How People Go About Revealing Unpleasantries

G

grapefruit

Community Member
MBTI
infj
Enneagram
4w3
You know those people who have something unpleasant to tell you or need to talk about something you did wrong who start out asking about trivial things like your weekend or how you are doing? You know what is about to happen. You may not know exactly what they want to say, but you know it's bad, and in some situations you might know what's coming. However, the person keeps cheerfully rattling off questions about your weekend, your family, your social life and other irrelevant things, and then when you know you'll lose control and slap them across the face, they crack a few jokes, encouraging you to laugh along with them before you get chewed out. Afterword, you are so annoyed, not because they have rebuked you or given you unpleasant news, but because of the way they have treated the whole issue and continue on as if nothing has happened. Why do these people do this? Does it have to do with personality type? Are they trying to make the experience worse as a form of revenge or negative reenforcement, or do they have some other motivation? I'm just really confused because if I did that, which I don't think would be often, it would be to prolong the suffering of someone who had annoyed me, especially of someone who knew little of me except for my strong willed nature and what many outsider perceive to be unpredictable spurts of harshness. Also, how can I deal with people like the ones I have described above without telling them to stop wasting my time and cut to the chase before I invoke what many would consider to be revenge, but what I prefer to call creative reciprocation.
 
I think it's got something to do with people not understanding the "sandwich" concept of management/communication. "They" say that you should say something positive, voice the concern, and end with something positive. ie: Grapefruit, you did a great job with those spreadsheets last week. That saved me a lot of time. I am concerned that you're behind scheduling on completing the powerpoint for this afternoon's meeting. It's important that this goes well. Please let me know if you're going to need help with it. The concept for the presentation is quite innovative and I'm looking forward to seeing it.

It's not meant to be "pretend to care, chastise, casually dismiss" though so many do it that way.
 
Why don't they say something like, "I believe you understand that I am having a problem with your work performance. I'm concerned that your power point will not be completed in time for the meeting, so I really need for you to enlist what help you need to handle this to enable this meeting to run productively." I'm not saying that praise is bad, but it almost seems like in many cases, coupling it with something unpleasant makes it artificial and makes the unpleasantness more of a slap in the face. In most cases, I can tell when someone wants to talk to me because they have a problem, so I would prefer that he/she just put the problem out in the open rather than make things worse by making me wait to hear what he/she really wants to say.
 
Some managers (or people in general) do that. I only know that in the management courses I was taking at one point they emphasized the "sandwich" technique. It's a "cushion" affect that's supposed to "soften" the criticism. I don't like it either. There's always the "wait for it...any minute now...BAM!" of it because you know it's coming. I'm not sure if it's got anything to do with personality type since I'm an ESTJ and hate it too...
 
Is there a way to deal with it? I mean, you can't just say, "we both know you didn't call me in here to complement my sweater or so I could laugh at your stupid pencil sharpener joke, so let's just pretend that all of that happened, and I can spend the extra time correcting the problem." Maybe that's partly why I am so drawn to INTJs. They state the problem, express their displeasure that you are it's cause, and don't make a big deal over any emotional outburst you may have as a result. It is unavoidable that both methods will cause negative emotional reactions, but with this method the negative emotions wear off more quickly at least with me.
 
grapefruit said:
Is there a way to deal with it? I mean, you can't just say, "we both know you didn't call me in here to complement my sweater or so I could laugh at your stupid pencil sharpener joke, so let's just pretend that all of that happened, and I can spend the extra time correcting the problem." Maybe that's partly why I am so drawn to INTJs. They state the problem, express their displeasure that you are it's cause, and don't make a big deal over any emotional outburst you may have as a result. It is unavoidable that both methods will cause negative emotional reactions, but with this method the negative emotions wear off more quickly at least with me.
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What I would suggest is that at a point in time when you are not immediately in this situation, talk to this person. Preferably when you're both in relatively good moods, in as neutral an environment as can be had. Tell them something like "hey...you know how when I make a mistake (or whatever) you try to make me feel better by joking around? Well...it would make it easier for me to process the issue if you can just give me the guts of the situation. I think it would help me attack the problem more directly and efficiently...etc." I'd try to leave the word "feelings" out of it, because it tends to be seen as a weakness. Make it about them, and why it's better for them to not do it this way, at least in dealing with you. I hope this helps a little bit...
 
