Ultimate god question

showerbuddy

Three
MBTI
Isfj
Enneagram
i dont know
First of all i would like to believe thier was a god. Humans have a need for competition and just dont care about each other, as well as other problems and this can cause horrible events to take place on our planet. But to believe in god i think a few questions need to be answered.

Who made god or why does he just exist?

Why is god the real god and not zeus/posidon etc?

Why does it say in the bible that few people will go to heaven and most will go to hell? It doesnt make sense because god knows how our lives will turn out and what we will do before we actually do it. Why then, will he make most people go to hell? Isnt he a perfect and loving god?.

Humans only advantage is thier brain. We dont have claws etc and are fragile. I think if there is a god then he gave us a brain capable of figuring it all out. so that we choose to love him etc. If we cant figure it out then god is made up.

So, anyone know the answer? lol
 
Uh... belief in god does not REQUIRE answers to those questions. Nor does it require belief in any particular bible or religious text. And our lack of understanding does not preclude God from existing. It's just not a logical line of thought, to think "If God exists, then XYZ must be true. Or if God exists, then why ABC?" XYZ and ABC are just not directly relevant to the question of whether or not it exists.

You don't need to know the evolutionary past of a squirrel to understand that a squirrel exists. If you see a cardboard box, you don't need to know how it was made, or where it came from to know that a cardboard box exists.
 
but we desire a perfect world so we must seek to understand everything. If god doesnt allign with the bible then i may as well worship my cat. My cat could be a god that made everything? you need logic. Thats where the bible comes in. The bible is there to back up the theory of god because god wants everyone to belive in him and be saved.

But to believe that you need to answer the question of why most people are going to hell? Since where all the same, it seems very cruel.

Also, we see a squirrel so i know its there. I dont see god so i need something to prove he exists. Or i can just say my cat made everything? who said he didnt? hes magical.

And we are all the same. Asians are dark because thier exposed to more sunlight. Europe had better resoucres in thier countries so they developed faster etc. These questions need an answer.
 
Princess Anastasia is correct. Belief in God is simple. You either do or you don't. You can't prove God. Do you want to know the things of God then you don't ask an internet forum, you ask God Himself. You can also read about him in the Holy Bible. Try starting with the Book of Luke.
 
Agreed. Belief is belief. It does not require proof, just faith. You can't force it. I don't believe in God and I don't see it ever happening.It's just not for me.
 
but we desire a perfect world so we must seek to understand everything. If god doesnt allign with the bible then i may as well worship my cat. My cat could be a god that made everything? you need logic. Thats where the bible comes in. The bible is there to back up the theory of god because god wants everyone to belive in him and be saved.

But to believe that you need to answer the question of why most people are going to hell? Since where all the same, it seems very cruel.

Also, we see a squirrel so i know its there. I dont see god so i need something to prove he exists. Or i can just say my cat made everything? who said he didnt? hes magical.

And we are all the same. Asians are dark because thier exposed to more sunlight. Europe had better resoucres in thier countries so they developed faster etc. These questions need an answer.

none of the statements you made are justified... and the way you worded them caused their meanings to be ... outside of what general knowledge of these subjects allows for lol..

idk if you are aware of this but i'm going to be honest. "asians are dark because thier exposed to more sunlight"? "europe developed faster" ...what....

i'm sure everyone here understands where you are coming from and what you are getting at. there are a lot of threads about this where people have already discussed the questions you are posing now. take a nice long stroll through the archives and i think you'll be satisfied with what you read from there.

welcome to the forum...
 
according to christian faith, god created the world and all living species, god was its designer. he also created the possibility of darkness and evil itself (isaiah 45,7; amos 3,6; lamentations 3,38 - the symbolic figure of satan stands for this). so a god who has to save humanity and the world from his/her/its own creation, who has to save himself from himself, is a sheer non-sense in my opinion.

