Michael Brown Case
- Thread starter cvp12gh5
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When you treat people differently because of the color of their skin you are racist. When you give them more, when you take things from them because of the color of their skin you are racist. Do you agree with this so far?
If you really want to dig deeply into things then you would know that you could literally shove the proof that is against their own up their ass, having it been verified by a jury of their own peers and choosing…and people would call them lies…not because they have read about and studied what they are talking about, but they are reiterating what they heard on their favorite media station. We all know too well what happens when we play that game where you whisper a phrase to the next person and then see what you end up with…the message is wrong, but in too many cases here in the US the message has been opinionated by people who feel the need to tell everyone why they are so smart…what we end up with is a big steamy pile of bullshit.
Kind of like the School District Police force that bought one….I love the paint job…lolololol.
So if we paint “search and rescue” on the side it’s still not fucking ridiculous?
We built this country on the backs of slave labor, not some idealistic vision of hardworking Americans and the sweat of their brows and all that….
We used slaves….this squashed all competition around the world…can you imagine how profitable it would be so own slaves?
My God. And even now…there is a difference in the amount of justice that a young black male can get vs everyone else.
The poor in the country are being pushed to the edges…they are being marginalized…especially if you are of color…the problem is, they are marginalizing millions of people. They are redistricting voting regions, and changing voting laws to disenfranchise whom? African americans. Who sees their benefits that they deserve and pay into as working citizens of the United States always on the chopping block in Congress first - the poor, most of whom are not Caucasian.
The group of people who feel disenfranchised IMO is getting too big for it to be contained…hence the riots we are seeing from people feeling there is no justice for them.
America did have slaves and slaves did help build the infrastructure. Im not responsible for that and no one alive today is either. I do not owe anything to the black community for what happened in the past, no one alive today does either. Its part of our history, we can acknowledge it and move on. You dont hear people screaming about the fact Michelle Obamas ancestors owned white irish slaves...
And this really is the problem. In this country we have no end of people that want to use past black slavery as a crutch or an excuse ignoring all other slavery that has taken place in the world and CONTINUES to take place. Why do Al Sharpton and Jessie Jackson spend thier time pursuing and commenting on the slavery taking place today? Oh thats right, its ONLY about the color of THEIR skin.
Watch a movie called America it should give you a more correct and factual look at how America was formed and came to be.
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Excuse me?
We had two hundred and fifty years of slavery, then 90 years of Jim Crow, sixty years of separate yet equal, 35 years of racist housing policy, shall I go on?
Pop your bubble.
Outright segregation was still in effect in the 50s which wasn't THAT long ago. Rosa Parks was arrested for not giving up her seat in 1955. A lot of people around are old enough to remember that era and find it relevant.
This shit doesn't suddenly disappear over night. Laws changed - whoopty do. Sentiments take a lot longer to change.
Slavery has been present ever since recorded history. Just because we live in a society today where the majority recognize (primarily because its taught) that its morally wrong doesnt change the fact that humans do not really have that much of an issue with it. America had slaves for a small amount of time in the history of the world. So, we recognize its wrong and move past it. Concering the racist elements that still exist in this country, clearly those need to be addressed and removed. However I do not have the slightest clue how to do that. Does anyone? Humans are apparently programed to notice things that are different then them and attack it until it either conforms or dies. So long as people talk differently, look different act different. .. there will always be some form of intolerance like this.
I do not dispute that racism where it exists is a bad thing. In my mind its one of those common sense things. In fact I recognize it as being bad for many reasons most people do not. This discussion about Micheal Brown though continues because people want to continue to push the idea he is dead because of racism. People WANT that to be true when there simply is no proof of that from the information we the public have been given. The other guy that djied from the choke hold is a bit more questionable. However I make this observation. Had the guy been white, would that story have made national news?
When the black people were rioting after Browns death do you know what story CNN was running? "When White People Riot" talking about an October college town "riot" that happen which really was nothing more than a bunch of drunk college kids destroying property. They did this to cater to their bread and butter of promoting and instigating racial tention.
