Feeling isolated | INFJ Forum

Feeling isolated

N

Nat

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Feb 2, 2009
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Do you guys ever feel that it is particularly difficult for INFJs to connect with other people in the romantic sense?

Maybe it's just me but because I have a lot of different interests and I'm kind to even strangers (the confidant parts are strong, I guess) I tend to get friend zoned a lot. People say I'm very attractive (I get told I look like the late Natalie Wood a lot) and they enjoy my company but they do not feel the spark necessary for a relationship or to even see me in a romantic light. Is it part of being reliable and well-mannered that plunges INFJs into the friend zone.

Lately, I feel that because of the dumbed down, porn culture environment the world has become, that people are viewing INFJs (who usually have a lot of depth) as downers or unfun because we're not exhibitionists. I feel that I'd have to become superficial, coquettish and vapid in order to spark a man's romantic interest in me. The more time I spend living alone and pursuing my own hobbies and building a world for myself as a single person, the harder it gets to connect with other people.

I dunno - maybe I'm just losing my mind. I was always bullied for being quiet like many INFJs are and people assume I'm a miserable bitch when i'm just thinking a lot and not noticing the expression on my face (we've had this discussion in other threads). I'm just really feeling the fact that we only make up 1.5% of the population more and more these days.

Can't connect with new people very well because they want instant knowledge of everything I'm about - instant gratification - and unless I put on a show, they're not going to hang around for me to warm up to them like I need to.

Anyone else have an observation?
 
quote:

Do you guys ever feel that it is particularly difficult for INFJs to connect with other people in the romantic sense?

Maybe it's just me but because I have a lot of different interests and I'm kind to even strangers (the confidant parts are strong, I guess) I tend to get friend zoned a lot. People say I'm very attractive (I get told I look like the late Natalie Wood a lot) and they enjoy my company but they do not feel the spark necessary for a relationship or to even see me in a romantic light. Is it part of being reliable and well-mannered that plunges INFJs into the friend zone.

Lately, I feel that because of the dumbed down, porn culture environment the world has become, that people are viewing INFJs (who usually have a lot of depth) as downers or unfun because we're not exhibitionists. I feel that I'd have to become superficial, coquettish and vapid in order to spark a man's romantic interest in me. The more time I spend living alone and pursuing my own hobbies and building a world for myself as a single person, the harder it gets to connect with other people.

unquote

same for me here except that I'm a guy :D
but the thing is, I seem to be viewed as an Exxx. 'Cos I'm mostly seen as outgoing and crazy. But thats only that side of me. Few people see the "real" me.

lately I've also begun finding it hard to connect with people. Mostly my classmates. To them I'm this crazy unpredictable dude that can be called on for help in physical labour and thats about it. I dont intend to change their view of me on that though. For they can be said to be affected by the dumbed down, porn culture that you are talking about. I really cant stand talking to them too much and if I have to, the introvert side of me just appears and I just walk away most of the time. However, I also have friends that are able to talk to me on a deeper level and these are the friends I intend to keep. The rest, if lost, honestly wont really matter too much as I refuse to allow myself to get too close to them anyway. But those I'm close to, I will die if I lose them. Probably will take months to recover.
 
Nat said:
Do you guys ever feel that it is particularly difficult for INFJs to connect with other people in the romantic sense?

Maybe it's just me but because I have a lot of different interests and I'm kind to even strangers (the confidant parts are strong, I guess) I tend to get friend zoned a lot. People say I'm very attractive (I get told I look like the late Natalie Wood a lot) and they enjoy my company but they do not feel the spark necessary for a relationship or to even see me in a romantic light. Is it part of being reliable and well-mannered that plunges INFJs into the friend zone.

Lately, I feel that because of the dumbed down, porn culture environment the world has become, that people are viewing INFJs (who usually have a lot of depth) as downers or unfun because we're not exhibitionists. I feel that I'd have to become superficial, coquettish and vapid in order to spark a man's romantic interest in me. The more time I spend living alone and pursuing my own hobbies and building a world for myself as a single person, the harder it gets to connect with other people.

I dunno - maybe I'm just losing my mind. I was always bullied for being quiet like many INFJs are and people assume I'm a miserable bitch when i'm just thinking a lot and not noticing the expression on my face (we've had this discussion in other threads). I'm just really feeling the fact that we only make up 1.5% of the population more and more these days.

