- Aug 21, 2015
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Would you live forever if you had the choice?
- Thread starter TinyBubbles
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It's a fascinating question, really. My first (almost instinctive) thought would be: "Yes, of course! Right now!"
But would I be so affirmative so quickly were I actually presented with the choice? I don't think so. Many more variables would come into the equation, like: would I continue aging or would I stop aging? What about my close ones?
I think that if the deal were to be unending life with aging, I would say no. It sounds like a terrible prospect, to be honest. But if I could just stop aging right now.... let's say that the temptation to say yes would be very strong. But I would need to be faced with the choice concretely to know my answer.
But would I be so affirmative so quickly were I actually presented with the choice? I don't think so. Many more variables would come into the equation, like: would I continue aging or would I stop aging? What about my close ones?
I think that if the deal were to be unending life with aging, I would say no. It sounds like a terrible prospect, to be honest. But if I could just stop aging right now.... let's say that the temptation to say yes would be very strong. But I would need to be faced with the choice concretely to know my answer.
In the most realistic scenario, not aging is the very definition of living forever. In this scenario, dying by other means is possible. Otherwise we're talking about fantasy.
As far as your loved ones, people within your lifetime will die whether literally or in your heart (and vice versa) anyway. Our limited lives already has this misfortune.
If there was a God, I'd say he has put a limit on the span of life. People learn, and with knowledge in the context of opposing forces or being in competition for resources, we take for ourselves, and it must come from others. We simply learn to protect ourselves, and on the opposing side of the same coin, deny others of their protections. We get older and more evil. If you disagree, you're unaware of the indirect consequences others face of your well-being. You haven't been given the guilt of decision that extends outside your bubble of awareness. A bubble perhaps provided by the success your government and country. You could point the finger at them, but without these structures of civilization, you'd be put in an environment to make moral decisions.
I'm gonna have to go with a hard no... Being a spiritualist my studies have brought me to the belief (based on logic\intuition) that our spirit is trapped in our physical bodies. We come we complete our soul purpose if we can and then we leave.
It has been proven (or at least strong theories exist) different dimensions exist. Sacred geometry connects to the next dimensions (shows the way).
Buddhist say this is not the real world (spirit world is).... Essentially to live forever would be the equivalent to being held in the 8th grade indefinately... Speaking from a spiritual point of view. Evidence for astral projection and what little we know of conciousness leads me to believe that we know very little about this place we live and our existence.
What if this is simply a pupae or chrysalis stage of evolution? You think a catapiller knows he/she is going to transform into a butterfly <shrugs>
More likely goes like this "OMG WTF this is painful, argggh... Kill me now ... <Pop>. "OMG WTF I can fly !?" ......... "Someone should write a book" <flys off>
...but yeah sure... I'm sure in this great mysterious universe we live in.... It's just <poof> space dust...
Yeah... Think I'm gonna stick with a hard no...
It has been proven (or at least strong theories exist) different dimensions exist. Sacred geometry connects to the next dimensions (shows the way).
Buddhist say this is not the real world (spirit world is).... Essentially to live forever would be the equivalent to being held in the 8th grade indefinately... Speaking from a spiritual point of view. Evidence for astral projection and what little we know of conciousness leads me to believe that we know very little about this place we live and our existence.
What if this is simply a pupae or chrysalis stage of evolution? You think a catapiller knows he/she is going to transform into a butterfly <shrugs>
More likely goes like this "OMG WTF this is painful, argggh... Kill me now ... <Pop>. "OMG WTF I can fly !?" ......... "Someone should write a book" <flys off>
...but yeah sure... I'm sure in this great mysterious universe we live in.... It's just <poof> space dust...
Yeah... Think I'm gonna stick with a hard no...
My answer is no.
Why?
Because if we had the option of living an immortal life, then each moment we would have living in this world would no longer have any special meaning, it would just be like any other day.
In a way, I do prefer that we have a limited time on this planet. We don’t waste time and we try to make the most of it while we still can and have time. Each second and each day is precious.
Immortality is appealing to us human beings, but would it still feel special? To some maybe, for me, no.
Life is sweet because it is finite.
Why?
Because if we had the option of living an immortal life, then each moment we would have living in this world would no longer have any special meaning, it would just be like any other day.
In a way, I do prefer that we have a limited time on this planet. We don’t waste time and we try to make the most of it while we still can and have time. Each second and each day is precious.
Immortality is appealing to us human beings, but would it still feel special? To some maybe, for me, no.
Life is sweet because it is finite.
JennyDaniella said:
What about the ability to do new things? If anything, there would be more potential to pursue new things than ever before, if we got rid of all the monotonous stuff like fighting hunger, death, etc
Each day will be special and different because you can do something you didn't do before.