Im simply not going to put up with people saying black people are being oppressed and kept in poverty. Children being told they cant make it in this world because society has it in for them and then they in turn use it as justification to commit crime.
Its a two sided coin.
Correct.
Now I ask you this. Do you believe the mental process that allows people to think that acting this way is acceptable is dictated by skin color?
I don’t think that anyone out that has been saying that the police may not be out and out racist. They may even be against racism personally.
But the system itself is racist is basically what it boils down to…it isn’t liberals vs conservatives on this one…there are those who benefit from this and clearly those who do not.
If a police officer does a “stop and frisk” that could be construed as racist if the only reason for you being stopped is the color of your skin.
The officers DO hold some accountability for not perpetuating bad decision making such as “stop and frisk”…I don’t know how closely these guys are watched themselves as to if they are following through to do a certain quota of these types of stops?
White privilege does exist.
And people with any darker shade than white live by another set of laws set up to protect those in the classes above them, even obviously so.
Just as you and I are subject to justice different than justice enjoyed by celebrities and sports figures…the next rung up we find the politicians (though they also tend to eat their own)…the next rung up we find the huge fund managers, the Jaime Diamonds…the seemingly untouchables who also seemingly have no laws that pertain to them other than not to shoot someone on live TV. (I’m sure they would get house arrest for that anyhow)
My point it, there are people who are not feeling that they are getting justice…and they are right…people really need to take a look at our private prison complex that incarcerates a quarter of our population…THAT is fucking insane.
We have black on black crime every night. People are being murdered, and drive-by shootings are killing children that have not had a chance to figure where they belong yet. It is rare when it is not black on black. They carry guns, and our LEOs know it. They are taught to not become a victim. Without them, we would have chaos in the streets. We have black officers, several of which are personal friends, doing their job every day in the middle of all this. You can almost set your watch by it.
Go into a neighborhood to calm things down and the situation can get out of hand quickly. The mentality is not, these are blacks. The mentality is, I had best be ready for anything. Playing the slavery card is obsolete. Our President just used this same mentality in his dealings with Raul. He stated there was no use keeping in place something written so many years ago. How many times could that be twisted? What about the Constitution? That was written many years ago. Have they stopped giving the blacks first shot at contracts? MBE has been twisted so many times. I'm paying for something that was written many years ago and should be obsolete.
Until you have walked into hell with guns blazing, try not to judge those that have and do often and readily as their job. If the problem had not warranted the LEOs to get involved, this would not have happened.
Go into a neighborhood to calm things down and the situation can get out of hand quickly. The mentality is not, these are blacks. The mentality is, I had best be ready for anything. Playing the slavery card is obsolete. Our President just used this same mentality in his dealings with Raul. He stated there was no use keeping in place something written so many years ago. How many times could that be twisted? What about the Constitution? That was written many years ago. Have they stopped giving the blacks first shot at contracts? MBE has been twisted so many times. I'm paying for something that was written many years ago and should be obsolete.
Until you have walked into hell with guns blazing, try not to judge those that have and do often and readily as their job. If the problem had not warranted the LEOs to get involved, this would not have happened.
I agree that people feel they arent getting justice because few are. Im not sure how you can prove people of different skin color are getting a different lesser form of justice when no one is.
So we agree the justice system is broken. We agree there needs to be greater oversight of the mental stability of those who are supposed to protect the general population. I simply think it needs to be an overal change not one that focuses on any one group of people.
I can post a slew (and you know I can lol) of statistics about poverty and growing up in poverty.
The general rule is most folks end up in the same socio-economic pool because they are given the fewest resources. Take college in the 1960’s…almost all taxpayer funded…look at what you got, you had the economic boom of the 1980’s. What’s funny (or not) is they can directly correlate the crime rate jumping 20 years later from when things like early education have been cut.
It just so happens that little statistics like this -
Can make just about anything into a race issue.
