Is love always healthy?

Evolution isn't a rule it is a pattern.

Evolution is a process, and its standards are often translatable to ethics and psychology. We evolved emotions, meaning they are in some way advantageous (though they could be an offshoot/misfiring of another advantageous feature), and therefore we cannot say that an emotion is inherently unhealthy. Emotions can be destructive, but that is due to a perversion of the intended use and nature of the emotion.

Maybe something akin to what TLM said.. Something like the emotions are unhealthy once acted on in a way that is self-destructive or destructive to another in some way.

Yes, that it is a good way of summarizing it.
 
Cause and effect comes to mind.
I am still trying to digest this evolution. Still trying to digest revolution, too.
Evolving and revolving....heh.
 
Love isn't healthy if it manifests as dependent personality disorder or something similar. It is also not healthy if the person who "loves" you is using you.

So it depends on the situation. Love in itself is fine. The consequences of love can be dangerous.
 
My sense is that Love, as the ideal, is an engagement of multiple aspects of conscious awareness (from the sensation of the physical body to the emotion of the heart to the cognition of the mind to the intuition of the soul to the bliss of the spirit) so total in witness, contemplation, and resonance with an-other, that no awareness of one's self remains.

From this death of the individuated self comes awareness of the unity of all things, and indeed, awareness of no-thing-ness. It is awareness of the uni-verse, or singularity of process.

I do not think or feel this state of being is healthy or unhealthy in that it transcends all thought and description.

While my sense is that Love is part of the human potential and experience, my sense is also that Love, as described, is a rare thing indeed. Love between and among people usually involves some subset of sensation, emotion, cognition, intuition, and the recognition of one's own and others' divine nature. It also usually involves a very real sense of self, with its attendant needs and desires, not to mention the needs and desires of those loved.

Trying to meet one's own needs is a challenge in and of itself, even when we are fully aware of what those needs are. For those needs we cannot meet ourself, are we willing and able to communicate with another as to the nature of those needs and are we willing and able to ask for their help in meeting them? In return, will one's partner be willing and able to communicate their needs? Will they ask for our help in meeting them? When and if they do, will we be ready, willing, and able to receive their communication? Will we choose to engage in dialogue such that they are heard and understood?

My sense is that this kind of relationship and nature of engagement requires trust in one's own person as well as trust in one's partner - to wit, that each has needs that each is seeking to meet in the best way each knows how with the resources available to each. My sense is that it also requires a willingness to be open and vulnerable to oneself and to each other.

This is not so easy - for the reason that it is a complex dynamic, for the reason that human beings are involved (and that we err), and perhaps most of all, it asks of us things which are not basic to our acculturation.

To the degree that we are not aware of, or misunderstand the dynamic, that we err, and/or we are not willing and able to meet the needs of the people involved, then yea, I think and feel that in our aspiration to Love, we may choose actions and behaviors that may not be in the interest of our (or another's) health.


Namaste,
Ian
 
To answer on main question: love could have bad influence on health, unhappy love is sort of stress and stress is not healthy.
 
I feel what this all boils down to is the question what is real love?

After that I would say, obsession is not love, and yes that can lead to an unhealthy person.
 
This is me musing. I can't answer any more questions.. I'm just going to allow my thoughts to wander here and hope that someone can offer some information.

Yeah, really. What is the universal definition of love?
My mind switches gears so often.. I'm not in poetic mode now. I'm scoffing at love being divine and having anything to do with souls.
But I don't know much at all about the physiology of love.

Why do we love other people? What is the chemical reaction that bonds two people? My boyfriend said it's the first kiss that either makes or breaks love, something about tasting the other person and then.. chemical reaction..
Pharemones..
(I guess that's how it goes.)

So, our emotions are controlled by different lobes etc. of the brain.. and then figure a 'love' reaction is mostly/partly/I-have-no-idea-how- much triggered by your body chemistry + the other person's body chemistry...

yet at the same time it seems we can make choices about how to behave and feel and who to love.
 
We can think aloud here. I feel it more generally acceptable when one states one is rambling in a sense of the word. Shall I think aloud myself? Why not?

