Youth Going Through Gender Transition Are More At Risk Of Psychiatric Issues

QuickTwist said:

Whatever sex expression a person has, it is determined. It is not subjective.

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For the sake of truth, it must be emphasized that in nature there are life forms that reproduce within the same sex. The human psyche is something far too complex to be fully described by science alone.

If we are talking about biological sex, you are right: it’s 0 and 1. However, if we want to talk about sexual orientation as it relates to mental health, that is a completely different story.

De gustibus non est disputandum... one's personal tastes and feelings are not up for debate. This was already discussed 2500 years ago; there's no need to trouble such giants today. Fortunately, we are all born different,otherwise, it would feel even more like living inside an Orwellian novel.

-Giammarco

I can always count on NF's to defend their idealism and that no two NF's ideal is ever the same. Did I already say that I was tired?

TomasM said:

I can always count on NF's to defend their idealism and that no two NF's ideal is ever the same. Did I already say that I was tired?

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This is very true. Some of us will take the standpoint that it is morally neutral and that gender Can be decided in the mind. While some, like myself and Twist see gender as something determined at birth, endowed by our creator - and the seed of our fathers, of course.

It's quite difficult to debate such a thing calmly because it is such a sensitive topic, as you have said well - between a bunch of idealistic NFs..

Wyote said:

I think you mean sex here.
Gender refers to the socially constructed roles, behaviors, expressions, and identities of girls, women, boys, men, and gender-diverse people.

And again, science, not politics or religion, dictates how sex is determined.
Biological Sex is Not a Single Event

None of this is in conflict with Christianity unless it is (mis)interpreted to serve an agenda (political or otherwise)

Galatians 3:28: A central tenet of the New Testament is Paul’s statement: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."


What do I know though, I'm just a coyote

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That verse is more broadly speaking to the fact that we are all one in God's eyes, his children, and He our father.

Here we see it is described quite clearly.

The Bible primarily presents gender as a binary creation, defining humanity as "male and female". Key verses include Genesis 1:27 "male and female he created them"

These verses, in fact, all reference the creation of mankind itself. Gender and sex are synonymous.
These verses make clear that we were created man and woman, and deemed "mankind" - made in the image of God.

Genesis 1:27: "So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them."

Genesis 5:2: "He created them male and female and blessed them. And he named them “Mankind” at the time they were created."

Matthew 19:4: "“Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female,’..."

Mark 10:6: "But at the beginning of creation God ‘made them male and female.’"

Key Interpretations:

Divine Creation: These verses are interpreted as establishing gender as a fixed, divinely ordained aspect of creation, rather than a social construct.
Complementarity: The verses are used to highlight that God created two complementary sexes designed to "multiply".

Otherwise God would have designed us to be able to procreate with like genders, female with female, and man with man, as well. Why would He command then, us to "be fruitful and procreate" more believers into the world - but leave out all his homosexual / lgbtqia children?

God states clearly in the Bible that our bodies are temples that are not to be altered. He tells us how He knew the number of hair on our heads as we slumber in our mother's wombs... God therefore, does not make mistakes. Our creation is very personal, and very intentional.

• Genesis 1:27 & 5:2: Establishes a strict binary, stating God created humanity as male and female.
• Deuteronomy 22:5: "A woman shall not wear a man's apparel, nor shall a man put on a woman's garment; for whoever does such things is abhorrent to the LORD your God".
• Psalm 139:13-16: Suggests that God knits individuals together in the womb, implying that physical bodies are intentionally designed by Him.
• Matthew 19:4-6: Jesus affirms the creation of male and female, defining marriage based on this distinction.
• 1 Corinthians 6:9-10: Mentions "effeminate" or "abusers of themselves with mankind" (sometimes interpreted in this context as acting contrary to one's biological sex).
• 1 Corinthians 6:19-20: Emphasizes that the body is a temple of the Holy Spirit and should be used to honor God, which some interpret as opposing gender-altering surgeries.

As much as I adore you, Wy. This is one of those things we will have to agree to disagree on, as we have discussed before. It isn't political from my standpoint, as I truly do not trust politicians on either side of the fence.. This is biblical.