What I mean by that is…when you villanize the poor…statistically speaking “the poor” are mostly blacks and latinos…that sounds pretty fucking racial to me, if it we me in their shoes and I saw what pitiful spending already being put to use in communities that need it the most always first on the chopping block. And we hear wailing about how it’s too expensive to fund food stamps (the largest recipient of which are children), cost of living increases for social security so our seniors don’t have to freeze to death in the winter trying to save money on heating, you know, all the stuff that Jesus would also cut first we he in charge.
So it becomes racial because by it’s very make-up it has to be so…no matter how anyone else wants it to be.
http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ple-black-people-michael-brown-death-ferguson
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How poorly you know Jesus. From race to religion? Guess someone could turn this into anything.
I have seen so much money mishandled, abused, taken, stuffed pockets of minorities that play the system, lies on forms, people admonishing lies on forms, hiding income, hiding income because they believe the government has no right to it, monies thrown away so they can keep their budget, teachers that ruin kids, preachers that ruin kids, parents that ruin kids, kids that steal from parents, kids that kill parents, parents that kill kids, etcetera; make sure to fix it all, now. Human nature, when left to its own desires, can get ugly. It can get beautiful, too.
You want to show percentages? Show how many arrests end up like Michael Brown. What biased platform will you choose?
I have seen so much money mishandled, abused, taken, stuffed pockets of minorities that play the system, lies on forms, people admonishing lies on forms, hiding income, hiding income because they believe the government has no right to it, monies thrown away so they can keep their budget, teachers that ruin kids, preachers that ruin kids, parents that ruin kids, kids that steal from parents, kids that kill parents, parents that kill kids, etcetera; make sure to fix it all, now. Human nature, when left to its own desires, can get ugly. It can get beautiful, too.
You want to show percentages? Show how many arrests end up like Michael Brown. What biased platform will you choose?
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My only point is that the further from the top you are the further from justice you are too.
The system is biased, and racist, and broken.
No need get all preachy…I’m not attacking anyone another than those disgusting individuals at the top who have convinced America that it’s better off being fleeced by Wall Street.
You wanna know what trickles down? It sure isn’t money.
I think a lot of really good Christian people have been fooled into promoting hate instead of tolerance.
But we are all imperfect…myself included.
PLEASE post the percentages. There are LEOs getting murdered by radical idiots. I blame the NAACP.
How many arrests end up like Michael Brown?
WHY were the police there in the first place.
A man waved back at me this morning, after I waved at him, and my GSD went off on him from the hand movement. He was inside my car and leashed with window up 95%. Just saying.
The system you speak about.......what is it? How is it NOT taking care of those low on your totem pole? I can't fix something without distinct details. What law? What rule? Maybe a Christian law? "Love your neighbor as yourself."
How many arrests end up like Michael Brown?
WHY were the police there in the first place.
A man waved back at me this morning, after I waved at him, and my GSD went off on him from the hand movement. He was inside my car and leashed with window up 95%. Just saying.
The system you speak about.......what is it? How is it NOT taking care of those low on your totem pole? I can't fix something without distinct details. What law? What rule? Maybe a Christian law? "Love your neighbor as yourself."
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Well firstly, can you please put someone’s name on what you are saying or quote them when you are talking to them?
The system….*sigh*. How is is not taking care of them…let’s see…
Try 46 million Americans with 16.5 Million SUBURBAN homes below the poverty line.
On a global context that is surviving on $2 a day to eat, pay bills, gas, etc. (especially don’t get sick) - http://www.brookings.edu/research/papers/2014/08/poverty-america-global-context-chandy-smith
That is awful.
Percentages...
http://www.propublica.org/article/d...utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=dailynewsletter
Young black males in recent years were at a far greater risk of being shot dead by police than their white counterparts – 21 times greater [SUP]i[/SUP], according to a ProPublica analysis of federally collected data on fatal police shootings.
The 1,217 deadly police shootings from 2010 to 2012 captured in the federal data show that blacks, age 15 to 19, were killed at a rate of 31.17 per million, while just 1.47 per million white males in that age range died at the hands of police.