Can't connect with new people very well because they want instant knowledge of everything I'm about - instant gratification - and unless I put on a show, they're not going to hang around for me to warm up to them like I need to.

Anyone else have an observation?
Click to expand...

Yes. You need to date an ENTP guy 11 years your junior. You're in your sexual peak, so is he. He'll understand that you don't need to show emotions to have them, and won't consider you unfun because you like to read.
 
You are who you are. You're great just as you are. It's just a shame that the world is dominated by people who don't see or appreciate that. It doesn't mean you should try to change to fit in. Sure you could create a persona they would 'like' more, but it wouldn't be you - so neither party would be gaining anything real from that. I can only recommend being yourself and working on being happy, peaceful, content etc as the person you are already. Try not to torment yourself by spending too much time around the people you can't connect with. Enjoy your own company, first and foremost, and aim to attract people on your own wavelength. Sure there are fewer of them - far fewer, but that's better in a way. Let's call the process of finding them 'quality control'.

About the friend zone thing specifically, well it's their loss. If they can't see your qualities for what they're worth, or are looking for shallow pleasures you can't offer, then I guess you wouldn't really be interested in them anyway..? There are nice, friendly, deep feeling, lovely people out there. Be hopeful! :)
 
Nat said:
Do you guys ever feel that it is particularly difficult for INFJs to connect with other people in the romantic sense?

Maybe it's just me but because I have a lot of different interests and I'm kind to even strangers (the confidant parts are strong, I guess) I tend to get friend zoned a lot. People say I'm very attractive (I get told I look like the late Natalie Wood a lot) and they enjoy my company but they do not feel the spark necessary for a relationship or to even see me in a romantic light. Is it part of being reliable and well-mannered that plunges INFJs into the friend zone.

Lately, I feel that because of the dumbed down, porn culture environment the world has become, that people are viewing INFJs (who usually have a lot of depth) as downers or unfun because we're not exhibitionists. I feel that I'd have to become superficial, coquettish and vapid in order to spark a man's romantic interest in me. The more time I spend living alone and pursuing my own hobbies and building a world for myself as a single person, the harder it gets to connect with other people.

I dunno - maybe I'm just losing my mind. I was always bullied for being quiet like many INFJs are and people assume I'm a miserable bitch when i'm just thinking a lot and not noticing the expression on my face (we've had this discussion in other threads). I'm just really feeling the fact that we only make up 1.5% of the population more and more these days.

Can't connect with new people very well because they want instant knowledge of everything I'm about - instant gratification - and unless I put on a show, they're not going to hang around for me to warm up to them like I need to.

Anyone else have an observation?
Click to expand...

I have an observation.

My observation is that I'm in the same place as you, it seems, or very similarly. Mine is just currently compounded by the fact I'm also severely depressed from losing someone who felt to be my 'soul mate,' and it could be for some of these reasons. Worse yet, I deal with what feels like ESP every single day and this I don't use it as bragging rights -- it's actually very isolating.

When I was 12, I had a sudden epiphany late at night that I wouldn't have anyone in my life by the time I was truly an adult. Here I sit, and without a single deep connection. It's those deep connections I need, and it's those that seem completely impossible to achieve. I had it with my ex more than anyone else, but he's since run off, saying he didn't want it anymore for only various possible reasons.

I live with my best friend of eight years but we just don't connect on that deep level, either, because I believe it takes a specific kind of emotional awareness for it to happen. My problem is not that I don't connect, however, it's that others don't seem to be capable of it. There inlies my problem, and I have no idea how to get around it.

Further, I'm not quite as luck as you with looks. But, truth be told, it's the presence of a person that belies their depth, whether people are aware of it or not.
I believe that most INFJs sit pretty well on the autistic spectrum, even if it's at the lower end, and thus have a problem with connecting and presenting themselves in a way the normal population accepts or finds appealing. Really, there's nothing wrong with that. But I imagine that it's more like two different species trying to interact -- coexistence on a superficial level is not so hard, but trying to get them to breed is sometimes another story. The 'languages' don't mix. INFJs might not be terribly good flirts, and thus not give the obvious signals of, "I really want to test you out as a mate". That's just an example.

This is just pure speculation, of course.