Wyote said:

I think you mean sex here.
Gender refers to the socially constructed roles, behaviors, expressions, and identities of girls, women, boys, men, and gender-diverse people.

And again, science, not politics or religion, dictates how sex is determined.
Biological Sex is Not a Single Event

None of this is in conflict with Christianity unless it is (mis)interpreted to serve an agenda (political or otherwise)

Galatians 3:28: A central tenet of the New Testament is Paul’s statement: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."

Personally, I like this interpretation

Spoiler

The "Dusk and Dawn" Interpretation: In Genesis, God creates "light and dark" and "land and sea." This is a literary device called a merism—where two opposites represent the entire spectrum. Just as God created "dusk and dawn" (which are neither fully light nor dark) and "marshes" (neither fully land nor sea), the creation of "male and female" includes the entire spectrum of human gender.

What do I know though, I'm just a coyote

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Haha, but you are a very wise and kind coyote.
We just see things from opposite perspectives on this one, and that's ok with me.

God gave us all free will, to chose to accept or deny, even Jesus said he does not force. Neither should we force one another to beleive what we beleive, because it won't happen anyway and trying to only causes misery, or so it seems.

Wyote said:

And again, it's just how you wanna misinterpret the bible
It is a shame that the foundations of the religion are lost on most today
Inclusivity is the most Christian behavior one could engage in

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Again we disagree here, but I see how you feel and I do agree that God loves everyone of us indeed. He truly does.

But inclusivity and love are not synonymous with the acceptance of sin. If this were so He would not have decimated Sodom and Gomorrah and turned Lots wife into a chunk of sea salt for disobedience in watching.

Wyote said:

Are you saying that being anything outside of strictly male/female is a sin?
Just want to clarify what you mean here

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I am saying that there are two genders, God made them male and female, and ofc there are some who are born with chromosomal differences such as seen in Kleinfelter Syndrome, for example, but these are outliers and through no choice of their own.

But opting to take what God ordained us, what God knit us to be in our mother's wombs and changing it is indeed a sin, yes.

Wyote said:

So if you're born all fucked up it's ok and not a sin
What if god knits you with just one ball
Gotta have two balls to be a real man in his image ya know

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️

You know many things count as sexual sin, plain old sin, according to God, yes? That includes myself. There are things I have done and must use self control to contain that were very much wrong to God, and I still stumble from time to time. So I am really not saying anything here to claim holier than thou status, not in the least. Let he who is without blame cast the first stone and all..

But it is something to work towards, for me, to learn to change things within myself which God says are sinful, not only to please Him but because he knows what trouble these things can cause in our lives, and wants the best for us... just like any good father does.

I suppose if he knits you with just one ball then that's what you roll with. 0.0 You have to ask Him that one, it's way above my pay grade, Wy.

Wyote said:

So it's ok to be trans...
You just gotta know that you're a sinful little shit like everyone else

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If it's the choice you make, just like any of us with other choices as well, not just the choice to be transgender.. then it is logical that there will be repercussions both here on Earth and when we meet our maker. That's what I am saying. I understand that you don't agree, and that is OK.

God wouldn't want us to treat someone who is trans by choice or suffering with dysphoria in a cruel or mocking way. Just as he wouldn't want anyone else to mock us because we committed a different sin, be it sexual or otherwise.

Everyone's souls and the decisions they make on this Earth are theirs and theirs alone to deal with.

Here is the thing:

If God intended males and females to be a certain way then that completely changed because of "The Fall".

You do get people in "male" bodies with female minds because that is how genetics can change the mind not just the body.

Just because of some outside genitalia does not make it that the mind is not effected by being in a different state than it would be as per what is on the outside. Its not just genitalia its what inside the brain which is not necessarily mental illness just a mismatch between inside and outside. Some people think the outside is more important to determine male and female well others thinking it the inside (particularly the brain) that is most import to determine male and female.

Whatever God intended its not happening as he intended it. How people are on the inside and outside is not matching up for this group of people. So you cannot quote bible verses and say this mismatch goes away. This group wants to be who they are on the inside not outside.

