How do people (mis)type you?

[jkxx]

With apologies to everyone since I'm running off 3 hours of sleep today - anyway mission accomplished, that was easier than expected.

And I said “Well, maybe it would be possible to see each individual life as a kind of microcosm of events, and these events would be actualisations of factual propositions that always exist in potential, and together these events would develop a certain pattern, like an organism; and maybe this pattern could sometimes collide with another pattern of events, that is another individual life, and produce what we call the coincidence of running into someone we know. Because if it’s someone we know, it means their pattern of events will have a kinship with ours in a sense, which may make the collision more likely.”

This is actually how astrology is understood to work because our in-built archetypal planets (the planets in the natal and progressed charts) do indeed "collide" with the planets in other people's charts as well as the present, or transit planets. When they do something happens (as in we would notice it, kind of like it's measurable and there is an effect seen of some sort.) The kinship is called an aspect in astrology and is necessary for a relationship of some sort to exist between one entity and another. That's a very very brief description but @Ginny and I (plus @Sandie33 and @Sadie if they happen to log on) could go into it more - at least I'm aware everyone here is into astro.

The fact that I don't know which one it is. I seem to have a propensity for both.

As in, "want to really be sure before I put this or that identifier out there?"

Isn't it obvious? Jkxx finally admitted that astrology is nothing but coincidence.
*flees*

Very close, it's nothing but meaningful coincidence really.

Moi je pense que c'est l'aile numéro deux... Mais ce n'est que mon opinion.

You might be onto something. A test @Ginny kindly provided also gave me a 2 wing.

Ahh ninja'd by @John K here

 

[Ren]

This is actually how astrology is understood to work because our in-built archetypal planets (the planets in the natal and progressed charts) do indeed "collide" with the planets in other people's charts as well as the present, or transit planets. When they do something happens (as in we would notice it, kind of like it's measurable and there is an effect seen of some sort.) The kinship is called an aspect in astrology and is necessary for a relationship of some sort to exist between one entity and another. That's a very very brief description but @Ginny and I (plus @Sandie33 and @Sadie if they happen to log on) could go into it more - at least I'm aware everyone here is into astro.

Interesting. Thanks for the explanation @jkxx :thumbsup:

So 'meaningful coincidence' would be somehow in between pure randomness and direct causality, or am I far off?

There is still the 'kinship' requirement for a 'collision' to take place.

 

[jkxx]

That last line is correct, yes. I guess one way of thinking of it is being on a certain path and noticing everything and everyone that aligns with that path because it's somehow related to yours in a clearly defined manner. The meaningful coincidence part is just the act of observation of the above, so to speak.

 

[John K]

I was thinking that on the bus back home, lol. I was like: "The thread was originally about the experience of being mistyped, but it's really organically become a pretty cool thread about how INFJs feel about their function use and INFJness in general." Which is awesome.

I was thinking a bit about the mistyping theme yesterday a bit before you posted this @Ren. One thing that struck me is that a preference for a function is not the same as proficiency in it. Most people in my family are good at drawing and painting - I share their pull towards art, but I'm not very good at it, so I express this side of myself in poetry and photography instead. I wonder if this is true of the function preferences - so an INFJ who is well developed in both their Ni and their Fe may look very different to one who struggles with Fe even though it is their "natural" extraverting function. For example, I had a lot of problems with bullies when I was at primary school, and it has definitely affected my ability to trust people - not in any conscious way but by instinct. So I use Fe defensively if I don't take conscious control of it.

I wonder if another way we may mis-type people is when some of the characteristic behaviours of different types can appear to be very similar to other people. This could well be a particular issue for introverts who are mostly showing their secondary rather than primary functions to the world at large. For example, both INTPs and INFJs can indulge in long, complex explanations of their ideas that lose the patience and understanding of those they are talking to (I know this from watching myself do it, and watching INTP friends do it too). From the outside, to an impatient audience, these may look like the same thing even though there are quite different processes going on.

 

[Ren]

I was thinking a bit about the mistyping theme yesterday a bit before you posted this @Ren. One thing that struck me is that a preference for a function is not the same as proficiency in it. Most people in my family are good at drawing and painting - I share their pull towards art, but I'm not very good at it, so I express this side of myself in poetry and photography instead. I wonder if this is true of the function preferences - so an INFJ who is well developed in both their Ni and their Fe may look very different to one who struggles with Fe even though it is their "natural" extraverting function. For example, I had a lot of problems with bullies when I was at primary school, and it has definitely affected my ability to trust people - not in any conscious way but by instinct. So I use Fe defensively if I don't take conscious control of it.

