What is a normal amount of jealousy or control in a relationship?

[Marshmellow0103]

Is this the only way he is controlling? Does he make you get rid male friends on social media or was his problem with you hanging out with them alone? Does he spy on you? Does he look through your phone?

He does get upset if I have guys on my social media accounts. Only one he didn’t seem to care about (aside from family) was a family friend (my moms friends son)... and he has also told me to show him my phone before...
I did tell him I’d show him my phone/messages any time though.

 

[Marshmellow0103]

Looks like he was right not to trust you with guys.

It was a very complicated situation. I never lied to him or anything like that until after he lied to me, and I lost respect for him for a while and my logic was “he’s a liar so he’s probably cheating on me anyway”. All I did was go to a fast food restaurant and a church gathering with a guy I used to tutor.

 

[Marshmellow0103]

THIS! These are his issues. It may not be that he doesn't trust you, @Marshmellow0103, but that he doesn't trust other men. Whatever the truth of it, no one should have to give up friendships with a particular gender due to a partner's insecurities.


Exactly!!! Very controlling behavior, and it bleeds into every other area of the relationship.


And this!

I hope you two can solve these things together. Perhaps couples counseling if you're both committed to one another to see this through.

We had talked about it multiple times in the beginning of our relationship...

At first we agreed on neither of us talking on the phone or hanging out with the other gender, but that texting was ok. I guess we’re both jealous people, so i thought it seemed like a happy medium, and I was completely ok with it being that way.
Then we had an incident where he promised to call me at a certain time, but within 5 minutes, he said “if you hear a girls voice it’s just a girl from this game” (on the ps4 voice chat.) and he then asked if he could call me back later.
I talked to him about it and he said he thought it was ok to talk to her since it was just through the game. I’d told him if he wants to talk to other girls, it’s ok but I don’t want to be doing that for him and him not care enough to do the same thing for me. But he preferred our original agreement...
Then he kept raising issues about me texting my guy friends, and I kept telling him I didn’t want to be controlled that much and that I’d show him the messages if he wanted, but he said he would just get more jealous seeing the messages so he didn’t want to. Then he would just start acting really cold towards me and when I asked what was wrong, it was always “I’m upset about those guys...” or “I have to act like this so I won’t get upset about you talking to those other guys”
So I did finally give in because I was tired of arguing...
He’s an ENTP so I’ve heard they’re manipulators... (^^;;

 

[Lurk]

Not exactly. Loooong before that situation ever happened he told me he didn’t want me to talk to guys outside of work. Despite that I went out (to a fast food restaurant and a church gathering) with a guy I tutor, and further lost his trust, so at this point, I can’t blame him for being a bit controlling.
I’m pretty much just asking about whether or not a guy not wanting his girlfriend to talk to other guys is psychological abuse or something because a lot of people are acting like it is.

I think you know it's considered psychological abuse, but for some reason you're being coy. I think your boyfriend sounds rotten. You may secretly feel flattered that he tries to control you because it makes you feel loved and cared for. Well, at this early stage in the relationship, "love" is a misnomer. It's all about how one makes the other feel. "I love the way you make me feel, but I don't love you. If these pleasant feelings I have around you cease, then you are history."

Love is feeling deep empathy and concern for someone. It is not conditional; it is about the other person's well-being, even if they make you feel lousy. Real love is familial love, in my opinion. Maybe companionate.

He doesn't love you. He may in the future, but I wouldn't wait around that long because he disrespects you and controls you in a pretty abusive way. No, he won't change. If you are a dependent person, you may feel safe around him. He will eventually verbally and emotionally abuse you.

This isn't rocket science. It's predictable. That's my honest opinion. I don't have more to add. Good luck, and don't bury your head in the sand.

 

[Marshmellow0103]

I feel like to really understand your situation, it has to be put in a wider context. So: do you feel like it's just this particular case of him being controlling or he can be also controlling about other aspects of your life? And more importantly: how he reacts when you reject any of his ideas or wishes? How he feels about differences between both of you - starting from small preferences to bigger things like very different needs, opinions and preferences?
How he would react if you would say 'I want to keep in touch with this one male friend because he's a good friend of mine because of X,Y & Z?' And how he expresses this desire for you to have no male friends - calmly and politely, in a form of suggestion or strongly and with some anger?

