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Discussion in 'Psychology and MBTI' started by Asa, Jun 28, 2019.

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  1. Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    This stems from a tangent in the "Having Children After 35" thread.

    This thread is about life goals, why we shouldn't put them off, how we can work on making big and small goals happen, and how to "live in the present".

    As a forward-thinking, "stuck in my head" INFJ I know I have trouble living in the present, but I'm also good at organizing my life to put goals within reach. What about you? What are your tricks to planning, living in the moment and achieving goals? What are your weaknesses in this realm?
     
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  2. OP
    Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    Quotes from that thread:


     
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  3. Hostarius

    Hostarius Scooby Doo Villain of Fate

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    Thanks for making this thread, @Asa. :)

    Like, you, that other thread got me wondering too, because this is a major problem for me.

    I avoided responding again to that thread because I felt like I would sound entitled or whiny if I expressed how I truly felt, which is that there's nothing in my life which I enjoy. It's not a 'bad' life, but it's so future-oriented that the present is just squandered.
     
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  4. Pin

    Pin "Magnificent Bastard" / Ren's Counterpart

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    I saw the words "life" and "plan" and had to join the conversation.
     
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  5. sassafras

    sassafras salty soothsayer
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    My weaknesses are when I spiral into overthinking mode and I can spend hours ruminating over something that hasn't happened, has happened but I wish it went differently, or when I'm lost in my own thoughts. I make a lot of a plans for the future, but the problem is taking action because I've never been sure if its something that I actually wanted. I'm so concerned with getting it right that I sometimes miss the bus. In fact, just the amount of time I spend thinking about something is abhorrent. lol

    My strengths are when I get sick of myself and just take massive action. Most of the things I have achieved originated with me waking up one day and saying to myself: fuck this. This is my decision. I'm not looking back. I just go... I don't have a plan (I get hung up on plans), I just get up and start doing random shit moving in some general direction and eventually the momentum carries me somewhere where I wake up and I realize, hey, I'm a completely different person.

    The trouble is, I don't know how to activate that super-decision mode other than getting realllly frustrated with myself. lol

    EDIT: That being said, I have gotten better at enjoying my present moment more. I try to focus on what's fun or special or what I'm learning if I'm struggling with something. I am happier for it.
     
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    #5 sassafras, Jun 28, 2019
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  6. Hostarius

    Hostarius Scooby Doo Villain of Fate

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    That's a good one, actually.

    The 'fuck it' reflex is ace because it simultaneously banishes anxiety. When you truly mean 'fuck it', you don't really care about the consequences of it all imploding; you don't care if you really do 'deserve it' or not.

    On that last note... some good things just seem so far out of our frame of reference that we can trick ourselves into thinking that it's 'not for the likes of me' or that it's 'too good'.

    The 'fuck it' reflex helps here, too, except it's 'fuck it, why not?'. After my masters, this led me to apply for all sorts of crazy jobs and I don't regret it.

    One day I got in from work at a factory and just thought to myself 'I am never doing another unskilled job again', and started to apply for everything I was actually qualified for. Literally stuff like police officer, spy (MI5/6), civil servant, teacher, politician's aide, think tanks &c. I just thought 'Fuck it, I'll be a spy. Why not?'

    Incidentally this is my attitude when asking women out. You have to not give a fuck about the risks and reasons 'why not'.
     
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  7. sassafras

    sassafras salty soothsayer
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    The 'fuck it' reflex is a great way to describe it. lol

    The thing is, when you're in your head, the possibilities are endless. It's a blank screen that you can write on and backspace until the end of eternity and never get anywhere. But when you engage with your environment and the outside world, there are consequences to which you must immediately respond. It locks you into a certain trajectory that may have some wiggle room, in terms of the decisions you can make, but not so much wiggle room that you're perpetually indecisive. The only way to move forward is decision--> action --> consequence --> decision ---> action---> consequence--> decision... which naturally breaks a lot of the stuck thought loops that trip most people up.
     
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  8. Wyote

    Wyote Con Risa Absoluta
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    My main problem is just starting shit. Yesterday I made a comment about how literally everything is so fucking easy, but I just never start.
    Once I do though, hah! Look the fuck out.
     
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  9. Hostarius

    Hostarius Scooby Doo Villain of Fate

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    That's very true.

    There's a certain comfort in experiencing the 'infinite potential of possibility' and shunning the reification of reality, but ultimately that former state of openness is a prison.

    You're right I think. It often only takes that first step, and the rest follows from the inertia of that original decision, so perhaps some key advice could revolve around how to place ourselves in such circumstances (if they're what we truly want) without overthinking.

    Sometimes I just break down the process into the simplest immediate steps. Rather than 'do I really want to go to this party and risk being shit?', instead 'walking to the train is easy'... 'sitting on the train is easy'... 'walking into the room is easy'. Focusing on the discrete actions of a much larger task allows you to generate such 'decision inertia' without experiencing the paralysis by analysis of constantly thinking through consequences and end-states.
     
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  10. sassafras

    sassafras salty soothsayer
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    Fuck yes. Though I'm convinced that the hard part isn't starting; it's stopping the wave of momentum you're currently riding. Task switching is a pain when you're too comfortable or engrossed in what you're already doing.
     
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    Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

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    That's not whiny. I think you have perspective about your predicament. I used to feel this way, too, which is why we moved. Living in a place that makes us happy by default helps.