That’s a great point and you’re right, I think it explains a lot in terms of mistyping. People are going to interpret our type/personality in terms of what we show to them, that’s pretty natural – and unless they know us so well as to grasp what logic there is behind this display, they’ll likely end up mistyping to an extent. I think the mistyping might be even more frequent with INFJs who tend to be so intuitive and sensitive by nature (NiFe): in a sense they are built to be easily ‘exposed’ to the world and defensively they might not display those functions as such with everyone. I think this explains a lot of the INFJ mistypes.

A friend was telling me recently about the concept of “Ti peacocking” in the INFJ – and this resonated with me straightaway, for example. I put Ti upfront as a defense mechanism if for some reason I’m feeling insecure, vulnerable, or resentful. And I’m pretty good (proficient, in your terminology) at it, I guess, so it’s not been unusual for me to be confused for an INTP. Of course this will stress me out massively in the end because it’s not my preference function, only leading to potentially more insecurity and vulnerability, and on into a vicious cycle of Ti overuse. I still fall into modes of Ti peacocking from time to time, including here.

And I also think that an INFJ who uses Fe very well socially, but is also a little ‘strange’ or ‘spacey’ due to Ni-domness, might occasionally be mistaken for an ENFP. I think that here this presupposes that the people around do not have a deep understanding of the functions, but I suppose that’s the majority by far.

 

[Lady Jolanda]

I was thinking a bit about the mistyping theme yesterday. One thing that struck me is that a preference for a function is not the same as proficiency in it.

For sure! You're 100% on target there John. Life circumstances can call upon us to develop strengths in areas that aren't our natural tendencies. We then become proficient at a function due to necessity, rather than preference. At the same time, due to life circumstances being what they are, you don't get to develop the function that you would prefer as much.
I'm sorry about the bullies.

For example, both INTPs and INFJs can indulge in long, complex explanations of their ideas that lose the patience and understanding of those they are talking to (I know this from watching myself do it, and watching INTP friends do it too). From the outside, to an impatient audience, these may look like the same thing even though there are quite different processes going on.

This seems to be a clear cut case of: Wrong audience.

A friend was telling me recently about the concept of “Ti peacocking” in the INFJ – and this resonated with me straightaway.

Ti peacocking? :lmao:
That's the funniest thing I've read all morning.

Meaningful Synchronicity pleeeease !! illowfight:

What is this, team redundancy team? illowfight::loveyeyes:

Very close, it's nothing but meaningful coincidence really.

Cool. :rainbowlove:
I've decided to not partake in astro discussion any further, not even to poke fun. It occurred to me that there are really two reasons to have a discussion: 1) to gain understanding; to arrive at some form of truth. 2) To prove oneself right and the other wrong; to win.
Me poking around in this would be a perfect example of reason 2, and hence wrong. Time to walk off. :coyotemeditating:

 

[John K]

That’s a great point and you’re right, I think it explains a lot in terms of mistyping. People are going to interpret our type/personality in terms of what we show to them, that’s pretty natural – and unless they know us so well as to grasp what logic there is behind this display, they’ll likely end up mistyping to an extent. I think the mistyping might be even more frequent with INFJs who tend to be so intuitive and sensitive by nature (NiFe): in a sense they are built to be easily ‘exposed’ to the world and defensively they might not display those functions as such with everyone. I think this explains a lot of the INFJ mistypes.

A friend was telling me recently about the concept of “Ti peacocking” in the INFJ – and this resonated with me straightaway, for example. I put Ti upfront as a defense mechanism if for some reason I’m feeling insecure, vulnerable, or resentful. And I’m pretty good (proficient, in your terminology) at it, I guess, so it’s not been unusual for me to be confused for an INTP. Of course this will stress me out massively in the end because it’s not my preference function, only leading to potentially more insecurity and vulnerability, and on into a vicious cycle of Ti overuse. I still fall into modes of Ti peacocking from time to time, including here.

And I also think that an INFJ who uses Fe very well socially, but is also a little ‘strange’ or ‘spacey’ do to Ni-domness, might occasionally be mistaken for an ENFP. I think that here this presupposes that the people around do not have a deep understanding of the functions, but I suppose that’s the majority by far.

Yes, that's great! The idea of "Ti peacocking" hits the mark for me too! When I was young, I didn't get affirmation from people my own age, but I was clever and found I could get lots of lovely affirmation from adults by being clever, so that was what defined my teens and young adulthood. Like you I really enjoy the intellectual side of things: I could keep up with (and win quite a few) INTP-type pissing contests as @Reason With Logic Filling expressed it so eloquently in another thread a few days ago - but actually a lot of these can be more like intellectual pillow fights, which are great fun. I always had problems with real conflict though, and avoided it if I could, or felt guilty for ages after if I caused it. I only realise all this with hindsight though.

