Are Jails Just Societys Way Of Getting Rid Of Undesirible People? | Page 2 | INFJ Forum

Are Jails Just Societys Way Of Getting Rid Of Undesirible People?

I think you might have misunderstood me a but too. I have never felt the poor of any nation are ignorant. I have found more will and power among my friends who are "downtrodden". I have been around those who speak up and I have helped them do so. I get irritated when I see my mother treated like she is stupid because of her heritage. She is treated like she is ignorant and she is one of the smartest people I know.

I think I am pointing out what the misconception is rather then my own personal beliefs. It shouldn't be the stereo type, but it is. It makes me angry and very sad. I was shocked when I moved to this country in my late teens and again in 2005. I could not believe the change that had gone through here. I don't understand things still and I don't think I ever will fully understand. I think the problem is not always ignorance, but misinformation.

I have a hard time explaining myself so I will have to give this some more thought. My main point is I was pointing out a stereo type and not explaining myself further.
 
efromm said:
I will not disagree there. I still think most guys that go in for say a minor drug charge like have some weed and a pipe, come outta jail a new person. And not the kinda person that has actually been rehabilitated either. Jail is not there for rehabilitation or reeducation. It seems to only be there to lock you up and bog you down. It steals all your hope and makes you cynical. We are supposed to be showing these guys that being good will make good things happen for you. What they are getting is exactly the opposite in my estimation. It is a total disgrace and an injustice for the people that can be rehabilitated to have to be with people who will kill you on a daily basis. And thus turn you into a killer or criminal yourself just to survive. To me that seems like cruel and unusual punishment.
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Do you think there is a relation between drugs and poverty? I'm mostly thinking about economically depressed areas of inner cities. It's a quick and (if you're clever enough) more accessible way to make money. These areas are not only economically depressed, but they also have very poor education. I read recently that in Gary public schools they were going to cut music and art due to poor funds. Not only is that evident of the economic depression in that area, but it also demonstrates the way those inhabiting that area are viewed by the rest of society-- as if they don't matter as much.

If those kids don't have an opportunity to express themselves creatively or the opportunity to discover and maybe actualize hidden talents it's as if they're being told "You're no good." If you're told something long enough, you start to believe it.

Pair shitty education with a horrible job economy in a given area and, in my opinion, it's easy to see how people can turn to crime.
 
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I just want to say that this has nothing to do with race for me. I know plenty of people of all colors that have been to jail myself included. With that said let me give you my world view on race. I look at race like one would look at apples. There are different variates of apples they come in all different colors , shapes and sizes. Each different variety adds something different to the apple family and keeps you from getting the same thing over and over. Differences are good and it helps keep the species going.
People are getting put into jail because a lot of poor laws are being written to get them there. And once people get put into the system they have you. Jail to me seems like a waste of time without rehabilitation. What is the point of jail with out rehabilitation? Society has created a bigger problem for its self by locking all these people up who I believe could be rehabilitated. And it seems that the money that goes for the programs has been taken away to support the jail.
I believe as always it's the American citizens responsibility to keep tabs on this stuff. To fight for their fellow mans rights as well as our own. The fact that this was the richest nation in the world and we could have done better bothers me. And humans who get addicted to drugs are only criminals because there is a law saying so. If your going to put people in jail because of laws society wrote, don't ya think we should be more proactive in creating humans that will not go down that road? In the end it all begins with all of us deciding to be better humans for humanity's sake.
Taking money away from schools is total bullshit to me but I wonder who is getting the money? We spend a lot on education in this country and it seems to go no where except into the pockets of administrators and unions. Screw them what we need is teachers who can be allowed to teach. When I was growing up in a very poor logging and mining community we still had band,chorus,art,computer science,auto shop,wood shop,metal shop,home ec, and loads of after school sports or clubs. How did we manage with less money? We are giving our young people no chance of success.
Look across the United States what do you see? I see a lot of jobs that have gone away and need to come back. The crime rate will climb because there is nothing to do for work. People get desperate and do what they think they gotta do to survive. Is the government really going to help them? Hell no they tell you to figure it out on your own. But you better not break any of the laws or your going to jail. I can bet you that everyone of us has broken the law at one time or another. They have created a web that they can catch everyone of us in. And ever since the war on drugs started a lot of people that did not need to go to jail have ended up there. That is all I was trying to say. So in the end we agree on your statement "Pair shitty education with a horrible job economy in a given area and, in my opinion, it's easy to see how people can turn to crime." And if you start locking people up in that community you generate revenue and jobs for the others that have been fortunate enough to not go to jail. It's time for a change...
 