so i believe, christian faith is no about our salvation and how we obtain it - this is the version humans want to control others and to get some relief from their feelings of guilt, fear of death and anxiety caused by senselessness. christian faith is about: no salvation is needed. you are "god's children", no matter who you are, what you do and what happens (parabol of the lost son, the criminal hanging at the cross with jesus). knowing this, you can be truly humans and progressively accept this is the world god created. the fall of man is in our brains, because we'd like to be and to have more than we are and because, sometimes, we'd like to have another world, a better one. the source of our suffering is this possibility to have a potential which is not actual. god created it. it can be positively used for "progress" and creativity, it can be used for creating an ideal I, a Narcissus, which cannot be reached and therefore suffering begins - because man would do almost everything to reach this idealized image of himself (the biblical "idol"). and these possibilities, the one of a difference between thinking and factual reality and the one of the possibility of evil and the idea and the reality of evil in all its atrocities, had to "pass through god's mind", before he implemented it in his creation. it was his or her idea/reality "before" it was ours. (inserting a satan-figure between god and man does not change this, since, in a christian perspective, satan is a creature of god; so what i said applies to "satan" and the human creatures; i consider "satan" to be our dark side, created by god).

jesus, then, was god becoming human to show us how to be truly humans, by reconciling us with god's creation.
 
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If you just have faith then why does the christian have the 'right' god while someone else has the wrong one. They can have just as much faith in thier religion.

If ancient greeks were brought up to believe in greek mythology then why are they wrong (according to the bible) and MENT to burn in hell?

Faith is something god wants us to have but these questions will have to be answered or it means a perfect loving god created MOST people to go to hell. Which is contradicting.
 
showerbuddy,
i believe this is fundamentalistic christianity, asserting there is hell and most of the people will go there and that christianity is the only true religion. all branches of christianity which have assimilated the Enlightenment-period (it's idea), will barely rely on such a foundation (the official catholic church has not).
it is indeed contradictory as i wrote in my former post.

why hell etc.? before you can cure somebody, you'll have to want him to be sick. so you gotta make him ill - by threatening his (eternal) life. if he or she swallows that, then you'll have a tremendous power over him/her. you'll be able to tell him/her what to do, how to change his life etc. now you're truly powerful and you will be able to reign over your congregation ("to reign" then becomes "to serve").
 
If you just have faith then why does the christian have the 'right' god while someone else has the wrong one. They can have just as much faith in thier religion.

If ancient greeks were brought up to believe in greek mythology then why are they wrong (according to the bible) and MENT to burn in hell?

Faith is something god wants us to have but these questions will have to be answered or it means a perfect loving god created MOST people to go to hell. Which is contradicting.

Go ask God. If he's there he'll tell you which one he is if he wants you to know. If he doesn't answer then he isn't there or he doesn't want you to know. Asking a bunch of humans about the supernatural being when you can ask him yourself is pointless.
 
there are many paths to the God. . He is not a comodity that belongs to christianity, Islam, or any other faith system. . all roads of faith will take you to Him. .does He exsist? that is a question that only you can answer. .His existance is not dependant on our beliefs. . you may find him in the bible, but remember that the bible is the story of our relationship to him, not the other way around. it is story told by men of their encounters with God. . not a book written by God. . If you seek God, you will find Him. . for He is looking for you. . because whether you belive in Him or not, He believes is you. .
 
God created all that is, seen or unseen. In this regard our brains, wondrous as they are, are finite and incapable of knowing with any fullness. In fact, the mind (coupled with the ego) can get in the way because some knowing must be done with the heart, which has a different manner of intelligence.

God does not "know" how our lives will turn out as we might understand the term from our limited perspective. God's knowing does not diminish our freedom or free will. God (or the Divine Life, or the Great Spirit, or any number of other names) seeks to live in connection/relationship with all of His (and her...God is complete) creation. This is purely a relationship of love, but love at a magnitude that is frankly unimaginable. We are not in control of this...we relate to this in love and trust. Given the cosmic nature of God, could it be any other way really? The beauty is that He seeks us and loves us and cares deeply for us....and want to share His creative life with us and in us.

God, because of his love, seeks to restore our way of relating to Him in love. We are the ones who tend to present obstacles, and this is what makes the way narrow. Nevermind malevolent forces that have always preferred illusion. God, in His perfection/completeness/love, perfectly values us and our freedom to choose love. He reaches out to us, but all too often we are deaf and blind to His Presence (frankly, we are swimming in it). Since the nature of God is love, love (especially complete love) cannot disregard our basic natural gift (we are created with this) to choose.

Religions point to a variety of experiences and observations regarding God's working within and without. They articulate and protect what has been received through many millenia. They are, in some way, all pointing to the same basic (yet unimaginably profound) Reality. This accounts for the various refractions and nuances each belief system offers. Now, some systems offer more complete understandings than others, although all have merit. With Christianity, the idea that God Himself mediated/restored a means of connection to the Divine Life is significant.
 
quote"If we cant figure it out then god is made up." unquote
Not so. Google the seventh chapter of Luke and read it, if you please.
 