I had done that where I just wanted to keep in touch with certain people, and I kept decreasing the number until it was down to just one person, a guy who was kind of like a brother to me because he’d given me lots of advice about previous relationships and all, and I told my bf but he ended up being like “is he more important than me? What if I did the same thing? I don’t want you to cut them off because I made you, but I want you to put me first. I stopped talking to other girls because I don’t have any desire to talk to them since I have you”...
And I guess I was kind of glad he wasn’t talking to other girls anymore so I could relate...

Honestly, if i had to lay out there everything he’s done in the course of our relationship, it really is pretty terrible... no physical abuse, but a pretty severe case of manipulation to put it simply...
After so many discussions about it, I think we’ve both fixed some of our own problems and been able to improve our relationship... it’s been about 6 months since we’ve had any major problems and we’ve finally been communicating pretty well about everything, but I guess I’m concerned because I keep hearing that people don’t change and it just gets worse...

 

[Professor Snep]

I went out (to a fast food restaurant and a church gathering) with a guy I tutor

It could be assumed that by writing between brackets you already think that's a bit over the top.

[...]and further lost his trust, so at this point, I can’t blame him for being a bit controlling.

So what did you do that you are so unworthy of this fella's trust?

I’m pretty much just asking about whether or not a guy not wanting his girlfriend to talk to other guys is psychological abuse or something because a lot of people are acting like it is.

Doesn't matter. What do you think about it? Do you think it makes sense, or that it's complete bogus?

 

[Lady Jolanda]

He’s an ENTP so I’ve heard they’re manipulators... (^^;;

:grumbly::cursing:

This has very little to do with personality type.

Can people change? Yes. In fact, they do so all the time. But the desire for change comes from within. People don't change for you. They change for themselves, when they have a nice run in with reality that forces the realization upon them that they can't go on the way they've been going previously. Some people resist change as long as possible, because change is scary. Change is uncertainty. Change takes effort. Change takes time.

@Marshmellow0103 Let me be blunt here. You and your boyfriend both have issues with jealousy and lack of trust. The arrangement you negotiated between yourselves at the start of your relationship allows you to stay safe and small in your uncomfortable comfort zones.
Of course, that arrangement isn't sustainable, because one of you is eventually going to realize that this 'solution' isn't really working for either of you. (Perhaps by opening this topic?) The original problem still exists, doesn't it?
Also, this arrangement isn't really what you want, is it? Of course it isn't. Thankfully, you can always renegotiate. Yes, that is scary. Yes, that involves rocking the boat. And yes, that may even involve walking away.
Like Free suggested, couples counselling is a possibility, if you want to see this through together. Good luck

 

[souvenir]

If he actually is a manipulating psychological abuser, couples therapy and individual therapy that doesn't have a good abuser program will just make him worse. He'll learn how to manipulate you further and manipulate the therapist to get what he wants from you.

If he is psychologically abusing and manipulating you, you need to leave. You need to list the things he's done that are unacceptable. You need to draw new boundaries with him and if he crosses one again, you need to leave immediately. He will never respect your mental boundaries if you've laid it out for him and he deliberately crosses it again. Prepare how you will leave and I suggest changing your number, turning off location services and deactivating your social media for awhile. Don't let him know you've come here either. They tend to stalk and harass for a short while when you leave.

 

[Asa]

Jealousy and control are unhealthy behaviors in relationships. Forcing you to show him your phone, and cut off people you care about (male friends) are unhealthy behaviors. These behaviors could be part of something very serious.
I recommend speaking to a therapist (on your own - not with him) to get a professional point of view. and be honest with them about your concerns and his behaviors.
If you cannot do that, read articles written by knowledgable authors (who work in the field of psychology, not on blogs, or uhhh... forums.)

Jealousy is a sign of immaturity and insecurity, too. (It's also unhealthy for the person feeling it.) If you think it is a case of immaturity try building him up, and creating trust and a sense of security in the relationship.

Either way, you need to set boundaries. Don't break your own boundaries.

 

[infinite dreams]

He does get upset if I have guys on my social media accounts. Only one he didn’t seem to care about (aside from family) was a family friend (my moms friends son)... and he has also told me to show him my phone before...
I did tell him I’d show him my phone/messages any time though.

These behaviors invade your privacy and are over the top, regardless of the situation. These are parent/child dynamics, not the activities of adult partners.

No matter what either of you has done in the past (and it seems as if you've both made mistakes) - if a relationship gets to the point where one partner is insisting on inspecting the other's phone, it's already over. With no more trust between the two of you than that, why are you bothering to maintain the illusion at this point?

