Fight injustice with love? | INFJ Forum

Fight injustice with love?

Discussion in 'Philosophy and Religion' started by TinyBubbles, Apr 19, 2010.

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  1. TinyBubbles

    TinyBubbles anarchist

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    People talk about the power of the love, the power of a smile to change a person's day for the better, but I wonder, just how much good does "love" do? I don't mean love for yourself or your family or friends, those come naturally, I'm talking about love for people who don't deserve it, who do the wrong thing towards you or towards the community --people who hurt you, or who hurt someone you care about. Do they too "deserve" to be treated with love, or would alternative means be necessary to even things out?

    People are not saints. It's a harsh world we live in, the practical must override the ideal, if we are to progress at all. Right? Or not? We can't all be like Jesus and love each other unconditionally.. can we?

    Say you're in a relationship with someone and they cheat on you with someone else. You find out, and your partner apologizes, and says s/he loves the other person and not you, and plans to go away with them. What, then, would you feel about the person who replaced you in your partner's life? Jealous? Angry? Hurt? Bitter? Sad that you were lied to? I bet you wouldn't feel love for them, or at least, you wouldn't ACT with love towards them - if the two can be separated. If you act with love towards them, it would be like you're OK with it, and how could you do that unless:

    1. you were not very attached to that person to begin with, or

    2. you're selfless and don't care who they're with, as long as they're happy.

    In the second case, their actions have created a moral imbalance, to which you've declined to respond. The imbalance will remain.. and if it happens again, and again, it'll be like your desires have no significance whatsoever and only what is good or enjoyable to the other person would matter at all. How then could you not feel deprived?

    In the first case, since you were not attached to them at all, the consequences of their actions have not hurt you, because you were in a sense not involved. But everyone's attached to something.. or someone.. aren't they? The buddhist philosophy of complete non attachment might ALLOW for a completely loving, tolerant world, but I think it's unrealizable, because people do get attached, and I'd even say it's a good thing, because what is life if you're not immersed in something or someone wholeheartedly? In my opinion, that would be no life at all, but a wait for death.

    Uhh.. getting back to the original point, can love really have the same constructive effect as FORCE? Love is usually passive, it is non-directive, it lets what will be to be.. it does not try to control or change (usually), it is peaceful and accepting, not intolerant and demanding, as is force. But in a situation where an injustice has been done- for example, if a theft has been committed- then force will have a better chance of correcting that imbalance than will love. If you ask a thief to return stolen goods in a nice and loving manner, and enforce no consequences for not doing so, he'd probably keep them. But if you threaten the thief with imprisonment or some other type of punishment should he not return them, that forceful action will more likely compel him to return the goods and thus set the balance straight.

    I guess the assumption here is that there can BE injustice, that you can objectively quantify actions in terms of right and wrong, good and bad, and use those classifications to justifiably enforce a certain course of action over others. Maybe it's not true. Maybe right and wrong depend entirely on the viewer, and not some overall balance of good and bad. If so, then responding to events with love would make a lot more sense than trying to "correct" them with force, since love would at least make it easier to get along, and you'll probably be happier... and happiness is the whole point of life, isn't it?

    What do you guys think?
     
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  2. slant

    slant Sedated slanty

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    It is possible to enforce and still be open and welcoming with love. Observe, this is similar to the bolded statement: Bozeman Officer buys grocery for shoplifting suspect

    Or, look at this one: Man buys dinner for mugger
     
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  3. enfp can be shy

    enfp can be shy people vs the bad people?
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    War for peace? :p Fight corruption, fight crime, fight fight. Maybe fighting everything creates more problems in the long run?
    I'm certain that's not necessary.

    Jealousy originates from possessiveness. Which is already a plague of its own. When I love someone I'm capable of helping them find whoever suits them better than me. (this movie is recommended: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099334/)

    I'm very sorry that you feel that way. It seems I was right that Confucius is IxTP; he teaches: whatever you choose to do in life, do it with all of your heart. Which sounds a little scary to me. I imagine die-hard fanatics, defending dogmas in the face of newer data. That's probably stretching it a bit, but strong attachment surely has major setbacks for development.

    Not really. The force will create even more imbalance, and cause even more crimes. http://i39.tinypic.com/4zvmuf.jpg
    When someone hurts another, hurting them back DOES NOT set the record straight. It only makes the situation much worse.

    I don't call it exactly love, but rather, the desire to understand. To return the injustice is a disinterested reaction, which doesn't help in identifying and treating the causes.
     
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    #3 enfp can be shy, Apr 20, 2010
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2010
  4. Roger

    Roger ...

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    Dear friend may,

    If girl/boy and boy/girl's love is based on love, then good or wrong doesn't matter. All is better in love.

    Love should be based on love. Tough concept to follow. But guarantees to give great peace and love in life for both.

    :)
     
  5. Shai Gar

    Shai Gar Guest

    with love, and arms.
     
  6. Roger

    Roger ...

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    Edit:

    I am talking about heart-to-heart love. Not about physical love.

    I hope you can see the picture, when you love someone truly from heart then any mistake can turn in beautiful moment.
     
  7. arbygil

    arbygil Passing through

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    You know what they say, May: You can catch more flies with honey, than with vinegar. People are used to bad and rotten things happening. And they expect bad and rotten things to happen to them if they're shown nothing but the worst.

    Obviously you should utilize balance, but it doesn't hurt us to buy new things and donate those new things to shelters. It doesn't hurt us to serve folks unconditionally and care about them where they are. And if we realize that when they strike us that they're only hurting themselves, we're the better person for it. Now, I wouldn't say put yourself in mortal danger 'cause yeah, without wisdom you can be a fool and get into dumb situations.

    But if you're wise about it, you can change a person's response for a lifetime...and maybe that experience will haunt them so much that they become a new person of courage and then they're able to help others.
     
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  8. Shai Gar

    Shai Gar Guest

    that myth was busted by xkcd.


    You catch more flies with balsamic vinegar than honey.
    And you know what? I watched a pot, and it DID boil!
     
  9. OP
    TinyBubbles

    TinyBubbles anarchist

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    you don't think being passionate is a good thing? it doesn't always lead to extremism (although it can), I would say it has more advantages than drawbacks. but if you feel differently please elaborate on why!
     
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