Belief in general doesn't require facts, just conviction. There are "unanswerable" questions, the God Question is one of them. From Shakespeare, "What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet". From Buddha, "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense".

Ponder overlong and time will have run out to do anything worth doing. Decide, believe, act, grow. Repeat :)
 
God exists because that is what God is.

Why do we exist?
 
Who made god or why does he just exist?
There is no distinction between God and existence. God is simple existence. However, there are different types of existence: anything that is contingent on another, or had a begining is some sort of limited existence (limited by space, size, time, etc). God is simple existence. There is no why as to his existence.

Why is god the real god and not zeus/posidon etc?
The name is not as important as the atributes: uncaused, eternal, infinite. Zeus and all the other pagan gods are understood in mythology as being limited in some respect - so their notion is incompatible with God.

Why does it say in the bible that few people will go to heaven and most will go to hell? It doesnt make sense because god knows how our lives will turn out and what we will do before we actually do it. Why then, will he make most people go to hell? Isnt he a perfect and loving god?
If God preferred that no being went to hell, he would not have created beings will intellect and free will. However, creation is improved by a whole order of perfection, simply by there being creatures which can know and choose whether or not to acknowledge/accept the goodness/greatness of God. It is startling, that given the freedom, most would prefer hell.

Humans only advantage is thier brain. We dont have claws etc and are fragile. I think if there is a god then he gave us a brain capable of figuring it all out. so that we choose to love him etc. If we cant figure it out then god is made up.
The first things we intellectually become aware of are the difference between existence/non-existence and the relationship between cause and effect. These two things are sufficient to come some sort of notion of God. However, since the attainment of heaven is not something we are capable of ourselves, it is necessary that God establish the means whereby we can, with sufficient knowledge of him, choose to seek heaven, or reject it (keeping a free will in the process).
 
I'm going to do the best I can to answer, knowing that my answers may be insufficient. My belief in G-d is largely based upon sensing the divine, and I can't give that to you with an argument.

Who made god or why does he just exist?

Why is god the real god and not zeus/posidon etc?
I'm going to answer the second question first, because we will only have confusion if we don't have a clear idea what we mean when we say G-d.

The natural world is filled by a spendor that touches the human heart. I've stood beneath a Giant Sequoia and thought "I can understand why someone would say this is a god." I'm going to make a necessary sweeping generalization and say that the awe of nature was the beginning of spirituality. Eventually we had enough time for art, and began making symbols of these natural elements, idols reprenting rain, or fertility, or war. In some places this overlapped with reverence for ancestors, and the possibility of cheating death.

But as civilization grew, and the written word allowed us to stand on the shoulders of those who had come before, humanity began seeing a bit further than creation. We began to question the congruence of serving the god of love today, but the god of war tomorrow. All polythesitic cultures, if they exist long enough, eventually begin to speculate there is something behind all these masks of gods, a unified divine, whether it is all Brahma's dream, or the G-d of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

A man asked the sage, " The Tao gives birth to 10,000 things, but what do the 10,000 things give birth to?" The sage replied, "I have a shirt I need to get washed." For those of you who have difficulty with deep metaphor, it means that the 10,000 things give birth to Tao, they return to the source.

There is a Zen story where the disciples asks the sage, "How do I achieve enlightenment? What is the secret." The sage says nothing, but simply holds up a single finger.

I've talked with phsycists who are really into chaos theory, and what strikes them as significant is that in the middle of all this chaos, there is pattern. The water of a rivers swirls this way and that, constantly changing, yet it always flows down. If there is design, does it not rather imply a designer?

Now there are differnt ideas about the Creator, or Tao, or the oneness underlying the universe. But I'm not going to waste time on the detail. If such an entity or essence exists, it is a marvel we can even perceive it, or hypothesize about it. We should not presume to think we can understand it. or him. or her.

THAT is the big step: everything after acknowledging the existence of G-d is really just so many words. The Tao which can be expressed is not the eternal Tao.

Now I can turn to your first question. Space-time is a construct of creation. If G-d is creator, outside of creation, then time and space mean nothing to him, nor do they bind him. We call this concept "Eternity." As He introduced Himself to Moshe, "I am that I am."

Why does it say in the bible that few people will go to heaven and most will go to hell? It doesnt make sense because god knows how our lives will turn out and what we will do before we actually do it. Why then, will he make most people go to hell? Isnt he a perfect and loving god?.

