Not Smart Enough for a Job | INFJ Forum

Not Smart Enough for a Job

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Sep 17, 2012
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At this point, I may just have to resign myself to working at dead-end, minimum-wage jobs, such as McDonalds.

I don't think I have what it takes to ever be successful or have a career in the fields I'm interested in (marketing and sales).

I'm a brand new college grad with an unimpressive job history - mainly merely working as an admin assistant, as those were the only jobs I was qualified for.

But even that was a long time ago. These past two years, I've worked as a personal assistant for a disabled lady UTT -= again, doing nothing impressive. Just menial tasks. This paid well, and was very compatible with my college schedule.

Also, I was on the Board of Directors for my school's bookstore -- but again, I didn't singlehandedly do much.

However, now that I've graduated, I want to pursue a real career. I've familiarized myself with several of the skills in high demand these days, such as SEO, Salesforce, and a bit of programming. While I have no formal experience with these sorts of things, I did the best thing I could do, and took it upon myself to teach myself.

I just had a disastrous interview yesterday, where the interviewer accused me of lying on my resume for listing these skills when I'm not a highly-experienced pro at all of them. He was probably right. My line of thought was that I was learned enough in them to help out with things that might peripherally involve them, to varying degrees.

I also couldn't explain a situation "proving" that I was organized specifically enough for his satisfaction. I always did my job, had no problems, and went above and beyond when I could, which I've since forgotten about.

But when I think back to the things that I do know how to do, and the things that I am highly experienced with -- I realize that they're not going to get me even the entry level jobs I want, and also that I've accomplished absolutely nothing. The companies with which I've worked HAVE achieved great things -- but I can't be credited for that. All I did was help out with the administrative duties.

I just feel like I've hit my dead end, and I'm only 21. I've accomplished absolutely nothing, there's nothing I'm proud of myself for, and I feel like I could achieve if I was given a chance. But all the opportunities are going to the preexisting achievers.

Am I aiming too high in life? Is it too late for me? Are some people just meant to be relegated permanently to low-pay, low-advancement positions?
 
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21 eh? Dont worry there will be plenty of time for you to learn that life is so much harder than you think it is, even now.
 
I think you thinking about this is a good thing.
And you probably are suited to more than the low-pay, low-advancement positions. But the fact that you are inquiring about this signals something that needs to be addressed, for sure. Maybe it means learning more about yourself and developing the skills + confidence that will allow you to excel. I can relate to what you've explained, and I'm hesitant to share ideas lest I project my experiences onto how I understand your dilemma. But, for myself, I know until I am solidly confident, and possess excellent communication, leadership, and project-specific skills, there is not much I can contribute. So, I'm working on developing those by working on myself and by seeking experience (volunteer, paid, short-term, long-term, etc.) that will allow me to put into practice these skills so that when a potential employer inquires about them, I can spout off examples of how I achieved certain things and how it led to success.

It's a fairly straightforward idea. If you desire to work in a certain field, and you possess the sufficient motivation, work ethic, and intelligence, then make sure you also possess the relevant skill set and you will likely encounter success in gaining positions. If you're having trouble gaining the kind of work you think you ought to be gaining, then perhaps spend some time gaining feedback if you can and analyzing how well you can do what you're doing or if you've been getting by. Figure out what you can do and perhaps that is what to build from. It'd be nice to jump into a difficult position that requires numerous skills and to be able to handle it. If that's not the case now, it doesn't mean you won't ever be equipped to handle that level of responsibility, but it may be the case that you need to work up to it and set about developing certain skills that will allow you to progress from where you are now to where you want to be. Does that apply?
 
I think you thinking about this is a good thing.
And you probably are suited to more than the low-pay, low-advancement positions. But the fact that you are inquiring about this signals something that needs to be addressed, for sure. Maybe it means learning more about yourself and developing the skills + confidence that will allow you to excel. I can relate to what you've explained, and I'm hesitant to share ideas lest I project my experiences onto how I understand your dilemma. But, for myself, I know until I am solidly confident, and possess excellent communication, leadership, and project-specific skills, there is not much I can contribute. So, I'm working on developing those by working on myself and by seeking experience (volunteer, paid, short-term, long-term, etc.) that will allow me to put into practice these skills so that when a potential employer inquires about them, I can spout off examples of how I achieved certain things and how it led to success.