To be that same on the inside as outside is important but those who do not understand say its mental illness or not real.
I would agree that male and female exist but to neglect to think about the inside is not real and does not matter to people is just plain wrong.

People want to be as they are by what is natural to them in actions behaviors all that stuff we call personality.
Suppression of that make people depressed it not because of some delusion people say this group is having.

Fruiteloop said:

Here is the thing:

If God intended males and females to be a certain way then that completely changed because of "The Fall".

You do get people in "male" bodies with female minds because that is how genetics can change the mind not just the body.

Just because of some outside genitalia does not make it that the mind is not effected by being in a different state than it would be as per what is on the outside. Its not just genitalia its what inside the brain which is not necessarily mental illness just a mismatch between inside and outside. Some people think the outside is more important to determine make and female well others tanking it the inside (particularly the brain) that most import to determine male and female.

Whatever God intended its not happening as he intended it. How people are on the inside and outside is not matching up for this group of people. So you cannot quote bible verses and say this mismatch goes away. This group wants to be who they are on the inside not outside.

To be that same on the inside as outside is important but those who do not understand say its mental illness or not real.
I would agree that male and female exist but to neglect to think about the inside is not real and does not matter to people is just plain wrong.

People want to be as they are by what is natural to them in actions behaviors all that stuff we call personality.
Suppression of that make people depressed it not because of some delusion people say this group is having.

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It's not just outside genitalia. It's hormones, chromosomes, emotions, and many other things which tie together with the outside genitalia.

Show me then.. where it says in the Bible - not chat GPT, that the fall of man via Adam and Eve caused us no longer to be made male and female. Verses please?

Misty said:

It's not just outside genitalia. It's hormones, chromosomes, emotions, and many other things which tie together with the outside genitalia.

Show me then.. where it says in the Bible - not chat GPT, that the fall of man via Adam and Eve caused us no longer to be made male and female. Verses please?

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Yes you can tie those things together but what happens if that does not work, then you get dysphoria.

The bible says nothing about dysphoria but we can infer that such things got srewd up because of adam and even if the bible is true.

Would dysphoria exist without the sin entering the earth, doubtfully so because then everything be perfect. nothing bad such as (suffering) would exist.

Wyote said:

Are you saying that being anything outside of strictly male/female is a sin?
Just want to clarify what you mean here

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and @Misty

St. Thomas Aquina argue 'Grace does not destroy nature, but perfects it'. In this view, Reason and Science are not in contradiction. Instead, they are parallel paths converging toward a single Truth.

Furthermore, Aquinas teaches us The soul is the form of the body. This is a crucial metaphysical point: it suggests that the human being is an indivisible unity of spirit and biology. Our physical, biological reality is not an 'accidental' costume that we wear; it is the very 'material' through which our essence is expressed.

From this standpoint, the biological binary is not merely a 'social construct,' but the Lex Naturalis (Natural Law),the objective 'code' written into our nature. To ignore the biological foundation is to risk losing the 'form' that defines us. (my view on it)

Perhaps the point of reconciliation lies in recognizing that while science defines the 'how' of our physical structure, spirituality seeks the 'why' of our purpose. Both merit respect in an ecosystem dedicated to the pursuit of Truth. A truly profound understanding of humanity must, as Aquinas suggested, acknowledge that our identity is rooted in the harmony between our mind and the biological reality of our bodies.

My view .


I would like to add a personal reflection on the duty of being a 'just person.' Even if someone’s journey or convictions do not align with my religious beliefs, my faith itself dictates that I must remain a man of justice and compassion.

For example, I have a cousin who is gay. Do I stop loving her because she doesn’t follow every precept of my doctrine? Absolutely not. I continue to love her and stand by her, as taught by the Bible and the parables of mercy. To be a 'Protettore Silenzioso' (Silent Protector) means precisely this: to uphold the Truth without ever losing the capacity to love the person in front of us, regardless of the path they walk. Justice without mercy is cruelty; mercy without justice is weakness. I strive for the balance between the two.


-Giammarco