer world" using feeling, and deal only with the inner world using feeling, there's no conflict --- Te can do its business in the outer world, and feeling can do its business in the inner world.

But, the subtle points here:

-- you do not have to "deal with the outer world" using an extraverted function in Jung's typology. You do in the Myers-Briggs outlook. In Jung, extraversion means you are merely exhibiting a greater focus on the outer world, but it doesn't mean that to think introvertedly, you can ignore objects entirely in favor of the subjective. Rather, it is merely a predominance of your interest in the subject which deems the function introverted. This means that you can deal with the object using a function which you prefer to use in an introverted way --- merely in your dealings with the object, always you'll bring things back to connect to the subject.

-- feeling and thinking deal with different realms anyway. That is, Fe and Te don't deal with the same kinds of judgments generally --- sometimes feelings are more relevant. Sometimes thoughts more relevant. Many times when making a heavily value-based determination, feelings are most crucial. If one makes such determinations, and considers the outside above all, then that becomes extraverted. The question of Te interfering? Well, if it does, that means feeling isn't developed enough to stand up for itself, as in for instance a dominant Te type. In these types, feeling gets pushed to the repressed unconscious personality which is why it attains the rejected attitude of introversion.

A more modern MBTI theorist Dario Nardi also makes note that Myers differed from modern practice in how she ordered functions

Dario Nardi said:
This model does not work for everyone, and diverges slightly from Myer’s original hypothesis, which switches the third and seventh functions. This switch was proposed by Harold Grant and others in 1983 and many find it true. Grant proposed that functions develop one after another over a lifetime following this sequence. This model has caught on but seems to miss something.

The model you speak of is not due to Jung, but to Harold Grant, and it was also taken off with by John Beebe, (my guess being) because he felt it better matched his psyche and /or made more intuitive sense to him.
 
i believe that we all evolve constantly in all manners of different directions. our experiences shape us. who knows. who cares about labels anyways. be happy about who you are! let me know what that feels like if you get there. i've heard that it gets easier to change into who you want to be when you're happy with who you are already.
 
Anyway, Basildon, if that was too lengthy a read, please take the following as the most important conceptual difference to keep in mind:

-- In MBTI theory, you need functions to alternate in attitudes to deal with the two worlds --- one to ensure you take care of the outer world, representing a separate approach to it and the other to ensure you take care of the inner world, with its own approach. This idea is used by some pretty big Psychological Types scholars, including Beebe.

--- Whereas, other theorists of high stature, including Jung, have had an alternate take --- that extravertedness/introvertedness of a function isn't about where you deal, so much as what you prefer to deal with, i.e. where your energy tends to flow to the greater degree (while emphasizing you cannot have PURE types, in that you can never make something 100% introverted functioning --- or you'd be absolutely crazy!). So you could use thinking as a function to deal both with outer and inner worlds. Simply, you would prefer to connect things back to the outer world if you are an extravert, to the highest degree --- i.e. it would be your focus.

As to which is "better," well clearly people differ -- John Beebe has had extensive training as an analyst. And he clearly finds his model fits him better than the traditional Jung way.
Others may find the traditional way fits better. Or something entirely different.

Just have to study the theory diligently and figure out what are and aren't reasonable modifications to make.
 
Yes. We are created. Not born.