I suspect one of the biggest risks for an Ni-dom is if their extraverted function is underdeveloped, and their Ni is not in good control. You can spin off into unreality like that very badly and end up making bad career choices, picking the wrong life partner, getting caught up in damaging belief systems, etc. Ni is insidious in the way it provides a feeling of certainty - but it needs to be fed with and tested against reality, at least for the big issues in life like these. The old scientific paradigm of hypothesis <-> test is not at all a bad fit. I wonder if an INTJ type person could easily be recognised if they have this sort of problem, except by an expert.

 

[Reverist]

I think that here this presupposes that the people around do not have a deep understanding of the functions, but I suppose that’s the majority by far.

Yeah, most people don't have an understanding of personality type or the underlying functions, especially the distinctions between similar functions.

I think trying to type someone based on just type descriptions or function descriptions would also be difficult because you'd have to assume that a person is showing up with the heathiest version of their type or a specific function as that is how the descriptions are written. Most people don't even know their type, let alone are manifesting a healthy version of it. Even typing someone based on your experience of that type could be hard unless you've experienced a lot of variations on that type.

A friend was telling me recently about the concept of “Ti peacocking” in the INFJ – and this resonated with me straightaway, for example. I put Ti upfront as a defense mechanism if for some reason I’m feeling insecure, vulnerable, or resentful...Of course this will stress me out massively in the end because it’s not my preference function, only leading to potentially more insecurity and vulnerability, and on into a vicious cycle of Ti overuse

The dreaded Ni-Ti loop. This totally resonnates with me too. It can be scary using Fe to get that outer world feedback, I'd much rather rely on Ti and feel clever, but Ti turns critical pretty easily for me and when I shut off Fe, I feel so detached from others I can't stand it, and it's only recently that I recognized this and am actively working on Fe, even forming boundaries so I can explore this without feeling so vulnerable.

 

[Sandie33]

This could well be a particular issue for introverts who are mostly showing their secondary rather than primary functions to the world at large.

@jkxx ... isn't this similar to Sun sign in astrology being our True Self, where as the Ascendant or Rising sign is how others view us, even if we don't notice the characteristics ourselves?

Thank you @John K , I just wanted to use your statement as an example for how MBTi isn't much different in modus than astrology

 

[Ren]

Ti peacocking? :lmao:
That's the funniest thing I've read all morning.

Well then, I suppose I gotta give credit where it's due... the expression is copyright our beloved @Wyote (And I'm not even sure he used it in that exact sense, but that's how I understood it)

The dreaded Ni-Ti loop. This totally resonnates with me too. It can be scary using Fe to get that outer world feedback, I'd much rather rely on Ti and feel clever, but Ti turns critical pretty easily for me and when I shut off Fe, I feel so detached from others I can't stand it, and it's only recently that I recognized this and am actively working on Fe, even forming boundaries so I can explore this without feeling so vulnerable.

Yeah, you're describing my first few months of 2018 to be honest....

 

[Lady Jolanda]

Well then, I suppose I gotta give credit where it's due... the expression is copyright our beloved @Wyote (And I'm not even sure he used it in that exact sense, but that's how I understood it)

Peacocking Wyote.

 

[Misadventure]

 

[Wyote]

View attachment 42437
Peacocking Wyote.

Lolol I actually somewhat got the idea from the YouTube dude DaveSuperPowers and gave it my own flair :reason:

 

[Lady Jolanda]

Shall we ask where he got it from then? We have a golden opportunity to trace an idea back to its origins here!

 

[Wyote]

Shall we ask where he got it from then? We have a golden opportunity to trace an idea back to its origins here!

 

[Ren]

Misadventure aka the Queen of Introverted Feeling

Lolol I actually somewhat got the idea from the YouTube dude DaveSuperPowers and gave it my own flair :reason:

Oh, that guy! I remember the video you linked about INFJ vs INFP. I remember liking it a lot for its clarity and precision.

INFJ under threat: "TI ACTIVATED"

:

 

[Misadventure]

Misadventure aka the Queen of Introverted Feeling

ikr? It's so funny to me that even now I'll still get mbti results that say INFJ when it's obvious I'm nothing but Fi and Ne lol! Functions are the way to go if anyone is having trouble with their type.

 

[Wyote]

People mistype me cuz I'm Ni-tarded

jk tho, people don't mistype me

 

[John K]

People mistype me cuz I'm Ni-tarded

jk tho, people don't mistype me

You're off the hook O Great and Holy master of the INFJ Portals!

MBTI doesn't apply to us non-humans

 

[Wyote]

O Great and Holy master of the INFJ Portals!