One way of appreciating that stark disparity, ProPublica's analysis shows, is to calculate how many more whites over those three years would have had to have been killed for them to have been at equal risk.
The number is jarring – 185, more than one per week.
ProPublica's risk analysis on young males killed by police certainly seems to support what has been an article of faith in the African American community for decades: Blacks are being killed at disturbing rates when set against the rest of the American population.
Our examination involved detailed accounts of more than 12,000 police homicides stretching from 1980 to 2012 contained in the FBI's Supplementary Homicide Report.
The data, annually self-reported by hundreds of police departments across the country, confirms some assumptions, runs counter to others, and adds nuance to a wide range of questions about the use of deadly police force.
Colin Loftin, University at Albany professor and co-director of the Violence Research Group, said the FBI data is a minimum count of homicides by police, and that it is impossible to precisely measure what puts people at risk of homicide by police without more and better records.
Still, what the data shows about the race of victims and officers, and the circumstances of killings, are "certainly relevant," Loftin said.
"No question, there are all kinds of racial disparities across our criminal justice system," he said. "This is one example."
The FBI's data has appeared in news accounts over the years, and surfaced again with the August killing of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri.
To a great degree, observers and experts lamented the limited nature of the FBI's reports.
Their shortcomings are inarguable.
The data, for instance, is terribly incomplete.
Vast numbers of the country's 17,000 police departments don't file fatal police shooting reports at all, and many have filed reports for some years but not others.
Florida departments haven't filed reports since 1997 and New York City last reported in 2007.
Information contained in the individual reports can also be flawed. Still, lots of the reporting police departments are in larger cities, and at least 1000 police departments filed a report or reports over the 33 years.
There is, then, value in what the data can show while accepting, and accounting for, its limitations.
Indeed, while the absolute numbers are problematic, a comparison between white and black victims shows important trends.
Our analysis included dividing the number of people of each race killed by police by the number of people of that race living in the country at the time, to produce two different rates: the risk of getting killed by police if you are white and if you are black.
David Klinger, a University of Missouri-St. Louis professor and expert on police use of deadly force, said racial disparities in the data could result from "measurement error," meaning that the unreported killings could alter ProPublica's findings.
However, he said the disparity between black and white teenage boys is so wide, "I doubt the measurement error would account for that."
ProPublica spent weeks digging into the many rich categories of information the reports hold: the race of the officers involved; the circumstances cited for the use of deadly force; the age of those killed.
Who Gets Killed?
The finding that young black men are 21 times as likely as their white peers to be killed by police is drawn from reports filed for the years 2010 to 2012, the three most recent years for which FBI numbers are available.
(Jonathan Stray/ProPublica)
The black boys killed can be disturbingly young.
There were 41 teens 14 years or younger reported killed by police from 1980 to 2012 [SUP]ii[/SUP]. 27 of them were black [SUP]iii[/SUP]; 8were white [SUP]iv[/SUP]; 4 were Hispanic [SUP]v[/SUP] and 1 was Asian [SUP]vi[/SUP].
That's not to say officers weren't killing white people. Indeed, some 44 percent of all those killed by police across the 33 years were white.
White or black, though, those slain by police tended to be roughly the same age.
The average age of blacks killed by police was 30.
The average age of whites was 35.
Who is killing all those black men and boys?
Mostly white officers.
But in hundreds of instances, black officers, too.
Black officers account for a little more than 10 percent of all fatal police shootings.
Of those they kill, though, 78 percent were black.
White officers, given their great numbers in so many of the country's police departments, are well represented in all categories of police killings.
White officers killed 91 percent of the whites who died at the hands of police.
And they were responsible for 68 percent of the people of color killed.
Those people of color represented 46 percent of all those killed by white officers.
What were the circumstances surrounding all these fatal encounters?
There were 151 instances in which police noted that teens they had shot dead had been fleeing or resisting arrest at the time of the encounter.
67 percent of those killed in such circumstances were black.
That disparity was even starker in the last couple of years: of the 15 teens shot fleeing arrest from 2010 to 2012, 14 were black.
Did police always list the circumstances of the killings?
