Intelligence associated with Negativity?

[John K]

It’s a hard thing to do though - put ourselves in the shoes of another type. I think it’s particularly hard for other types to put themselves into an Ni perspective because Ni isn’t an easy thing to grasp conceptually. There are some more inspired closure type people out there who appreciate the creativity of Ni though and find ways of channeling its value in so that it harmonises with their own preferences.

 

[Wyote]

Ah, I getcha. I'm not entirely sure if there is a correlation in that sense.
I seem to recall it being pretty split between conventionality and nonconformity. Can't remember for certain atm though.

Interesting
https://www.bmj.com/rapid-response/...behind-positive-relationship-between-iq-and-v

 

[David Nelson]

It’s a hard thing to do though - put ourselves in the shoes of another type. I think it’s particularly hard for other types to put themselves into an Ni perspective because Ni isn’t an easy thing to grasp conceptually. There are some more inspired closure type people out there who appreciate the creativity of Ni though and find ways of channeling its value in so that it harmonises with their own preferences.

Yes this reminds me of a Scott Morgan video where he visually explains how INFJs have a large area of cognition which is not readily? understandable by most other types, yet the whole area of cognition of all types is to INFJs.

But I think there is a lot of potential for other type understanding because many areas of cognition are not limited to type because they are a preference. Personality is largely what we prefer to think about and how. Much of what is outside of this is still possible to understand, it just takes more effort and energy to understand it. But with great insight and clarity I believe it could be possible to make much of this quite clear to people with enough interest and intelligence to benefit from it. Probably all it takes is someone famous to plug this topic and write/recommend a bestselling book (and the book would have to be damn good).

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

This is actually incorrect. Intelligent people are far more likely to go with the flow of things.

Going with the flow is largely to blame for society's problems where despite there being countless individuals who could resolve at least help not only choose to do nothing at all but worse still actively profit off said problems such as America's fentanyl epidemic just as an example. Just think that those 130-200 point IQs going to waste when this civilization could have been visiting the stars decades ago instead are wasted on meaningless crap be it ideologies that are of no benefit never mind the monopolies that are destroying the planet. Hell if I had an 200 point IQ I would have actually accomplished something unlike the vast majority of the ideologues that spent their lives fluffing their egos on twitter. Got to hand it to them though as they fucked up the public education system for indoctrination thus pulling up the ladder so to speak so the majority under the age of 40 doesn't stand much of a chance in the globalized economy aside from the white collar privilege some got to enjoy.

 

[Wyote]

Going with the flow is largely to blame for society's problems

Yeah I'm gonna have to disagree with ya there. But I know your level of cynicism is off the charts so refuting it in any way is a waste of time.
Plus we are all doomed anyway, I gotta go enjoy what's left of this horrible shit planet.

 

[Enso]

This conversation is the exemplar of the OP.

 

[Wyote]

This conversation is the exemplar of the OP.

In what way specifically?

 

[philostam]

Haha sorry guys, but this topic sounds a bit like a self-pity fest. Us INFJs are so insightful but no one can see it. Guess what, INxPs probably feel the same, but you get over with.

You either learn how to communicate/sell ideas better or you just accept that not everything can be shared with others, and you connect with them over more "common" things. Hopefully you find 1 or 2 people of similar ilk than understand you and with whom you connect better, and that's enough. Or you go to an INFJ forum or you speak trough your work/action/whatever.

I guess INFJs really need to be understood and even respected for their insights.

 

[philostam]

Also I came to a realisation that Ni can only get you so far. Yeah it has unique qualities in terms of allowing an Ni user to grasp situations and judge them in interesting way. I like how "individualistic" and personal it is at it's best.

But without knowledge and experience is only gonna get you so far. It's like a chess player that thinks he can beat others just playing his individual game. Guess what, if you really wanna be a grandmaster, you'll need to study a lot of games and moves, or you'll be destroyed. Because however great your Ni, it's not greater than centuries of chess ideas that came before you.

So yeah, anyway, Ni is great and all, but without excellent communication and/or vast knowledge it's impact is gonna be limited. Thinking that just because you're an INFJ it automatically makes you great and that the world owes you something is a bit... (fill in the word).

 

[philostam]

Also guess what, John D Rockafeller was a "boring" ISTJ, yet his contribution to the world was immense and was a true innovator in his own way. And there are countless more STJ examples like that.

At the end of the day, no one cares about your personality type. 99% of the people don't even know what an INFJ is. You gotta convince the world you are great, just like everyone else.

And 100% of great historical INFJs didn't know they were INFJs either. They just went about their business and tried to impact the world trough their ideas/action. And they didn't blame xSTJs for their problems lol.

 

[Wyote]

fill in the word

Absurd

 

[Reason]

I would think that negativity depends more on a person's circumstances, mental health and level of neuroticism than intelligence. Seems to me more like rather than an unshakeable association with negativity brilliance actually comes with a touch of madness.

 

[Wyote]

You gotta convince the world you are great

That's too much pressure, I just wanna get out of bed tomorrow

 

[Enso]

Taco Bell is the food of wisdom

-Sun Tzu

 

[Wyote]

Taco Bell is the food of wisdom

-Sun Tzu

I just had one of those Deluxe Cravings Box's the other day.
True story.

 

[John K]

I would think that negativity depends more on a person's circumstances, mental health and level of neuroticism than intelligence. Seems to me more like rather than an unshakeable association with negativity brilliance actually comes with a touch of madness.

This is where I’m at on the whole. I think a negative disposition is quite independent of how intelligent someone is.

It’s quite possible though that someone who uses a dialectical approach to exploring ideas could be mistaken for being a negative person. Most people seem to grab hold of the ideas they want in the same way they support a football team or a political party - by heart rather than head. That tends to block a more neutral approach to a possible wider reality, and they reject any analysis of potential flaws as an attack.

An interesting example that illustrates what I mean is the way company reports are presented these days to investors - at least in the UK. They are obliged by law to list out all the threats to their business so that investors understand the risks. It’s a bit weird after reading all the usual rosy stuff about how great the company is, then you come across this apparently negative stuff in the following pages. It gives a powerful dialectic if understood correctly.

 

[philostam]

This is where I’m at on the whole. I think a negative disposition is quite independent of how intelligent someone is.

It’s quite possible though that someone who uses a dialectical approach to exploring ideas could be mistaken for being a negative person. Most people seem to grab hold of the ideas they want in the same way they support a football team or a political party - by heart rather than head. That tends to block a more neutral approach to a possible wider reality, and they reject any analysis of potential flaws as an attack.

An interesting example that illustrates what I mean is the way company reports are presented these days to investors - at least in the UK. They are obliged by law to list out all the threats to their business so that investors understand the risks. It’s a bit weird after reading all the usual rosy stuff about how great the company is, then you come across this apparently negative stuff in the following pages. It gives a powerful dialectic if understood correctly.

 

[John K]

View attachment 87918

 

[Elder]

That's too much pressure, I just wanna get out of bed tomorrow

Yes! I always do, but every time it's a win.

 

[Wyote]

Yes! I always do, but every time it's a win.

Update: looks like I win again