It's a fairly straightforward idea. If you desire to work in a certain field, and you possess the sufficient motivation, work ethic, and intelligence, then make sure you also possess the relevant skill set and you will likely encounter success in gaining positions. If you're having trouble gaining the kind of work you think you ought to be gaining, then perhaps spend some time gaining feedback if you can and analyzing how well you can do what you're doing or if you've been getting by. Figure out what you can do and perhaps that is what to build from. It'd be nice to jump into a difficult position that requires numerous skills and to be able to handle it. If that's not the case now, it doesn't mean you won't ever be equipped to handle that level of responsibility, but it may be the case that you need to work up to it and set about developing certain skills that will allow you to progress from where you are now to where you want to be. Does that apply?

It seems, though, that to get any position from which I can work up from, I need to have years of professional experience - or at least have amazing stories to tell, verified by numerous references.

I'm screwed. lol
 
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The best way to get a job is to be charming. Learn to schmooze the interviewer and start working down your friend list and see who knows who and who can set you up with something. most jobs are gotten through someone else, not by cold calling randomly. Chances are there was no way you were going to get that job anyway as it was being saved for someones nephew or cousin.
 
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It seems, though, that to get any position from which I can work up from, I need to have years of professional experience - or at least have amazing stories to tell, verified by numerous references.

I'm screwed. lol

I may be wrong. Having said that, is it possible you are setting your sights too high?
I definitely encourage you to apply for what you desire, and to not attend to the "be realistic" train of thought, but if you're not getting the positions you'd like I would set my sights lower and see what happens. It probably sounds like shitty advice, sorry.

As for you being screwed -- naw. It just sounds like you need more experience. You're screwed if your only option is to get those jobs now. If you're willing to take the time to develop a resume, reference base, and skill-set, then I don't see how you're screwed unless for some reason you will never be able to achieve what you want to achieve.
 
I may be wrong. Having said that, is it possible you are setting your sights too high?
I definitely encourage you to apply for what you desire, and to not attend to the "be realistic" train of thought, but if you're not getting the positions you'd like I would set my sights lower and see what happens. It probably sounds like shitty advice, sorry.

As for you being screwed -- naw. It just sounds like you need more experience. You're screwed if your only option is to get those jobs now. If you're willing to take the time to develop a resume, reference base, and skill-set, then I don't see how you're screwed unless for some reason you will never be able to achieve what you want to achieve.

I thought I was setting my sights as low as possible. When I apply to positions via Craigslist, I only do so if I meet every single required qualification. I'm applying for the lowest-level entry-level jobs in the Marketing and Sales sections.

I've recently started job-hunting here and there for two weeks so far, and this was my first interview. The mere fact that I couldn't scramble to think of an extraordinary scenario where I proved my superhuman organizational abilities is a red flag that I'm a loser.

Perhaps I will have to aim lower, and apply to dishwashing jobs at dive bars or something, where my mere ability to speak English is a plus. But there's no growth potential in that. I may as well just stick with the disabled lady.
 
I thought I was setting my sights as low as possible. When I apply to positions via Craigslist, I only do so if I meet every single required qualification. I'm applying for the lowest-level entry-level jobs in the Marketing and Sales sections.

I've recently started job-hunting here and there for two weeks so far, and this was my first interview. The mere fact that I couldn't scramble to think of an extraordinary scenario where I proved my superhuman organizational abilities is a red flag that I'm a loser.

Perhaps I will have to aim lower, and apply to dishwashing jobs at dive bars or something, where my mere ability to speak English is a plus. But there's no growth potential in that. I may as well just stick with the disabled lady.

Okay, I feel I need to apologize. I didn't realize you were already applying for entry-level positions.

But if I may be honest I think you're being a little dramatic. And if you're feeling frustrated or worried about your job search experience and your job prospects, I completely understand. But, you're not a loser. It sounds like you're someone who couldn't answer a question because you lacked the necessary experience which would have been your answer. So go out there and get the experience. Get the communication experience, the customer service experience, the teamwork experience, the management or production experience, the selling experience, and so on. If you can't get it through employment, then volunteer. If your skill-set becomes impressive enough, they won't not hire you.

Is it also possible you may need to practice your interview skills, and prepare more for the interview by having a couple of scenarios prepared in your mind? How many jobs have you applied for? How many interviews do you have lined up? It's not unusual to not get the first job you interview for. Don't let it get you down.
 
You are interested in sales and have finished college, have you given thought to becoming an insurance agent or working for an insurance agent? I did this for nearly 8 years and made a decent salary as a licensed salesman and CSR for an agent. The nice part of working in this industry is developing relationships with your clients ... the INFJ in you gives you a natural ability to assess their needs. It is VERY easy to obtain a job in insurance if you have obtained your licenses: property/casualty, life/health. Having a securities license helps b/c most insurance companies offer mutual funds. Depending on the company, you might have the option to telecommute.

