Do Narcissists know what they are? | Page 3 | INFJ Forum

Do Narcissists know what they are?

No. They are so egoistic they cannot see true reactions from those around them.
They only see what they want to see.

My Mom was a Narcissist. One time I sat and had a conversation with my therapist counselor about Narcissism and the mental disorder in general. He told me that is one of a handful of disorders considered by Psychologists and Licensed Professional Counselors as Untreatable. He said the Narcissist will not take responsibility for their hurtful or harmful actions and push it all off on others.
From what I've seen even though I forgave my Mom towards the end of her life and had good "person to person" talks with her....she never forgave anyone whom she thought had done her wrong....which was every one. She never changed. She was a queen...and by god you better treat her like one or she shut you out. The only people around her - other than my sister and myself - were ones who needed her money. She died a miserable death - in pain both mentally and physically - and friendless.
I'm 60 yo...and that's one of the saddest lives I've ever seen.

With my mom getting older, I feared the exact situation you described. I know I will never see any change in her attitudes and I think that caring for her will be a difficult process, with so many unresolved questions and perhaps lingering resentment for the hurt she has caused myself and my siblings.

From what I have seen narcissists definitely have a combination of the worst traits: inflated ego/importance, complete lack of self awareness, paranoia (assume the worst about other people), especially if it elevates them above the other. They place themselves on a pedestal and ignore their wrongdoings relentlessly which is very frustrating for those of us who are real introspects and love to grow.

At this stage in my life, past the hurt and longing for normality, I find it really sad, for them really. As I can see the relationships they have destroyed and wonder what kind of life they will/did look back on later. As someone who would take pride in being a parent, I can say I see their lives as the greatest of failures. How do they see theirs..., I've always been curious.
 
I don't know, nor do I care other than in the curious clinical sense that one views an aberration of nature. I would certainly care if I had an emotion investment in one, because I would want to burrow in and search for something human and warm. I think people are attracted to NPDs and sociopathic types because 1. They believe they can access the good person he or she used to be, and 2. It's a challenge. If a vicious dog loves you, and only you, because you broke through to him or her....that's empowering.

I think of NPDers and sociopathic types as very dull, sensory people. They are all surface. Extremely shallow, and basically devoid of any meaningful deep thoughts. Heard the lizard brain jokes?

Now, I prefer to spend my time seeking out people who deserve my attention.

Spinning a defect into an advantage? A narcissist might do that.

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/01/life-as-a-nonviolent-psychopath/282271/
 
At this stage in my life, past the hurt and longing for normality, I find it really sad, for them really. As I can see the relationships they have destroyed and wonder what kind of life they will/did look back on later. As someone who would take pride in being a parent, I can say I see their lives as the greatest of failures. How do they see theirs..., I've always been curious.

I have come to view all of my life experiences as situations designed to help me grow and evolve on my evolutionary path. Hence I finally came to view my Mom as one of the greatest teachers for me because without her....and our fractious relationship....I would not be the person I am today.
About two years before Mom tried to commit suicide I confessed to her that I was grateful she birthed me. I had truly come to realize that without her efforts to concieve and birth me - which was an ordeal for her - I wouldn't have existed on this planet. Even though there were many many challenges growing up with her....she taught me what Compassion was NOT....and therefore I developed a great deal of Compassion within me.
So I do not look at my Mom's life as a failure with regard to me. She probably saw her life as a failure though.....for there was never enough. ....never enough money (even though she had 100's of thousands of dollars)....never enough gifts and adoration from others.....never enough Love. Not getting enough Love....or I should say... the Right kind of Love... is at the Core of every Narcissist.
Try to find even the tiniest reason to feel love for your Mom in your heart any time you can remember to do this. This is for YOUR sanity and well being.
I wish you success in loving you. Namaste'
 