Having lived a "somewhat" sacrificial life of giving and doing without, I can relate easily to death of self; quite possibly not in its purity but moreso standing at the door and knocking. That can leave a spirit in between both worlds, in a sense. Love, in its purist form...to me...., has me to reflect on Matthew 25: 35-36, "For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat; I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink; I was a stranger, and ye took me in; naked, and ye clothed me; I was sick, and ye visited me; I was in prison, and ye came unto me." If you are Christian, please forgive me if this does not fit the actual meaning out of context. If you are not Christian, please know I am taking this out of context.
These verses touch deeply into the heart of love; the heart of God, if I may say so hoping not to offend anyone. It is asking a lot of most people to have a giving heart. So many people throughout time have been looking for handouts when they could be working line the streets, fed by empathy, compassion, love, and sometimes even guilt. Some people will try to cleanse themselves in giving to others. The act of giving or doing these things can mean nothing more than an act. It is the heart that matters mostly, though a mere act can and will feed or clothe someone. Turn it up a notch and ask yourself, "Would I give a naked person my only food and clothing?" To me, that is selfless love in purity. The real sense of self has not gone away or been left on some deserted island; quite the contrary. Acknowledging one's own needs makes it easy to acknowledge the needs of others. If I have come to the vision of self requiring love, it is much easier to understand others need love. One might choose a life of service to others, and many have lived their time on earth as such.
I feel we may come to a point when God may give freely to us to be more fully adaptable in life circumstances, giving of Himself to us in retrospect
of the nature our heart has taken on, offering one a life now impelled by one's own heart of love for our fellow humankind. People may want to see what one is going to do with one's life, but one may stand in between the ideal and the surreal; a foot in the door of the ideal with the subconscious remaining in both worlds. Is there, then, a decision to be made as where to stand, or is one standing where one should be standing all along? It may be a struggle within oneself, but it is not that much of a struggle to impose a choice, as such.
The offering of self may not be the same as the denial of self, so I would like to add the offering of oneself to be looked at instead of the denial of self. To offer self for others is a great manifestation of love, when offered because of concern for others rather than an external show. Loving oneself is a prerequisite of this; yet, loving of oneself takes a back seat and needs are sometimes overlooked, put aside, neglected, and often not thought about. When the needs of others are cojoined at one's feet in vision of life,
one's feet may actually disappear from vision of life. The great expectations of others regarding one's self can be so misunderstood. I liken it unto one waiting to see a miracle while not realizing they are watching one. True love, unabridged and without fault. Enough rambling for awhile.
I must rest a bit and remind all this is merely thinking aloud; both with the mind and the heart.
 
Evolution is a process, and its standards are often translatable to ethics and psychology.
Why is that?
and therefore we cannot say that an emotion is inherently unhealthy.
Unless it's healthy to be unhealthy maaaaan


Emotions can be destructive, but that is due to a perversion of the intended use and nature of the emotion.

What makes you so sure that there was an intended use for emotion the confidence is what I don't get.


I AM TRASHED LEAVE ME ALONE :m067:
 
I just want to say, can we stop with the self-deprecating comments please ?

It's quite unnecessary to say things like "I'm just rambling" or "I'm just musing"

We're all intuitive people here, and I've yet to come across a truly stupid, or worthless remark on this board. Whatever you say is something of worth to someone, so no need to add all the self-deprecating disclaimers.

:m177:
 
I just want to say, can we stop with the self-deprecating comments please ?

It's quite unnecessary to say things like "I'm just rambling" or "I'm just musing"

We're all intuitive people here, and I've yet to come across a truly stupid, or worthless remark on this board. Whatever you say is something of worth to someone, so no need to add all the self-deprecating disclaimers.

:m177:

I love you already u has gots to post more sirrah!
 
The offering of self may not be the same as the denial of self, so I would like to add the offering of oneself to be looked at instead of the denial of self. To offer self for others is a great manifestation of love, when offered because of concern for others rather than an external show.

This to me seems key. I fear many ideals force people of good intentions into places they may not be ready to stand. Christian ideal would indicate that one should sacrifice self, but I've come to think that this is not something one should force themselves into before it expresses itself naturally.