I have not worked for 10 years and had an insurance company call me recently to offer employment as an agent. I also received an offer to work for a local agent recently while having lunch with friends (he joined us for lunch.) He told me he lost one of his sales people and had a desk ready. lol

I know it's an industry I can go back to at any time, and that security is nice. If you don't know where to begin in looking for employment in this area, you basically start by walking your resume into an agent's office. If he is not hiring, he might direct you to someone who is. Often times agents will forward your resume to their field office, which would then visible to all agents.
 
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If this is really what you want to do:

- Get the formal training ... See if you can take condensed courses. You probably don't feel smart yet for a good reason. But it's never too late to become smart and build confidence in your abilities.
- Make connections and use the network you have already to get you in somewhere, even interning somewhere. Get friends in the industry to give you advice on how you should approach things like your resume etc; run things over with them first.
- Look pretty (unfortunately probably more important than you think in what it sounds like you're wanting to do)
- Learn to be a BSing master.
 
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I don't think I have what it takes to ever be successful or have a career in the fields I'm interested in (marketing and sales).
Nonsense. You are a recent college grad in a time of high unemployment, and from the sounds of it you just got through with an interview with an asshole.

Your difficulty finding a job has
NOTHING
to do with "having what it takes" or your potential as a person.

I tend to agree with Sriracha that looking into self-employment opportunities similar to insurance may be good for you. Possibly even real estate? You will be self-employed, and it takes a while to get going, like a year or so even.... but the flexibility and potential for higher income is most definitely there. There is a good deal of uncertainty in self-employment, however, so you have to know how to deal with uncertainty and not knowing when or how much your next paycheck will be.

But first things first: get over this ridiculous idea that you are a "loser". You sound like a very awesome, smart and valuable person to me.

(For what it is worth, I spent pretty much my entire 20s thinking similar things about myself and worked crap jobs, and also graduated in the middle of a recession. life has gotten better for me and I genuinely hope and think it will for you too.)

Am I aiming too high in life??
NO
Is it too late for me??
NO
Are some people just meant to be relegated permanently to low-pay, low-advancement positions?
Only if they buy into what some asshole interviewer said to them.
Or if they believe what very pessimistic people say about life being so terrible and miserable.
Or maybe if they have severe illnesses or injuries or something, I don't know.
But you're not.
 
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Job interviews can be extremely humiliating. I haven't had one in quite some time now and I'm seriously dreading ever having to go through one again… sounds like you just went through a particularly brutal one-- some of these people are confirmed sadists and they're probably bored… they see someone who has zero experience and instead of being constructive and supportive they decide to shit all over you because they can.

But yes, the art of BS is extremely important… and because you're dealing with people who are being fed BS by pretty much every applicant they come across, you will need to make it sound plausible, which means taking something that is true about you and making it into a huge deal-- sometimes things that don't seem like a big deal to you actually can be a big deal to your employers.

It's definitely not time to give up and call yourself a failure… sometimes you need to swallow your pride and admit that you weren't as prepared as you could have been, but next time you'll do better. The interview is an experience that you can learn from and next time make sure you have an answer when they ask you that question.

In the meantime, you could always do volunteer work while you look for other jobs. You wouldn't even have to put a lot of time and effort into it-- just the fact that you're currently volunteering somewhere instead of not doing anything (except looking for a job, which is hard too) can be enough to make you stand out with some employers. Find something you're interested in, and then you might actually end up enjoying yourself, and meet someone who can steer you in a direction that you might not have considered.

If you get a chance to do something with more responsibilities, then take it… especially if it's leadership. Even if you fail, you can at least sound credible when you describe it to someone-- making a failure sound like a success is easier than trying to bullshit someone about an experience you've never actually had… when you're asked about it, you can remember the feeling and that will shine through in your response.

I can still remember the first time I was put in charge of something… it was a tiny, tiny group and I wouldn't say that I was extremely good at the people aspect of it, but it's amazing how other people treat you just because you have that title of 'manager'… you do learn a lot about yourself and what kind of leadership style you have.

It really is hard to be just starting out in the job market and I'm not going to tell you that it's going to be easy… but I think part of the problem now (besides experience) is that you're too isolated… you need to find a good social environment so that you can meet the right people and start heading in the right direction-- this isn't always the easiest thing either, but with enough trial and error you should be able to find something.

Good luck!
 
It is impossible to convince someone to trust you with a task if you don't believe you are capable. You've been through school,so unless you cheated your way through and didn't learn a thing, you already possess relevant knowledge and skills. Did you do any internships? I remember feeling like I wasn't going to be capable in my field, but then I took some internships and experiential learning courses where you are doing real professional work--and I learned how to do the job. It boosted my confidence immensely because I saw I could produce results.