I think how interesting the world is depends on the world, not on the length of time -- after all, I can imagine a world with 50 years to live where each day there are no opportunities to do anything
I realize you might just not feel this worth it still/understand and all... but just in case it changes your answer at all
what if we'd like you around!!My answer to the question is yes, if the world would offer me what I want/need of course. A terrible life is not worth living.
What about the ability to do new things? If anything, there would be more potential to pursue new things than ever before, if we got rid of all the monotonous stuff like fighting hunger, death, etc
Each day will be special and different because you can do something you didn't do before.
I think how interesting the world is depends on the world, not on the length of time -- after all, I can imagine a world with 50 years to live where each day there are no opportunities to do anything
I realize you might just not feel this worth it still/understand and all... but just in case it changes your answer at all
My answer to the question is yes, if the world would offer me what I want/need of course. A terrible life is not worth living.
True, but unfortunately not many people would have the luxury to do new things, especially if circumstances are continuing the way they are now. I know I would be able to and I am grateful and blessed to have the opportunity to do those sorts of new things, but after a while, life would no longer hold that underlying appeal of mystery and wonder. Knowing that there is so little time gives me a bigger reason to truly enjoy every moment with my loved ones, friends, and what life has to offer.
Eventually will there be a point, no matter how much novelty we get to experience, when we would have had enough and be ready for the end?
I am not afraid of death, for it is just a part of life. In a way, I will embrace it. Life without death would be like pleasure without the experience of pain. There would just be no counterpoint and our appreciation of what we have would likely diminish over time.
Nonetheless though, I do agree with your perspective as well! There are definitely more new things to experience and who knows what more new inventions and profound creations newer generation will bring to us!
I guess it just really depends on the person though. Some people would like to live more longer, but for me, idk, probably not.
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JennyDaniella said:
So one thing about this is I was talking more in principle than practice, because the point is if circumstances are bad enough, I'd not want to live even 10 years!
Let's assume for sake of discussion that circumstances go well, and you can pursue new, interesting things daily.
Would you still not want to live forever?
Another general line -- why is life worth living now for you? Death just says it'll end -- that could be a good thing if life sucked, and a bad thing if life is great.
I just always felt that what counts as a 'sufficiently long time' for life to seem worth living is subjective, that at the end of the day I can always find reasons if I try, and if I don't have reasons to continue, maybe I never had a reason to live in the first place!
This is basically based on the idea that there seem to be an infinite number of things to do, and I could've gotten tired of them at any point, but basically the choice to go on living seems to just be the choice to keep finding meaning in pursuing things. The fact that I found it fun to go on living till now suggests I'll never find a reason not to.
BTW, notice this line of thinking of mine breaks down if I think I have any special specific purpose for being alive. That is, if I see my task as X or Y, then I'd say OK, now my task is done, I no longer need to live. However, since I don't think there's any specific such task that I inherently live for, it seems like either my reasons for living always were equally existent or equally nonexistent!
I'm trying to ask you how I can reason myself into a corner and accept death
LOL I don't yet have such a reason I'm able to findThe interesting thing is the exact point that you derive meaning from seems to kill it for others -- some would say if you'll lose everything anyway there's no point gaining a bunch of stuff. In fact, a lot of religions' promise of eternal life is precisely because life seems meaningless without it.
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Eventually, the wealthiest individuals will start doing this. Frankly, if an individual truly loves life, his or her family, even cranking up his favorite song and singing along. then he should go for it.
These people -- well, all people have control over their body, and every right to extend their lives. In my limited experience, every person I've known who desired the extension was narcissistic, and generally nasty and mean to friends and family, waitresses, humans in general.
In time, normal people would be pushed out. Of course the "underclass," working poor, even the middle class would not mate with elites, and eventually the elites would become the new normal, start flexing their muscle by shaping policy, and in time, pump out a slew of blond haired, blue eyed babies.
Social engineering will destroy meek, kind people. An ultimate bully win.
Naturally it will happen.
These people -- well, all people have control over their body, and every right to extend their lives. In my limited experience, every person I've known who desired the extension was narcissistic, and generally nasty and mean to friends and family, waitresses, humans in general.
In time, normal people would be pushed out. Of course the "underclass," working poor, even the middle class would not mate with elites, and eventually the elites would become the new normal, start flexing their muscle by shaping policy, and in time, pump out a slew of blond haired, blue eyed babies.
Social engineering will destroy meek, kind people. An ultimate bully win.
Naturally it will happen.
So one thing about this is I was talking more in principle than practice, because the point is if circumstances are bad enough, I'd not want to live even 10 years!
Let's assume for sake of discussion that circumstances go well, and you can pursue new, interesting things daily.