    Your so ambitious and focused that you'll add a great deal to this thread.


    Ahhh, that sounds like a struggle. I'm glad you have a "get things done mode". Your way of living in the moment is invaluable.
     
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  12. Wyote

    Wyote Con Risa Absoluta
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    I like this term
     
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  13. sassafras

    sassafras salty soothsayer
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    Borrowing from @Skarekrow's blog today. This, exactly.

    This quote appeals to me for obvious reasons. lol. Don't just think about the pizza, make the pizza.
     
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  14. sassafras

    sassafras salty soothsayer
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    Maybe the key is building up anticipation for the task in front of you. Like mm.... that pizza is gonna taste so good once I make it! I'll sit down and savor each bite and let the flavors just ooze in my mouth...

    Most of us tend to build up negative anticipation ie. anxiety. It's too hard, what if I screw up? What if I don't like what I'm doing? I want to be able to like what I'm doing. I'm liking what I'm doing now. @Hostarius touched up on it when he described his step-by-step process and suggested thinking of each step as 'easy.' That definitely feels softer than 'ughh, I don't want to do this.' That's a pretty good strategy, I think! I'll be incorporating that one.
     
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  15. Daustus

    Daustus Community Member

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    Due Dates and communicating them to people. Only way I get anything done. No known due date, no pressure to get anything done. The internet is a major source of problems for me. I information seek like a heroin addict. I excel at distracting myself.
     
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  16. Skarekrow

    Skarekrow ~~DEVIL~~

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    That sucks.
    I mean that.
    :(

    That is a very uncomfortable emotional/mental state.
    A really good way to deactivate that portion of the brain is singing along to your favorite music.
    Especially when you don’t feel like it.
    :<3white:

    Anything that will actively engage your mind in something that won’t allow it to wander.
    It’s that wandering state of mind that becomes rumination in those with DMN dysregulation.
    Reading is hard when anxious, but it works also....I find a mindful walk is irreplaceable when I cannot remain still.
    Meditation is good and it’s great that you went for it...but imho mindfulness is not the best for anxiety.
    In my own case...I first would go to my “happy place” - which was a big rock overhanging the Tule river where I caught my first and only fish at age 8 or so.
    I put myself back there....I feel the cold granite rock under me....the sun shining on my back...the simultaneous warmth and coolness....the sound of the river and the wind in the trees, the birds...the smell of campfires burning off in the distance, etc.
    I spend a really long time with visualization exercises to calm that area of my brain.
    THEN...I can work on being mindful - in that separate environment at first as you have much more control over it than doing something like a “body scan” mindfulness meditation that can exacerbate your uncomfortable physical sensations.
    Or I will put myself at the bottom of a deep lake.
    Of course I can breathe....and I slowly begin to add more and more detail until I feel more calm back here in the conscious world.
    I hope you feel better!
    Here is an article that helps to explain why/how this occurs - https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...-mechanics-rumination-and-repetitive-thinking

    Let me know if there is anything I can do or help you with and you got it!
    :hug:
     
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    #16 Skarekrow, Jun 28, 2019
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  17. Hostarius

    Hostarius Scooby Doo Villain of Fate

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    This term likes you.

    Positive anticipation would work, but sometimes once we start 'anticipating' at all, the direction it takes is uncontrollable. My process was to try to remove all anticipation entirely.

    I had to deliver a presentation recently, and I wasn't nervous until the very moment I had to get up and deliver it. I tried to make that day about other things. Walking to the venue, watching the other presenters, asking pertinent questions and being supportive. In doing that stuff, though, I was already in the room - I wasn't going to escape it, because I was already there. There were background nerves, definitely, but I was doing other stuff anyway.

    Then when it was my turn it was like 'OK, I guess it's me then. FUCK IT.' I got hit by a wave of nerves but powered on and focused in on explaining the content I was actually delivering - falling back on my expertise. I thought I did terribly, but I knew I was making sense and people said after that I came across as very confident, engaging and competent (and they wouldn't bs). Part of me knew that, but there's another part that is just totally self-doubting who's blind to reality. I didn't script it for this very reason - so I would have to engage with the ideas consciously in order to explain them. The Q&A afterwards was easy for the same reason - the technical demands of having to actually explain things relegates the other concerns (worrying about being shit).

    I saw some people who wrote scripts delivering very nervously because they were just trying to get through it - they were reading, but you could tell that their mind was engaged in a completely different task - worrying. Funnily enough these same people were fine during the actual questions because they were engaged.

    So here there's something else which works for me, and that's to make sure that my fucking brain is occupied in actually doing the 'onerous' task I've got to do.
     
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  18. Skarekrow

    Skarekrow ~~DEVIL~~

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    Totally.
    That’s a real technique man.
    It’s called practicing outcome indifference and it works really well when you can really start to feel it.
    Cheers!
    :<3white:
     
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  19. Hostarius

    Hostarius Scooby Doo Villain of Fate

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    Oh cool! Great that it has a name.

    Skare... you really do know a fuckton, my friend, lol.
     
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  20. Skarekrow

    Skarekrow ~~DEVIL~~

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    Thanks man!!!
    Ditto!
    You’re a smart cookie Hos.

     
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    #20 Skarekrow, Jun 28, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2019
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