 

[Happy Phantom]

That's easier said than done for people like me.

Then you’re fucked.

 

[acd]

We make our lives so much more difficult by placing ourselves under others arbitrary demands. And by placing others under our own redic demands. The more we try to control the activities of another the less free we actually are. That's the ironic thing. We trap ourselves worrying about what other people will do. If someone can't handle the other talking to members of the opposite sex--that person is not ready to date.

Don't show your bf your phone. Develop some boundaries. You are allowed to have privacy and it does not imply guilt.

 

[Sloe Djinn]

I never lied to him or anything like that until after he lied to me

He is too controlling, but you both poisoned the well because you broke each other's trust. It sounds like whatever healthy motivations you may have started out with have been replaced by guilt and fear.

 

[periodictoblerone]

People can be jealous because of their inner insecurity. Because of low self-esteem and self-doubt, somewhere deep in their minds settles the idea that they can be replaced by another person. This fear pushes them to such manifestations of jealousy (limiting the partner from contacts with other people/etc). This is unhealthy behavior. Please be very careful and attentive, because at first it may just be people of the opposite sex, but then it can be friends, family and everyone else (this is a very common experience).
You're an adult. YOU choose people whom you communicate with.
Again, please be careful.

 

[Happy Phantom]

I think you know it's considered psychological abuse, but for some reason you're being coy. I think your boyfriend sounds rotten. You may secretly feel flattered that he tries to control you because it makes you feel loved and cared for. Well, at this early stage in the relationship, "love" is a misnomer. It's all about how one makes the other feel. "I love the way you make me feel, but I don't love you. If these pleasant feelings I have around you cease, then you are history."

Love is feeling deep empathy and concern for someone. It is not conditional; it is about the other person's well-being, even if they make you feel lousy. Real love is familial love, in my opinion. Maybe companionate.

He doesn't love you. He may in the future, but I wouldn't wait around that long because he disrespects you and controls you in a pretty abusive way. No, he won't change. If you are a dependent person, you may feel safe around him. He will eventually verbally and emotionally abuse you.

This isn't rocket science. It's predictable. That's my honest opinion. I don't have more to add. Good luck, and don't bury your head in the sand.

Qft.

 

[Lurk]

Qft.

Cut to it, right?

 

[Happy Phantom]

@Marshmellow0103 I guess you need to go through the experience to learn what you don’t want in your next relationship.

Cut to it, right?

I don’t lollygag when it comes to relationships anymore.

 

[Lady Jolanda]

Then you’re fucked.

No, he isn't, and that's exactly the problem.

@Marshmellow0103 I guess you need to go through the experience to learn what you don’t want in your next relationship.
I don’t lollygag when it comes to relationships anymore.

I only lollygag in relationships. You're such a slut HP.
(Kidding, obviously)

Emperor @Pin, no one is a finished product. Each and every one of us are forever a work in progress. There is always room for improvement. You know how you get there? Inspiration. Incentive. Setting examples. Not by fault finding. In fact, acceptance is required for love. Only once we feel accepted, we feel motivated to rise up.

 

[souvenir]

I had done that where I just wanted to keep in touch with certain people, and I kept decreasing the number until it was down to just one person, a guy who was kind of like a brother to me because he’d given me lots of advice about previous relationships and all, and I told my bf but he ended up being like “is he more important than me? What if I did the same thing? I don’t want you to cut them off because I made you, but I want you to put me first. I stopped talking to other girls because I don’t have any desire to talk to them since I have you”...
And I guess I was kind of glad he wasn’t talking to other girls anymore so I could relate...

Honestly, if i had to lay out there everything he’s done in the course of our relationship, it really is pretty terrible... no physical abuse, but a pretty severe case of manipulation to put it simply...
After so many discussions about it, I think we’ve both fixed some of our own problems and been able to improve our relationship... it’s been about 6 months since we’ve had any major problems and we’ve finally been communicating pretty well about everything, but I guess I’m concerned because I keep hearing that people don’t change and it just gets worse...

The bolded above? Have you ever said that to anyone? Have you ever in a relationship felt entitled to be put first in their life?

Here is a good quick book and will help you figure out what is normal and what is controlling https://www.amazon.com/dp/0425191656/?tag=infjs-20

 

[Lurk]

http://outofthefog.website/