AKM said:
Some managers (or people in general) do that. I only know that in the management courses I was taking at one point they emphasized the "sandwich" technique. It's a "cushion" affect that's supposed to "soften" the criticism. I don't like it either. There's always the "wait for it...any minute now...BAM!" of it because you know it's coming. I'm not sure if it's got anything to do with personality type since I'm an ESTJ and hate it too...
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i learned to identify this technique at a very young age - i called it (and still do call it) the stroke/slap approach.
 
At my office we have a head teacher who isn't trained in management. He just says stuff like "Hey Lex Orandi, I didn't get that spreadsheet yesterday, could you get me that spreadsheet by the end of the day?" and I say, "Yeah, sure thing," and that's the end of it. I don't know why people get so upset about criticism--if you messed up and you get chastised, it's your fault. If you have to eat a crap sandwich because it's just your turn to get the short end of the stick, so be it.

I don't know why people get angry and want to shoot the messenger. Most of the time, your boss has to do unpleasant things because his boss is pressuring him. Of course, if your boss is unfair or rude, it's different, I guess.
 
I wasn't referring to a specific person. It's just people in general that do it, so in some cases, it will be hard to know when the situation will occur because I don't know who will do it or when someone will do it. Also, when people do this to me, I start to act defensive by not laughing or by furnishing general answers to their irrelevant questions, and they act all surprised. Why is that? Shouldn't they expect me to be annoyed and on edge when they have a problem, but won't tell me what it is? Does this happen to others, or am I just surrounded by people who behave strangely? Do most people prefer the sandwich effect or not care either way, while I feel so adversely toward it because I have unconventional desires and thought processes? I can usually understand human behavior. In fact, I disagree with the belief that emotions are illogical and unpredictable. This would be the case if one attempted to adopt a one size fits all approach, but with the knowledge that emotional response can be predicted based on factors like background, experiences, confidence level, and behavior patterns, one can use logic to determine a person's emotional reaction. There are so many factors that I can't name them all, but my brain knows what they are, and it makes note of them for each person and compiles them into detailed information without me realizing it. However, I can't understand the behavior of becoming surprised or annoyed at a person's defensiveness resulting from the prolonged manner in which another chooses to address a problem when both parties already have an awareness that the concern exists.
 
grapefruit said:
I wasn't referring to a specific person. It's just people in general that do it, so in some cases, it will be hard to know when the situation will occur because I don't know who will do it or when someone will do it. Also, when people do this to me, I start to act defensive by not laughing or by furnishing general answers to their irrelevant questions, and they act all surprised. Why is that? Shouldn't they expect me to be annoyed and on edge when they have a problem, but won't tell me what it is? Does this happen to others, or am I just surrounded by people who behave strangely? Do most people prefer the sandwich effect or not care either way, while I feel so adversely toward it because I have unconventional desires and thought processes? I can usually understand human behavior. In fact, I disagree with the belief that emotions are illogical and unpredictable. This would be the case if one attempted to adopt a one size fits all approach, but with the knowledge that emotional response can be predicted based on factors like background, experiences, confidence level, and behavior patterns, one can use logic to determine a person's emotional reaction. There are so many factors that I can't name them all, but my brain knows what they are, and it makes note of them for each person and compiles them into detailed information without me realizing it. However, I can't understand the behavior of becoming surprised or annoyed at a person's defensiveness resulting from the prolonged manner in which another chooses to address a problem when both parties already have an awareness that the concern exists.
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I guess my post was a little off topic. Yeah, this kind of thing annoys me a lot, but I usually just try to cut to the chase be giving them an opening. Like they'll ask "So uh, how was your weekend?" and I'll say "Oh, it was alright. Saw a movie and had some good Indian food. What's up?" Or, if I know the bad news they're going to drop, I'll instead end with "So, any news on the [insert topic here]?" That usually helps them avoid feeling uncomfortably and saves me from having to listen to their painfully awkward attempts at small talk.
 