Its normal to get down on yourself during a job search, but don't stay there and self defeat. You have to fight through it. Seek resume and interview advice from your schools career department, talk to your professors. Go intern or volunteer someplace and start a network. Do something--stop thinking and do something.

I also had a really bad professional interview once. This lady literally laughed at me and said, "you are so young" when I answered one of her questions before throwing my resume and portfolio down on the table at me. It happens. People have shitty interviews but you just have to press on. I finally found a job in my field this week after 6 mos of searching and I thought I bombed that interview, too--but I didn't give up and sent her a thank you letter reiterating my interest.

Stop the negative self talk and fix your perspective.
 
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Also, I don't think you should learn to BS in an interview.
You have to figure out what you are great at and what you are passionate about and then have a real conversation about it. Nobody wants to work with a phoney, and it's selling yourself short because I'm sure you have talent.
Work on building yourself up not faking it. The right employer will appreciate your sincerity and accomplishments someday.
 
I just had a disastrous interview yesterday, where the interviewer accused me of lying on my resume for listing these skills when I'm not a highly-experienced pro at all of them. He was probably right. My line of thought was that I was learned enough in them to help out with things that might peripherally involve them, to varying degrees.

If you were applying for a sales job, my reaction would have been, "What the f** do you expect me to be for a job that pays me commissions for lying and telling half-truths?!".
 
Like most everyone starting out, you are in that Catch 22 situation.
Employers want real world experience, but you can't get that experience without first getting a position in your field.
I know from my own experience that at age 21 it is hard to have a perspective that thinks long term. You're piling on yourself that it's all over for you and that you're a failure. When the reality is you aren't a failure, and it isn't over, because you haven't even started.
I remember having the same thoughts you are having when I was 25. I look back now and see just how wrong that was.
Also don't beat yourself up over that interview that went bad. Doesn't sound like someone you would want to work for anyway. At least in my opinion.
Just because you don't have formal training in an area, but do have workable knowledge doesn't make what you know worthless just because you don't have a piece of paper to go with it.
It isn't as if you are applying to be a surgeon, and are implying on your resume that since you know how to apply a band-aid, that makes you qualified to remove an appendix.
Just keep plugging away at it. Sooner or later you will find an employer in your chosen field that will see you for who you are and will give you an opportunity.
I wish you the best!
 
Just get a job at Best Buy for a few years, keep throwing out those resumes in the meantime and try to climb the corporate ladder. Getting involved in management is something even if it is just shitty retail. Just think of it as a stepping stone. ACD was right about getting involved with your college's career services.

I think some people get trapped in having menial jobs and some employers will see that you have done nothing requiring smarts and will only hire you for those jobs. Dont get into that trap.

If all else fails I heard the Marines are hiring.
 
Okay, I feel I need to apologize. I didn't realize you were already applying for entry-level positions. ...

I returned to this this morning, and again I want to apologize to you. In no way should I have implied that you ought to only aim for the lowest of the low positions. I think you need to shoot high and aim for what you desire, but also be honest with yourself about whether or not you can perform the duties expected (which it sounds like you are being). A healthy dose of realism sees both the actual and the potential.
 
At this point, I may just have to resign myself to working at dead-end, minimum-wage jobs, such as McDonalds.

I don't think I have what it takes to ever be successful or have a career in the fields I'm interested in (marketing and sales).

Actually McDonald's isn't really so bad. I started out there in high school and learned many real world job skills that have helped me to this day. I was really introverted, so they stuck me on the grill( I was 16) and sandwiches. I was really fast at it. Shortly after as I came out of my shell a little more I got to do register. This helped me get a job at Wendy's as I went to college. There I proved to be dependable and a hard worker and became much more outgoing and they had me doing shift manager duties. In all honesty it was these jobs that helped me learn how to deal with a variety of people, work as a team, handle customer demands under pressure, and learn about managing inventory; all skills that I use at my current job in a hospital as a medical technologist. Now I've been taking on managerial duties there too. I wouldn't say I'm aiming all that high, but if you have the skills and the drive people will notice you and you can move up, albeit slowly, but up none-the-less.
 
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Just get a job at Best Buy for a few years, keep throwing out those resumes in the meantime and try to climb the corporate ladder.

Absolutely.
While rare, there are numerous stories out there of people taking an entry level job and rising to the top.
Since Best Buy has been mentioned, their former CEO Brian Dunn did just that.

From a news article.

"Brian Dunn had no formal education in retail when he took a job as a sales associate with the company in 1985. From there he slowly worked his way up the chain of command as a manager, district manager then regional manager in 1996. Over the course of the next decade he continued his climb through the ranks and took over as CEO in June 2009."