Arguments with a Si | INFJ Forum

Arguments with a Si

Discussion in 'Psychology and MBTI' started by Razare, Jul 29, 2010.

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  1. Razare

    Razare Community Member

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    My best friend is an ISFJ. This type has a very strong introverted sensing function. Just as an example, he bought Starcraft 2 and was installing it. He mentioned to me that it was continuing upon the old story which made me laugh. I thought, "They're continuing a story from 13 years ago? Who the hell is going to remember that?" Well, he did. So to his credit, Si is something I marvel at.

    We do occasionally get into arguments over something. This is when I reach conclusions that have no solid basis in fact. He makes me explain how I derived a conclusion and what evidence it is based upon. The thing is, with Ni, the evidence I use isn't complete.

    It's a combination of several hints that cause me to make a stab at a likely explanation. He never sees how this is possible, because until it is proven, who is to say. I usually end up pointing out that he does this very same process in every day life; that the things he takes in as sensory inputs are really just perceptions, "hints" at the reality of things. He takes it for granted a chair is there when he sits down, but who is to say it's there until proven. He considers solid sensory inputs as proof.

    I end up agreeing with him to an extent that yeah, many things I believe will never be backed up by sensory facts; however, if I can reach a conclusion and there's a better than 50% chance that the conclusion is a correct one, I can act upon that conclusion in advance of knowing for sure. Therefore, it's a benefit to exhibit this quality because I believe that my hunches are perhaps 60% accurate. As long as the risk of being wrong isn't too great, then acting upon my hunch grants me a benefit.

    Investing is where this quality has come into play the most for me, but it's a fairly difficult endeavor as far as the discipline is concerned. Hunches are great in investing, but discipline is greater.
     
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    #1 Razare, Jul 29, 2010
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2010
  2. Odyne

    Odyne ===========
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    A friend that I hang out with a lot, is an ISFJ. We get into arguments too, perhaps even often. I reach my conclusions much quicker than she does, and the way I do it is that I hop around in thought till I land on something that "feels" right. This is something she can't understand, and usually disregards my conclusion, and if she agrees with the conclusion she disagree with the way I reached it. (which can be frustrating!)

    When we argue and I present a new idea or an opinion of mine, she disagrees right away. Sometimes even, when I am trying to explain to her how I came with the idea, she just shakes her head in disapproval and says that my arguments have no ground. Why, well the route I took is not what it was "supposed to be".

    When I do base my arguments on solid ground, she is still hesitant to accept them. I noticed that if the concept is something she is not used to or new to her, she will not even take it in consideration. If the theory is not thoroughly experimented through ages and ages of time, it holds no water to her. It has to be something proven and concrete.

    Funny, my ISTJ friend on the other hand, doesn't react so much like her. He usually tries and sees if my theory or idea can be proven in a concrete matter, without rejecting the initial thought.

    I guess that's where we see the difference between Si+Fe and Si+Te?
     
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  3. Billy

    Billy Contents Under Pressure
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    I remember the storyline from the originals too, but not because of Si, I would imagine it has more to do with Ti in my case.
     
  4. AUM

    AUM The Romantic Scientist

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    I usually can't stand talking with a strongly dominated Si individual, mainly because I suck with Si to begin with. I have a terrible memory for facts and details and when people come up with me with arguments that happened months back, I get really annoyed that they seem stuck on the past. I really don't care much about the past, the only purpose it serves is to remember your mistakes and avoid doing them in the present or the future.

    Of course there still more to Si then just remembering facts and details, but it's something that constantly bothers me.
     
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  5. Jonathan

    Jonathan Community Member

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    I just got used to giving up around people with strong Si. They have so many facts and figuers they can throw at me out of nowhere, and all I have is my abstract, "it's not concrete but I know it's right" ideas. Since they can always prove averything with facts, and I can't really come up with any, I just agree to disagree until I can think some more.
    This really gets annoying/ upsetting when I'm in a theological or ethical debate. It really irks me,too, because the ISFJ's I know get pretty smug when I can't 'prove it.'
     
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    Razare

    Razare Community Member

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    I appreciate Si and wish I were better at it. If an Ni user could accumulate and recall facts with the same level of detail as an ISFJ or ISTJ, then their intuitions would be highly robust. Furthermore, we could defend our conclusions in arguments because we'd remember the facts that they're based upon. I think it would improve my worldview and intelligence to have this library in my head. As a substitute for Si, I use wikipedia and the internet as a crutch. Often, I wish I had a direct neural link to the internet to quickly access data. I suppose the problem is that I've entered into academia where I'm supposed to remember facts in detail.
     
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  7. AUM

    AUM The Romantic Scientist

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    I completely agree. And I'm amused at not being the only one who relies on outside sources for their facts. Yeah, that's why online interactions are soo good, because it gives me time to go back to a source and check if the facts I'm about to post are true :p
     
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    Razare

    Razare Community Member

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    Yep, the ONLY reason I am passing college is because I can learn new things exceptionally fast. Ni Fe Ti is highly quick to adapt to new intellectual scenarios. My ESXJ friend with a strong Si is in college and sometimes he has to read content a few times before he "gets it." I think we adapt so quickly because our Ni only gets firmly rooted when we're discussing our value systems. Using Ni on intellectual topics, we can easily see things from any angle, as long as we're willing. We only need a few hints to get to the answer anyway, where an Si type is going to need factual backing for any theory they are trying to understand.
     
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  9. IndigoSensor

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    Si does not equate to a good memory. Si simply places an importance on memory. I actuallly have an extremely good memory for many many things. I play it down a lot as it allows me to navigate in the social world much more effectivally.

    Also your functions do not equate to speed either. I am an INFJ and I often have to reread things and replay them in my head several times before they stick. I am actually a rather slow thinker. I take a very long time to process things.

    I am friends with quite a number of ISxJ's and several of them are actually on the spacey side and can be unaware of things to a shocking degree. While they place importance on memory, it doesn't always make them good at it and it can actually make them miss a lot.

    Also think of this. Ni dominants place an importance on intiutition and "forcasting" the future. Does this make all Ni ruled people good at this? Absolutely not. Intelligence is a factor, not MBTI.
     
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