Would you still not want to live forever?
Another general line -- why is life worth living now for you? Death just says it'll end -- that could be a good thing if life sucked, and a bad thing if life is great.
I just always felt that what counts as a 'sufficiently long time' for life to seem worth living is subjective, that at the end of the day I can always find reasons if I try, and if I don't have reasons to continue, maybe I never had a reason to live in the first place!
This is basically based on the idea that there seem to be an infinite number of things to do, and I could've gotten tired of them at any point, but basically the choice to go on living seems to just be the choice to keep finding meaning in pursuing things. The fact that I found it fun to go on living till now suggests I'll never find a reason not to.
BTW, notice this line of thinking of mine breaks down if I think I have any special specific purpose for being alive. That is, if I see my task as X or Y, then I'd say OK, now my task is done, I no longer need to live. However, since I don't think there's any specific such task that I inherently live for, it seems like either my reasons for living always were equally existent or equally nonexistent!
I'm trying to ask you how I can reason myself into a corner and accept death
The interesting thing is the exact point that you derive meaning from seems to kill it for others -- some would say if you'll lose everything anyway there's no point gaining a bunch of stuff. In fact, a lot of religions' promise of eternal life is precisely because life seems meaningless without it.
If circumstances were to be better and I would have the opportunity to experience new things, it would be a slight possibility, but I am still undecided.
I don’t know, will there ever be a time when enough is enough? When you have had the chance to experience everything you have ever wanted? Eventually there will be a time when there will be a standstill and there won’t be anything new left to experience, until much much later, years or decades until a new thing arises.
Are you familiar with the latest philosopher Douglas Adams? He created a funny parable ‘Wowbagger the Infinitely Beyond’ from the Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Universe Project. If not, I will link the story. It’s similar to what I am trying to explain. I actually quite enjoy it haha
http://hhgproject.org/entries/wowbagger.html
Personally, I have no trouble with those who would want to live for many lifetimes, that’s understandable, but eternity? I don’t know man lol.
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JennyDaniella said:
There's always a harder problem to try solving! I mean, maybe not in the practical world but at least in the world of logic -- always a harder mathematics problem or logic puzzle.
I don't think there's a limit to how much knowledge we can try to acquire, hence no limit to the number of experiences!
The two things that drive me personally to be pretty sure of wanting to live forever are that my 2 things in life keeping me living are sentimentality and thirst for knowledge. Sentimentality by definition is for stuff you don't want to ever lose/are attached to. I'm attached to my loved ones/don't want to ever say goodbye.
And knowledge seems like it's infinite/you can keep complicating things further.
Very true indeed. If anything, knowledge would be among the main reasons why I would change my decision and perspective regarding immortality—it is to enrich myself more with knowledge and concepts—and of course my family and friends. Excellent points there.
I guess one thing I fear is just the general theme of boredom— when you have already experienced every aspect of life and then what?
If I was granted to live say another extra 100 years, then yeah I’d be up for it, but not for eternity haha.
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JennyDaniella said:
Well you won't! That's the whole thing -- I think creation/knowledge is infinite
I mean, I think of it this way -- why didn't we run out of stuff to do in 10 or 15 years of our lives? There seems to be no better reason we'd run out after 2 million than after 10. If we're gonna run out after 2 million maybe we'd have run out after 5 minutes.
Basically, the scope for interesting stuff is ultimately the scope of knowledge, and basically you can always concoct something there. I think the world of food and resources is finite but not knowledge. Maybe you'll get bored of food, but there's always going to be more knowledge.
As for experiences, I imagine with virtual reality technology we'd be able to expand the scope for that, too.
The way I also see it, I don't wanna say goodbye to any loved ones. And it doesn't seem like there's any limit to the stuff I can do to keep myself occupied either, so hey, sounds like an easy decision
True.
I am probably going to sound a bit cynical and pessimistic here though lol.
In realistic terms; let’s say humanity didn’t ever improve, it just continues the way it is now— then I certainly wouldn’t want to continue living extendedly for eternity; especially if I repetitively see humanity continue making the same stupid mistake after another, you would know from the underlying knowledge of history that things repeat itself.
And if humanity never develops the technology for interstellar travel, or some other civilization changing technology, it's hard to imagine that you wouldn't start to view everything as mundane and bleak after a while.
You would eventually see the human race crumble due to violence with war, lack of resources, or age. I certainly wouldn’t want to stick around.
Just realized I went pretty dark there haha! But these are just the following aspects, including boredom, that truly prevent me from making a definite decision in whether or not I can truly withstand immortality realistically if things never improved.
If perhaps the world did, then idk. Maybe my perspective would be different. But for now, it is a no. I just hope maybe I can be wrong. I will actually look forward for that day.
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