Grit - The key to success?

[say what]

i think she was mainly saying that she thinks its possible for most kids to succeed at education and be enabled o proceed with their inspirations in life, that its not necessarily a matter of inherent ability. i heard that most university professors have iqs around 120, this is high but by no means stratospheric, if these people can obtain such high degrees of intellectual accomplishment it seems reasonable that kids can not fail at school. i dont think shes talking about making kids perfect, just helping them to meet educational objectives.

I agree!

It's interesting that you bring that up about uni profs! I was talking to my boss - who has her PhD and is the director of her department - about the video and said that I know so many faculty who have said "I don't know how I'm here- I'm not smart enough!" ...and she echoed the same thing! She said: My sister is far smarter than me and always did better in school than me. But I just trudged along and never gave up. But she gave up when it came to university, she just found it too hard- not intellectually hard, but difficult to maintain motivation. She should be where I am, because she's so much smart than I'll ever be.

This came from a woman who is brilliant in my eyes- and does profound work! But as she said, she has the grit that got her where she is - and while she's smart, there's many smarter people out there!

 

[Gaze]

i think she was mainly saying that she thinks its possible for most kids to succeed at education and be enabled o proceed with their inspirations in life, that its not necessarily a matter of inherent ability. i heard that most university professors have iqs around 120, this is high but by no means stratospheric, if these people can obtain such high degrees of intellectual accomplishment it seems reasonable that kids can not fail at school. i dont think shes talking about making kids perfect, just helping them to meet educational objectives.

Agree. That's the main message to take away from this video. I know this is also what [MENTION=10252]say what[/MENTION] mentioned was the reason why the video's message stood out.

 

[muir]

Sure the race doesn't go to the swiftest or the strongest or the smartest...it goes to the one who holds on the longest

But...i'll qualify that by saying that perhaps some kids aren't motivated by school because school is a heap of shit which bashes brains into a particular shape

So perhaps our society should adapt to recognise the importance of imagination as well as stickability

This makes me think of the scene in gattica where the brothers compete with each other. One was born naturally and flawed whislt the other was genetically manufactured to be the best he could be, but the flawed one proves the most determined; where does grit come from? Its a very personal thing

[video=youtube;yRynilqRXwI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRynilqRXwI[/video]

[video=youtube;oeJlaIc8Fs0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeJlaIc8Fs0[/video]

 

[Solongo]

To me grit is the ability to push through any situation and see it through til the end and it's synonymous with perseverance. I don't think it is an attitude but rather a psychological trait of people who are born fighters. Grit is always a requirement to accomplish anything worthwhile and also emphasizes goals that needs to be achieved and tests the individual on many levels; hence the person needs that extra grit to get through it's challenges. People who are no pushovers tend to exhibit this characteristics. Just on generalization; competitiveness, high ego drive and narcissism and overachievers all have some form of grit to accomplish the things they accomplish. It's like the saying you cannot beat a person who won't ever quit.

I also think introversion or extraversion don't have anything do with a person having grit. I think the biggest determining factor to know if a person has grit is through their past life experiences and how they handled it. It can say something about a person having grit. Grit is also not the same as having a high pride. Proud people can exhibit grit like behavior but that does not mean they can back it up. If you have grit than you have to back it up. I guess the rules of the wild jungle applies to humans in this case.

 

[invisible]

I think... we're all dead anyway so it's kind of silly to attach yourself to pointless goals. Sorry. I've been around a lot of dead/dying people lately (occupational hazard) and when I see people die with a 20+ year spread between their ages, it makes these silly little goals we set for ourselves all seem rather pointless in the end.

I've seen a former coal miner die at 90 and a Psychologist die in their mid 30's within a couple weeks of each other. I've seen brainless nitwits ride around on their 4 wheelers, happy as can be and while college graduates scrape the bottom of the occupational ladder to get by. Guess what happens in the end - they both die.

To me, the successful person was the one most content with their life, not the one making it the farthest. What we call success and the grit that makes it is all an illusion.

your work sounds highly stressful, but im sure you are very appreciated by the people you work with,

i read a book called "Tuesdays With Morrie" thats supposed to be about giving people perspective on what really matters in life, but all i thought after reading it was that it takes a different range of things for people who are engaged in processes of dying to be contented, than the range of things that it takes people who are engaged in processes of living to be contented.

i do believe in approaching my circumstances with joy, and i wish i could be contented with not having goals in my life, and not wanting to make the most of my circumstances to contribute what i can to this earth during my time on it, but unfortunately for me, no matter how hard i try, i continuously fail in identifying my goals as pointless...

 

[Deleted member 10171]

Just lost in my head - this thread made me think of a quote from a lecturer - she had addressed the whole class but I remember desperately wanting to write it down as I was deeply moved by the message behind it.

“It is easier to struggle through life when you come from a loving, caring family but it takes great strength [grit?] to come from a neglected and abused world of existence.”

 

[Lerxst]

Main point I'm trying to make, I suppose, is... be careful what you strive for. Since the person who started this is a grad student, I can reflect it on that.

I went through the enrollment and got accepted for a program a few years back. I had the loan in my hand and realized I could never afford to pay back a $200K+ student loan in the non-profit field that only paid abut $40k a year. Instead of spending the next 6 years of my life in the constant stress of earning a PhD and racking up a larger and larger debt, I simply just did the job at the lower grade without the ordeal of grad school and everything that went along with it.

Now that I work with seniors, I realize we all end up in the same place... dead. There's no discrimination when it comes to death; rich, poor, old, young, etc. In light of that, I can no longer understand why people spend so many years of their life struggling to get to the #1 position in what they do. Look at lawyers, they spend almost 24/7 working so they can afford to buy a few toys for the couple hours a week they don't work. You know how many people work for retirement only to die within a few years? My uncle died of the Flu a year after he retired.