Another, simpler way to look at it is that most people find those women filling occupations such as school teachers, librarians, or something seemingly intellectual, to be completely 'unsexual,' and have an immediate reaction that, to me, speaks of 'Ew. Mom.'

So, that said, I often find I have a mom complex. I'm caring, often too controlling, seemingly all-knowing to most people, and that, combined with my age and self projection, puts me in the adult position of a mother, I think. This is not going to be inherently attractive, I'm sure, and if it was, that may be a worry.

I don't really have an answer for a cure, except to work on more colloquial techniques that bring us down a few notches first. But, is that desirable? I don't know. I figure, if I'm going to find another 'soul mate,' should one exist, I can only put myself forward and hope to find him in the mess. If we click on a deep level, I think it'll be immediately evident to both of us in some way.
 
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integrity is important for me and i find it is also so for many INFJs. Nat, i completely agree with you when you say that because of the current culture, superficiality, although lacking in depth and sincerity, has become such a part of the dating world that it has obscured the value of a true relationship. in the past, i've found relationships can be easily begun when i buy into the exhibitionist approach, however, this route is ultimately unfulfilling and will cause insurmountable pain if taken seriously. i don't like to enter a relationship if it is not serious for both the other person and myself and so it is also exhausting if i am to pretend to want instant gratification in order to make the relationship work or in hopes of changing it for the better.
there are people out there who do value depth and sincerity. unfortunately, i find them to be getting fewer and further between to the extent that i've stopped looking for anyone at all.
as for the friend zone, i don't usually find myself plunged into it. what i can say is that once i consider someone as a friend, even if they become interested in me, it is unlikely i'd see them in a romantic light. however, if we're merely acquainted then there is potential.
 
I find that because I'm an INFJ, I'm good at caring for other people and making them feel comfortable. That is, I'm good at friendship and for that reason, they don't feel the spark or requisite romantic tension and then don't see me as a romantic prospect. I eventually feel resentful if I'm attracted to them, we have a lot in common, they tell me I'm attractive but they don't want to date me, and then I end the friendship because it hurts too much.

I, too, am not interested in romantic relationships if they are not serious. Last year, a guy I thoiught was a good friend reverted from dating me (I thought he was interested in seeing if we could turn into something serious) to casual and not being exclusive (without telling me of course - I found out that he was dating another girl on Facebook) and I just walked away immediately and haven't spoken to him since. I'm still angry and insulted. I need meaning - I don't do objectification.

He also once said to me that I was "too intelligent" - like it was a flaw. How can someone be too intelligent? It seems that men love girls who are fluffy, bubbly, into cheap sex and vapid giggling at things that are not funny - that's not what I run on - I thrive on witty banter, dry humour, books, movie and substance.

Current social climate makes me feel like a leper.
 
Nat said:
He also once said to me that I was "too intelligent" - like it was a flaw. How can someone be too intelligent? It seems that men love girls who are fluffy, bubbly, into cheap sex and vapid giggling at things that are not funny - that's not what I run on - I thrive on witty banter, dry humour, books, movie and substance.

Current social climate makes me feel like a leper.
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The kinda guys who like girls like you described, ain't got much goin on upstairs and the only reason they like girls who aren't intelligent is because they know that they themselves don't have much to offer.Why bother wasting your time on guys like that? It is true that intelligent people have a much more difficult time dating..
 
Nat said:
He also once said to me that I was "too intelligent" - like it was a flaw. How can someone be too intelligent? It seems that men love girls who are fluffy, bubbly, into cheap sex and vapid giggling at things that are not funny - that's not what I run on - I thrive on witty banter, dry humour, books, movie and substance.

Current social climate makes me feel like a leper.
Click to expand...


This needs to be a poll question. How many INFX woman have been told that they were too intelligent by a man?

::raises hand::

Why do men want dumb girls? I just don't get it. I rather be alone than with someone stupid. What do you talk about with stupid girls? I'm going to find a man who is dumb as a box of hair and have my way with him for research purposes. Because there's something someone isn't telling me.
 
Bored Now said:
This needs to be a poll question. How many INFX woman have been told that they were too intelligent by a man?