I have come to view all of my life experiences as situations designed to help me grow and evolve on my evolutionary path. Hence I finally came to view my Mom as one of the greatest teachers for me because without her....and our fractious relationship....I would not be the person I am today.
About two years before Mom tried to commit suicide I confessed to her that I was grateful she birthed me. I had truly come to realize that without her efforts to concieve and birth me - which was an ordeal for her - I wouldn't have existed on this planet. Even though there were many many challenges growing up with her....she taught me what Compassion was NOT....and therefore I developed a great deal of Compassion within me.
So I do not look at my Mom's life as a failure with regard to me. She probably saw her life as a failure though.....for there was never enough. ....never enough money (even though she had 100's of thousands of dollars)....never enough gifts and adoration from others.....never enough Love. Not getting enough Love....or I should say... the Right kind of Love... is at the Core of every Narcissist.
Try to find even the tiniest reason to feel love for your Mom in your heart any time you can remember to do this. This is for YOUR sanity and well being.
I wish you success in loving you. Namaste'

Sage advice Kgal, and I'm sorry to hear about your moms struggles also. I understand completely what you mean about retaining that sense of love for my own well-being and not corrupting my own nature by holding onto hate. It's funny, as a child I didn't resent my mother, it was more disapproval at her actions! lol

I guess I feel a protectiveness towards my other siblings as well, as I have always had a strong sense of right and wrong and could see the harm being caused to them also. However I do believe because of my experiences I am a much wiser, more compassionate person. Overall my life experiences have helped to build character, I have learned through my mothers mistakes as well as my own and I'm a better person for it.
 
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Overall my life experiences have helped to build character, I have learned through my mothers mistakes as well as my own and I'm a better person for it.

:D Beautiful!
 
I found this online and it rings true for the one I deal with....

We all have come in contact with the flamboyant narcissist. Their self-absorption can’t be mistaken. But there is also the covert narcissist, who is not so easy to decipher. They are equally as self-absorbed as the outward version and equally as destructive in relationships.

Narcissistic personality disorder is created in one of two ways in childhood. Either the child is given too much attention or not enough. This leaves a large void as they enter adulthood. Their never-satisfied “taker” stance becomes the perfect magnet for the unknowing “giver” personality. Narcissists will attempt to find someone who will give them the attention they either had or lacked as children, putting others at an emotional deficit.


Narcissists will exhibit these five signs:

1. False Humility
This is actually a form of pride but will be shown in a self-deprecating way. Narcissists will play the victim and put themselves down so that they bait you into complimenting them. They will say they are doing things because they want to, but they are approval-seeking. They are concerned about themselves and are not truly humble.

Their goal is to let you know they are important and seek high status positions. Yet they disguise themselves in humility — which isn’t anything like an inner humble character of one who puts others before themselves. Their goal is to make sure they are stroked for their efforts.

2. Lack of Empathy
Narcissists will ignore any valid concerns you may have. They will choose to follow their agenda in every circumstance because they have are selfish. They don’t want to learn compassion and want to stay isolated and withdrawn. They will ignore you when you aren’t feeling well but want to be doted on when they are not well. There is no meeting halfway since they only want to be served, not to serve.

3. Immature Responses
Narcissists are highly sensitive and take offense at simple criticisms. They magnify a perceived or real offense more than it deserves. They are not able to dialogue but deflect blame onto others for their reactions.

They attempt to cover their anger by pretending things don’t bother them, yet their nonverbal body language shows anger even though they don’t admit it. They can become passive-aggressive in their responses and not follow through with actions.

4. Simplification of Others’ Needs
Narcissists will minimize the needs of the people around them. They will not explore the details of a particular situation because they don’t deem it worthy of their time. They will label people and deflect blame onto them instead of taking responsibility for their own actions. They reduce complex issues to simple ones in order to brush them aside as stupid or useless. They don’t want to be bothered with facts or logic, only their own limited scope of what is important so as not to invest their time or energy in anything contrary to their personal agenda.

5. Unable to Listen
Narcissists tend to “shoot from the hip” with quick advice and not ask questions during conversations, but instead shut down dialogue so they do the minimum amount. They do not want to expend any energy toward relationships. They don’t care about what you have to say because they want to follow what is best for them regardless of what you are sharing. In the end, they don’t care enough to listen to you.

Obviously, not all quiet or shy people are covert narcissists. But keep these signs in mind. Covert narcissists are not as benign as they seem and can cause you much distress.
QFT!
 
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