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efromm said:
I just want to say that this has nothing to do with race for me. I know plenty of people of all colors that have been to jail myself included. With that said let me give you my world view on race. I look at race like one would look at apples. There are different variates of apples they come in all different colors , shapes and sizes. Each different variety adds something different to the apple family and keeps you from getting the same thing over and over. Differences are good and it helps keep the species going.
People are getting put into jail because a lot of poor laws are being written to get them there. And once people get put into the system they have you. Jail to me seems like a waste of time without rehabilitation. What is the point of jail with out rehabilitation? Society has created a bigger problem for its self by locking all these people up who I believe could be rehabilitated. And it seems that the money that goes for the programs has been taken away to support the jail.
I believe as always it's the American citizens responsibility to keep tabs on this stuff. To fight for their fellow mans rights as well as our own. The fact that this was the richest nation in the world and we could have done better bothers me. And humans who get addicted to drugs are only criminals because there is a law saying so. If your going to put people in jail because of laws society wrote, don't ya think we should be more proactive in creating humans that will not go down that road? In the end it all begins with all of us deciding to be better humans for humanity's sake.
Taking money away from schools is total bullshit to me but I wonder who is getting the money? We spend a lot on education in this country and it seems to go no where except into the pockets of administrators and unions. Screw them what we need is teachers who can be allowed to teach. When I was growing up in a very poor logging and mining community we still had band,chorus,art,computer science,auto shop,wood shop,metal shop,home ec, and loads of after school sports or clubs. How did we manage with less money? We are giving our young people no chance of success.
Look across the United States what do you see? I see a lot of jobs that have gone away and need to come back. The crime rate will climb because there is nothing to do for work. People get desperate and do what they think they gotta do to survive. Is the government really going to help them? Hell no they tell you to figure it out on your own. But you better not break any of the laws or your going to jail. I can bet you that everyone of us has broken the law at one time or another. They have created a web that they can catch everyone of us in. And ever since the war on drugs started a lot of people that did not need to go to jail have ended up there. That is all I was trying to say. So in the end we agree on your statement "Pair shitty education with a horrible job economy in a given area and, in my opinion, it's easy to see how people can turn to crime." And if you start locking people up in that community you generate revenue and jobs for the others that have been fortunate enough to not go to jail. It's time for a change...
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Put that on youtube, Now!
 
If your going to put people in jail because of laws society wrote, don't ya think we should be more proactive in creating humans that will not go down that road?
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Absolutely.
The crime rate will climb because there is nothing to do for work. People get desperate and do what they think they gotta do to survive. Is the government really going to help them? Hell no they tell you to figure it out on your own. But you better not break any of the laws or your going to jail.
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Which basically demonstrates that we do not live in a democratic society.
And if you start locking people up in that community you generate revenue and jobs for the others that have been fortunate enough to not go to jail. It's time for a change...
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Preach it! Tells us more.
 
It's a huge issue and one that needs to be fixed if I treated my child like a warden treats a prisoner what kinda kid would I end up with?
 
efromm said:
It's a huge issue and one that needs to be fixed if I treated my child like a warden treats a prisoner what kinda kid would I end up with?
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My guess would be that the child would grow up with no real sense of self, alienated from their own needs and wants, in fear of authority. They would not be a free person in any respect. They'd never live their own life, they'd live the life that was handed to them to live. They would be dehumanized.
 
And I bet they would end up right back in prison! It's designed that way for a reason!!! Shai I would post a you tube vid if my web cam would work lol
 
I will have to get the web cam figured out. I don't even have a you tube page to post it on..:m080:
 
efromm said:
I just want to say that this has nothing to do with race for me. I know plenty of people of all colors that have been to jail myself included. With that said let me give you my world view on race. I look at race like one would look at apples. There are different variates of apples they come in all different colors , shapes and sizes. Each different variety adds something different to the apple family and keeps you from getting the same thing over and over. Differences are good and it helps keep the species going.
People are getting put into jail because a lot of poor laws are being written to get them there. And once people get put into the system they have you. Jail to me seems like a waste of time without rehabilitation. What is the point of jail with out rehabilitation? Society has created a bigger problem for its self by locking all these people up who I believe could be rehabilitated. And it seems that the money that goes for the programs has been taken away to support the jail.
I believe as always it's the American citizens responsibility to keep tabs on this stuff. To fight for their fellow mans rights as well as our own. The fact that this was the richest nation in the world and we could have done better bothers me. And humans who get addicted to drugs are only criminals because there is a law saying so. If your going to put people in jail because of laws society wrote, don't ya think we should be more proactive in creating humans that will not go down that road? In the end it all begins with all of us deciding to be better humans for humanity's sake.
Taking money away from schools is total bullshit to me but I wonder who is getting the money? We spend a lot on education in this country and it seems to go no where except into the pockets of administrators and unions. Screw them what we need is teachers who can be allowed to teach. When I was growing up in a very poor logging and mining community we still had band,chorus,art,computer science,auto shop,wood shop,metal shop,home ec, and loads of after school sports or clubs. How did we manage with less money? We are giving our young people no chance of success.
Look across the United States what do you see? I see a lot of jobs that have gone away and need to come back. The crime rate will climb because there is nothing to do for work. People get desperate and do what they think they gotta do to survive. Is the government really going to help them? Hell no they tell you to figure it out on your own. But you better not break any of the laws or your going to jail. I can bet you that everyone of us has broken the law at one time or another. They have created a web that they can catch everyone of us in. And ever since the war on drugs started a lot of people that did not need to go to jail have ended up there. That is all I was trying to say. So in the end we agree on your statement "Pair shitty education with a horrible job economy in a given area and, in my opinion, it's easy to see how people can turn to crime." And if you start locking people up in that community you generate revenue and jobs for the others that have been fortunate enough to not go to jail. It's time for a change...
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I would agree with Shai Gar here. Webcam this on YouTube.
This is obviously straight from the heart and very well put.