Lex Orandi said:
I guess my post was a little off topic. Yeah, this kind of thing annoys me a lot, but I usually just try to cut to the chase be giving them an opening. Like they'll ask "So uh, how was your weekend?" and I'll say "Oh, it was alright. Saw a movie and had some good Indian food. What's up?" Or, if I know the bad news they're going to drop, I'll instead end with "So, any news on the [insert topic here]?" That usually helps them avoid feeling uncomfortably and saves me from having to listen to their painfully awkward attempts at small talk.
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Yes. Things like this work in more casual situations. Redirecting it to "What's up?" "How are things going?" etc. can help cut the small talk. I do that especially when people that I know but am not particularly close to approach me. My friends know better.
 
You could do that with friends. In fact, I often tell people to get to the point if they are not authority figures, but it is much more difficult to do this with an authority figure, or in a situation where a person has the need to pull you aside to discuss a problem. Maybe there is something wrong with me, but sometimes, I partly wish that the person would just let me have it in front of the group. It's odd, but I somehow think this would be better.
 
This is going to sound really blunt. I tend to go with a "don't get called in to begin with" plan and "yea, I screwed up so I should have to suffer through this" approaches.
 
It has been my experience that the whole "sandwich" process, or the unrelated pleasantries thing is more about the person delivering the criticism than about easing the blow to the recipient. Ego stroking always begins at home. (Jaded huh?)
 
Frenchguy said:
It has been my experience that the whole "sandwich" process, or the unrelated pleasantries thing is more about the person delivering the criticism than about easing the blow to the recipient. Ego stroking always begins at home. (Jaded huh?)
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I guess to naive people it would sound jaded. :P

I concur with this.
 
I react terribly to this and can usually feel it coming, at which point I say "say what you mean or nothing at all!", has never got me in trouble as it trumps their bullshit manoeuvre. I think it may be the obvious fake pleasantries that put me on edge so I have to stop it.
 
I'm pretty blunt when someone goes into that mode. And I think it's the artificiality and waste of time that irritates me. My reply is usually something like "Yeah, yeah, okay, okay... get to the point". This also happens when people need something from you and are hesitant to ask.
 
I like that way of looking at it. I usually try to do everything correctly unless I don't like the person, and would prefer to make things difficult for him/her as a means of creative reciprocation. I usually feel terrible when I do something wrong, and I think I would deserve to suffer if I made a mistake. However, I still admire people who can handle it in a decent manner. In a school or workplace it isn't about who deserves to suffer. It's about ensuring that people are as productive as possible, and studies show that suffering decreases productivity. In many cases, actually talking about what I did wrong and how to improve doesn't cause me to suffer, but it's the waiting and uncertainty, which results from awkward small talk that causes the wrong kind of discomfort, not discomfort that I have displeased someone, but discomfort that I can't understand what's wrong, and how the other person is interpreting the situation, and he/she is withholding information that could help me please him/her. Further, to insist on irrelevant small talk is one thing, but to expect cheerfulness and laughter from the person who knows he/she is about to be chastised is almost absurd.
 
Conflict avoidance.
And not from your side. :|

Of course, it may tell something about you; or at least how the person perceives you, but it depends on how often and to whom does the person uses the technique.

From my personal experience, quite a lot of people see my 'okay, tell me what's wrong and I'll get on it' as vengeful bitter bitchiness. That's surprising, but after the initial shock....I do have that tendency, alongside the original one. :|
So yeah.
 
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