You are asking a question specific to christianity, so in all fairness, I will let the Christians reply. If you want the Jewish take on the afterlife, which is quite different, just ask. Otherwise I'll assume you don't want to be bothered. My PERSONAL take is simply that I leave the afterlife, IF there is one, to G-d; I just don't worry about it. My job is to live THIS day in THIS place in the way my creator calls me to, to be all that I can be and do all that I can do, with His help.

Humans only advantage is thier brain. We dont have claws etc and are fragile. I think if there is a god then he gave us a brain capable of figuring it all out. so that we choose to love him etc. If we cant figure it out then god is made up.
Ahhh but that IS the process. That as a species we are evolving the ability to sense and understand our own Maker. From the moment of the big bang, everything in this universe is set up to bring about the eventual evolution of sentient life. We are BECOMING. What we understand today is far more than we understood when we were pond scum. In the future, how much more will we understand than now?

Honestly, though, if you really really REALLY want to know if G-d exists, you need to put in the time and effort seeking him. Who knows what will click for you? Maybe you will find Him in the beauty of a Mass, in the depth of Buddhist meditation, the glory of a sunrise, the Torah of loving your neighbor as yourself, or even a child's laugh. He is everywhere, if you have the right eyes. When you find Him, it will be like Dorothy returning to Kansas, and realizing that what she went looking for had been there with her all along. Some journeys are longer and harder than others, so if you are serious about finding G-d, be ready to hurt and suffer on the quest. Seeking the Archenstone is a dangerous quest and quite frankly, you might not return. Some of us found G-d in the blackness of the pit, where we lay broken, when he came like a gentle lover and cried with us and nursed our wounds. There is a Zen saying "Don't mind the cracks, it's how the light gets in." Basically, (and don't let it get around that Jew quoted one of the gospels!) "Seek and ye shall find. Knock, and the door shall be opened to you."

May you be blessed in your journey.
 
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1. Who made god or why does he just exist?

2. Why is god the real god and not zeus/posidon etc?

3. Why does it say in the bible that few people will go to heaven and most will go to hell? It doesnt make sense because god knows how our lives will turn out and what we will do before we actually do it. Why then, will he make most people go to hell?

3a. Isnt he a perfect and loving god?.

1. I think God exists because... There is existence. Everything around us is God, and God is everything.
But what created God? I don't know.

I don't know anything that is as vast, as eternal, and as ever-changing yet constant as God. I don't grok God, though I try to.

2. I think God isn't something that's necessarily conscious of its own existence. ...It's something passive and underlying everything. We, as humans, felt a need to.. understand?, so we put God into our own terms. We defined God as something closer to ourselves- as having a personality, a form, and as interacting constantly in intelligent ways with its creation.

If you look at is as 'God is everything', then God is the abstract concept of Zeus or Poseidon as well- but not exclusively those things. You're God. I'm God. Or something like that. :p

It's kind of like...

Take an apple. You can slice it in thousands of different ways. Each time, the slice will look different than it would have if you'd sliced the apple in a different way.

Similarly, the appearance and nature of God is.. impossibly complex. God can be, and is, every potential in and out of existence.

3. Hell was created to help control the populace. 'If you don't murder people, then you won't roast in fire for eternity after you die, mk?' It's bribery, pure and simple. ;)

I'm not advocating murder by any means- but really, that's what the whole 'heaven' and 'hell' thing is about. People didn't trust each other enough to make moral decisions without first being threatened with torture (or promised eternal bliss), so they wrote it down in a book, probably after getting really, really high.

(I hope I'm not offending anyone. I don't mean to. Everything I write here is my own opinion, and not intended to cause harm.)


3a. Kind of? God is every one of us, the earth, our actions, and our beliefs. So.. yes. No? I think? As the Germans would say, 'Jein'. (Yes and no.)
 
I have no clue how a computer works, yet here I am with my lap top in an internet forum. I don't think you have to understand the molecular makeup of water atoms to enjoy a glass of iced water on a hot thirsty day. You are asking for the details, which ARE fun to pursue. But don't miss the forest for the trees. And buddy, one of life's greatest joys is learning enough that you realize how little you know, and that you can keep learning and learning and learning, and never exhaust what there is to learn.
 
I don't grok God, though I try to.
I love it!
As the Germans would say, 'Jein'. (Yes and no.)
Go not to the elves for advice, for they will say both yes and no. :D
 
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