As addition, I Googled "amount spent on education" and got this:

I copied this chart directly from this site: http://education-portal.com/articles/Iraq_War_Spending_vs._Education_Spending.html
Though the statistics are from 2007, 36% of the U.S. national budget is military. Check out how much is Education.
The article is eye-opening and needs no supplementary comments from me.
 

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You know what I think that is interesting about that chart is that education and job training are way low on the list of expenses. How can we build a country if no one knows how to do anything. It seems to me that the government is making the population dumber on purpose. If they make us so ignorant that we don't understand they get control. Look at the average American these days what do you see? I see a lot of spoiled little kids running around getting mad because all their little toys are getting taken away! I see a generation of spenders with no real job skills to offer. We only need so many service jobs and when the economy goes down so do the jobs. We need industry but we regulated it to death! And while we sit here and do nothing China chugs out smog like a felon! And we are getting farther behind. Only a government full of fools would sell off their industry to a foreign country. Other places are hurting now because they were depending on us for jobs. And our economy for the last 20 years or so has been really artificially inflated. As we got rid of our industry over the last twenty years we created all these service type jobs that are now being lost. And it is a double edge sword for all of us now. You can hate the steel workers loggers or miners all you want. Some of you are now in the same boat as the rest of us. We will always need people building this country. Just like bees in a hive everyone has a job to do that they are good at. There is enough prosperity in America for everyone it is the dream that is America. It is the reason that men who could not always see eye to eye sat down and decided to do something that had never been done. This country is but a shell of what it used to be. The human spirit is much stronger than any of us can imagine we have the ability to change, to adapt, to over come.
Even people who go to jail deserve redemption if they are willing to accept it. Even a murder I believe as long as he is not insane can change. Look at a serial killer. On his best string he could not kill as many people that are killed in one day by a machine gunner in world war two. Think about what they must have seen in that war. Then they come home and we let a bunch of guys that have been running around with guns killing people into the general population. How many of those guys enjoyed killing after they started it? All the ones that I have known are good guys as far as I know. How many guys are in jail for shooting someone or stabbing someone? It seems to me that state endorsed killing is okay. If you decide to kill some one in your own little personal war you go to jail. If your country orders you to do it your a hero. If ya do it for your own selfish reasons your a murder. There really is no line in the bible. Thou shalt not kill if I remember right. Oh ya there was a sub section b section f in the um uh fine print that got cut off the page. If my neighbor is pissing me off and I want to fuck his wife and have his land clause your off the hook. Come on look at it for what it is. That shalt not kill. How nice would it be? I know it will never happen. I am a dreamer, and that is what makes me cry inside because I know in my heart that all of us are better than we think we can be. And we are better off when we all work together.
 
Where are our YOUTUBE VIDEOS!

Seriously. You just keep writing these posts, and we'll tell you which ones to youtube. You make a great teacher.
 
And lets not forget other on that list it is 12% and education is 5%? What the hell is other and why does other need so much cash to do what other does? Made an account on u tube. Still gotta get this camera figured out. efromm72 is my name some one else already had my name. Thanks shai!! Just speaking my mind...
 
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do you have a camera and just don't understand it, or don't have a camera?
 
Got one it just records the vid messed up the play back is screwed up after I record it. Got a new lap top coming and it has it all built in should be here friday
 
When it comes to drugs, laws were imposed because theraputic intentions spread to the streets and arouse abuse.

I don't believe it is a way for society to get rid of misfits. Many people in Jail have commited heavy felonies. Although I do think that trials of crimes are corrupt. As such, I mean the Jury. It seems as if the jury are very much affected by the crime itself e.g. they are appalled that a 6 year old was murdered and therefore judge the defendant as guilty because someone has to be punished for such a crime. Especially when it comes to 'wittnesses' as proof...
 
The title "Correctional Facility" doesn't give you a hint?
 
Yea it is missleading, I would presume that behaviours are corrected in mental institutions and not in Jail. Although keep in mind that they are there in the first place because they are a danger to society and/or because the government are threatened by them. As such don't you think anyone involved in mass homocide and rape should have their imprisonment?
 
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