No, actually, there were many deadly shooting where the circumstances were listed as "undetermined." 77 percent of those killed in such instances were black.
Certainly, there were instances where police truly feared for their lives.
Of course, although the data show that police reported that as the cause of their actions in far greater numbers after the 1985 Supreme Court decision that said police could only justify using deadly force if the suspects posed a threat to the officer or others.
From 1980 to 1984, "officer under attack" was listed as the cause for 33 percent of the deadly shootings.
Twenty years later, looking at data from 2005 to 2009, "officer under attack" was cited in 62 percent [SUP]xxxvii[/SUP] of police killings.
Does the data include cases where police killed people with something other than a standard service handgun?
Yes, and the Los Angeles Police Department stood out in its use of shotguns.
Most police killings involve officers firing handguns [SUP]xl[/SUP]. But from 1980 to 2012, 714 involved the use of a shotgun [SUP]xli[/SUP].
The Los Angeles Police Department has a special claim on that category.
It accounted for 47 cases [SUP]xlii[/SUP] in which an officer used a shotgun.
The next highest total came from the Dallas Police Department: 14 [SUP]xliii[/SUP].
For more civil rights coverage, read Segregation Now, the resegregation of America's schools, and Living Apart, how the government beytrayed a landmark civil rights law.
[SUP]i[/SUP] ProPublica calculated a statistical figure called a risk ratio by dividing the rate of black homicide victims by the rate of white victims. This ratio, commonly used in epidemiology, gives an estimate for how much more at risk black teenagers were to be killed by police officers.Risk ratios can have varying levels of precision, depending on a variety of mathematical factors. In this case, because such shootings are rare from a statistical perspective, a 95 percent confidence interval indicates that black teenagers are at between 10 and 40 times greater risk of being killed by a police officer. The calculation used 2010-2012 population estimates from the U.S. Census Bureau's American Community Survey.
[SUP]ii[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...anddecade-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179431
[SUP]iii[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...anddecade-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179432
[SUP]iv[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...anddecade-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179433
[SUP]v[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...anddecade-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179434
[SUP]vi[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...anddecade-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179435
[SUP]xxxvii[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...-yearcats-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179463
[SUP]xl[/SUP] Calculated from the "Weapon Used by Offender" variable. Ranked based on frequency of reported shotgun homicides by police agencies.
[SUP]xli[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...n-bystate-spssoutput.html#document/p3/a179466
[SUP]xlii[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/documents/item/1307313-offweapon-lapd-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179467
[SUP]xliii[/SUP] https://www.propublica.org/document...on-dallas-spssoutput.html#document/p1/a179468
Black young males are also more likely to get bit by a K-9 than white people. Most white people stand still. You guessed it: the young black males mostly run and/or hide.
The amount of crime in the suburbs has a lot to do with black/white fatalities, too. Police calls to black on black crime are far greater than white on white. Calls should be in your percentages: it makes your figures biased and out of whack.
The amount of crime in the suburbs has a lot to do with black/white fatalities, too. Police calls to black on black crime are far greater than white on white. Calls should be in your percentages: it makes your figures biased and out of whack.
Sure there are black criminals…I really don’t think you need to convince anyone here of that.
Just as there are racist white guys…neither group represents what we would probably want our “race” to represent.
I get why they run.
It doesn’t take any mental gymnastics to see why certain actions are taken. If I were a young black male…I would be scared shitless to have ANY contact with them (the police) whatsoever…some people’s fight or flight supersedes their rational thinking at the time…both suspect and police officer…except the police are supposed to be trained to think rationally in such situations…unfortunately accidents happen, triggers accidentally get pulled on guns instead of tasers. But the reason people then see such accidents as racially motivated when they do inevitably happen is because their white counterparts are not getting stopped and frisked…therefore they are much less likely to be involved in something terrible like getting accidentally shot by a cop.
That just proves your dog is racist.
No, he doesn't like movements that might offer the guy he protects any kind of danger. He is but 1 1/2 years old and being trained for personal protection. Racist dog....
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