Denial of self seems an approach that could easily lead to a sense of cognitive dissonance. It does not seem a stance of acceptance, which I value, but rather a forcing of something before it has properly matured. In that forcing, perhaps the growth needed to authentically mature will not be given the nurturing it needs. I think honest and vulnerable offering of self with all the imperfections, insecurities, and still needed growth of the moment a far more valuable gift.

I think if one tries to deny self while their ego is still in need of attention, then their attempts at denial of self will only subvert their best intentions and grab that energy directed outward back into feeding the needs of ego. That satisfaction of ego may happen through external praise for the behavior choice, but also could happen without any external affirmation, and only through an internal sense of satisfaction for having done the "right" thing. To me, these indicate an expression that is not truly altruistic and denying of self, but rather one that is still in need of ego satisfaction.

Because of my growing perspective of the health in accepting where one stands, with the hope of growing beyond it perhaps, I share your value of offering of self over the value of denial of self. Ultimately my ideal would be for a natural falling away of sense of self and ego as the needs of that ego no longer demand to be satisfied.
 
Why is that?

Mainly because it's so hard to justify any other bases for ethics and psychology.

Unless it's healthy to be unhealthy maaaaan

Um, what?

What makes you so sure that there was an intended use for emotion the confidence is what I don't get.

Because if it were disadvantageous, we probably wouldn't have it. We can also see and imagine some of the advantages in action.


I've yet to come across a truly stupid, or worthless remark on this board.

Courtesy of the spammer slayers! :wink:
 
I just want to say, can we stop with the self-deprecating comments please ?

It's quite unnecessary to say things like "I'm just rambling" or "I'm just musing"

We're all intuitive people here, and I've yet to come across a truly stupid, or worthless remark on this board. Whatever you say is something of worth to someone, so no need to add all the self-deprecating disclaimers.

:m177:

Point taken and duly noted. I do find myself wanting to differenciate between a thought and something well-thought-out over time, though.

Thank you for your insight. Glad the monkey was available again for your proper use!
 
Denial of self seems an approach that could easily lead to a sense of cognitive dissonance. It does not seem a stance of acceptance, which I value, but rather a forcing of something before it has properly matured.

Because of my growing perspective of the health in accepting where one stands, with the hope of growing beyond it perhaps, I share your value of offering of self over the value of denial of self. Ultimately my ideal would be for a natural falling away of sense of self and ego as the needs of that ego no longer demand to be satisfied.

Please allow my taking parts of your insight for further review and comment. tovlo, I feel great insight in your words and more closely and clearly understand your stance regarding self.
There may be times in life when specific needs can once again be important for survival of self. Survival of self is important if one desires the continuation of servitude, so in my opinion one can step aside for a moment without the feelings of guilt and shame associated with denial of self when it is associated with rather the offering of one's self. I must review the Greek interlinear translations once again, it seems, with a much more matured sense of God, self, and others. This way allows growth to be a part of the manifestation of love, rather than an attempt to be something
defined so well earlier by Aeon as the "ideal" before growth.
 
I have this person whom I am very fond of. Trouble is, she's newly married. Interesting thing is, in that chart alt ctrl del posted, some of her positions are certainly in the toxic category.

I am likely not to see her for a while now and what I have to make sure is that I do not allow myself to ponder about her too much. I must keep up my other friendships and pursue my existing plans. Otherwise it WOULD be unhealthy. It is easier said than done though, I'm a dreamer and the temptation to stupefy in fluffy imaginations is certainly there. If any f those 'dreams' I have have any chance of coming true I must remain in the realm of the living in order to create a persona for myself which is attractive to others.

At first I questioned my questioning her marriage and though I may simply be indulging in wishful thinking. But it's become obvious to me now that she is marrying for at least some of the wrong reasons and every time I talk with her I am more and more convinced she deserves so much more. Pursuing someone who you fool yourself into thinking is unhappy is unhealthy. Keeping yourself busy and productive makes you into a strong shoulder to cry on if things for this someone do fall apart.

Its actually fairly obvious what is unhealthy and what is healthy in love - forcing yourself to stop delving into the unhealthy aspects is what is hard. But it is extremely important.
 
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