::raises hand::

Why do men want dumb girls? I just don't get it. I rather be alone than with someone stupid. What do you talk about with stupid girls? I'm going to find a man who is dumb as a box of hair and have my way with him for research purposes. Because there's something someone isn't telling me.
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Call me a snob.. But I don't even converse with a guy unless he's as intelligent, and socially as well as self aware as I am.. I hesitate to say this, but people who don't have much goin' on upstairs and who could care less about any ideas outside of Monday Night Football and tanorexic anti-feministas seem like human cardboard boxes to me. Not that I despise them, but yes. I'd rather enjoy the company of my own thoughts than to hang with a buncha dudes who are only interested in objectifying. Cuz times they are changin'!
 
alt ctrl del said:
Call me a snob.. But I don't even converse with a guy unless he's as intelligent, and socially as well as self aware as I am.. I hesitate to say this, but people who don't have much goin' on upstairs and who could care less about any ideas outside of Monday Night Football and tanorexic anti-feministas seem like human cardboard boxes to me. Not that I despise them, but yes. I'd rather enjoy the company of my own thoughts than to hang with a buncha dudes who are only interested in objectifying. Cuz times they are changin'!
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Yeah, this, particularly the first bit of what you said. And that's really hard to find, it seems.
 
Here's the kicker though. One of the guys who said this was a damned physicist! He wasn't dumb in the slightest. He spoke three languages and he went to NYU for god's sake. He said something about dumb women being easier to "handle"... I don't even talk to dumb guys. These are otherwise intelligent men spouting this garbage.... I'm so glad I'm not single. Dating was HELL.
 
Yeah, someone make the "too intelligent" thing a poll question. I have never got either and neither have my friends.

What do the other types of girls talk about that keeps the guys enthralled?

You have stuff in common with guys, like you're interested in politics, current affairs, sport, philosophy and like ideas and learning (I find it nourishing/enriching) and it immediately makes you boring and de-sexualises you in their eyes. You can laugh about these sorts of issues too while discussing them.

On the other hand, I'm not intense either - I read books, I read the paper, I talk about gender relations, I talk about government policies, but equally, I talk about Brangelina and what motivates their adoptions, whose dress I liked at the Oscars and who will win on Survivor.

It seems like men correlate "intelligent" with "difficult" or "disagreeable". I would've thought that a smart woman actually makes a guy's life easier - she doesn't rely on him for every little thing and is less dependent socially. She also brings in her own contribution financially.

I would be extremely irritated to be around someone who didn't know anything about the world outside of themselves and their own experiences.

OK - Rant over. Back to work.

But I do think about this...A LOT...
 
Nat said:
Lately, I feel that because of the dumbed down, porn culture environment the world has become, that people are viewing INFJs (who usually have a lot of depth) as downers or unfun because we're not exhibitionists. I feel that I'd have to become superficial, coquettish and vapid in order to spark a man's romantic interest in me. The more time I spend living alone and pursuing my own hobbies and building a world for myself as a single person, the harder it gets to connect with other people.
Click to expand...

Same here. Except that I'm a guy.

Another difference is that.. well all the girls I meet are not interested in someone who is "serious" like me. They tend to fall for the blokes with charm and humour but little depth.
So I think its not only men who are effected by the "dumbed down culture".
 
Bored Now said:
Here's the kicker though. One of the guys who said this was a damned physicist! He wasn't dumb in the slightest. He spoke three languages and he went to NYU for god's sake. He said something about dumb women being easier to "handle"... I don't even talk to dumb guys. These are otherwise intelligent men spouting this garbage.... I'm so glad I'm not single. Dating was HELL.
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He musta felt he had nothing to offer other than his wang.
 
Bored Now said:
Here's the kicker though. One of the guys who said this was a damned physicist! He wasn't dumb in the slightest. He spoke three languages and he went to NYU for god's sake. He said something about dumb women being easier to "handle"... I don't even talk to dumb guys. These are otherwise intelligent men spouting this garbage.... I'm so glad I'm not single. Dating was HELL.
Click to expand...

A lot of people who specialize in these areas 'suffer' from Asperger's or other autism. Basically, that means they're intelligent in the sense they can figure out things, but that doesn't mean they have the same intelligence figuring out people -- that takes emotions, and sometimes IQ and EQ don't match up.
 
I would sooner have one meaningful romantic relationship than a thousand meaningless ones. Anything worth having is worth the patience and work it takes to obtain it.
 
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