Seems to me, the point of life should be to enjoy the ride, not worry about how far it goes!

 

[Gaze]

Main point I'm trying to make, I suppose, is... be careful what you strive for. Since the person who started this is a grad student, I can reflect it on that.

...

Seems to me, the point of life should be to enjoy the ride, not worry about how far it goes!

I appreciate your perspective and agree that what you put your grit into is almost as important than simply gritting through it. I'm also in grad school, and mid 30s. I know what' it's like to go through the uncertainty of choosing to pursue a grad degree. Many of us go back and forth wondering and questioning the decision, whether it's worth it. I am getting the final chance to finish my grad degree so I'm going to take it. I lacked confidence in my ability to complete this process before but for some reason, I've regained my love of what I am learning and that's driving me. For me, sticking it out didn't really matter until I reconnected with idea that I was studying something I loved and I've always enjoyed the learning process especially research in this field. So now I've rediscovered the right motives for doing it, it's now no longer about impressing anyone or showing what I can do. Rather, I'm doing it for myself as a self fulfilling goal. So, that's the motivating factor to keep me pushing forward. If I have the chance, God's willing, to complete this process, there will be a feeling of personal accomplishment because I saw it as a goal worth pursuing, not just something to simply get through. So, this is why grit alone is not enough. I think we need the right personal motivation to keep us going.

 

[say what]

Deeper Teaching, Deeper Learning​

Our consciousness is flooded with data, a great deal of which can be categorized as distraction or outright spam. Anxiety keeps us focused on the future; depression on the past. Mindfulness - our natural wisdom - rarely has a chance to manifest.

"Ellen Langer writes that perhaps one of the reasons that we become 'mindless' is the form of our early education. 'From kindergarten on' she writes 'the focus of schooling is usually goals rather than on the process by which they are achieved. This single-minded pursuit of one outcome or another, from tying shoelaces to getting into college, makes it difficult to have a mindful attitude toward life. Questions of "Can I?" or "What if I can't do it?" are likely to predominate, creating an anxious preoccupation with success or failure rather than on drawing on the child's natural, exuberant desire to explore.'"

Fortunately, contemplative practices are increasingly being introduced into all levels of the education system. It is possible, indeed foolish not to, intentionally cultivate our inherent natural wisdom.

"The (contemplative) exercises are relatively simple and mainly conducted in (students') own minds, relating directly to their personal experience discovered through attention and awareness, yet these private investigations yield increased empathy with others and a deeper sense of connection around them.

Formally legitimizing their experiences changes students' relationship to the material being covered. In much of formal education, students are actively dissuaded from finding themselves in what they are studying. All too often, students nervously ask whether they may use 'I' in their papers. A direct inquiry brought about through their introspection validates and deepens their understanding of both themselves and the material covered. In this way, students not only more richly understand the material, but they retain it more effectively since they have a personal context in which to frame it."

Barbezat, Daniel & Allison Pingree. (2012). Contemplative Pedagogy: The Special Role of Teaching and Learning Centers. In James E. Groccia and Laura Cruz (Eds.), To Improve the Academy, 31, 177-191. San Francisco, CA: Jossey-Bass.

I was reading this today and it made me think about this thread and 'grit'...personally, I see 'grit' and mindfulness to be very similar, and often are undervalued and under-fostered in education.

 

[say what]

Main point I'm trying to make, I suppose, is... be careful what you strive for. Since the person who started this is a grad student, I can reflect it on that.

I went through the enrollment and got accepted for a program a few years back. I had the loan in my hand and realized I could never afford to pay back a $200K+ student loan in the non-profit field that only paid abut $40k a year. Instead of spending the next 6 years of my life in the constant stress of earning a PhD and racking up a larger and larger debt, I simply just did the job at the lower grade without the ordeal of grad school and everything that went along with it.

Now that I work with seniors, I realize we all end up in the same place... dead. There's no discrimination when it comes to death; rich, poor, old, young, etc. In light of that, I can no longer understand why people spend so many years of their life struggling to get to the #1 position in what they do. Look at lawyers, they spend almost 24/7 working so they can afford to buy a few toys for the couple hours a week they don't work. You know how many people work for retirement only to die within a few years? My uncle died of the Flu a year after he retired.

Seems to me, the point of life should be to enjoy the ride, not worry about how far it goes!

...but I see this as the definition of grit. The formal and traditional path wasn't feasible, so instead of giving up- you created a path of your own, to get to the place you wanted to be. Yes there were sacrifices (you might not be in the exact position you wanted to be in), but it sounds like you're in the area you wanted to be in. Goals change, understandings of achieving goals are realized, and compromises are had...but that doesn't mean that by pursuing an alternative career path, that you gave up- it's the exact opposite. Giving up would be saying "hell..I'll just do this because I'll make more money or it's easier...but it has nothing to do with what I want to do"

Me being in grad school has nothing to do with this topic or it's implications. I could never afford grad school if I didn't work hard and squeeze every source of funding and job opportunity that I knew of. That's grit. Persevering in the face of obstacles. Yes, sometimes that perseverance is understanding that a goal might not be attainable, but grit is recognizing that, and adapting your goals to still attain the closest thing to it.

To not live your life just because you're going to die, is to toss away a great gift, and a great opportunity to make a difference - big or small, in this world. Additionally, being in the #1 position isn't the end goal for everyone...many people work towards a life of fulfilment and joy- and sometimes that's being #2 or even at the bottom. As I said, 'success' is both a personal subjective idea, and a larger societal objective idea. It's finding the balance between them, and being confident in in that balance.

 

[invisible]

this humble fool remains grandiose and idealistic