Examining the Hate | INFJ Forum

Examining the Hate

Discussion in 'Psychology and MBTI' started by Satya, Jul 29, 2008.

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  1. Satya

    Satya C'est la vie
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    Hate is a simple emotion. It can be defined as simply an "intense dislike" or "aversion". However, what is unclear is the actual nature of hatred. A quick trip to wiki yields these ideas.

    Hate is an awareness that something is bad, combined with an urge to withdraw from it. -Rene Descartes

    However, the flaw in this reasoning is that sometimes people are perfectly aware that what they hate is not always bad. Also, many people who hate seek out what they hate and confront it as opposed to withdrawing from it.

    Hate is the desire for the annihilation of an object that is incurable by time -Aristotle

    The flaw in this logic should be apparent. We don't always want what we hate to be annihilated. We often recognize that what we hate serves a purpose to others, even if it does not serve a purpose to us.

    Hate is a type of pain that is due to an external cause -Baruch Spinoza

    This is a strong possibility. However, if the environment infuses hate in us, then we can claim that we often don't have a choice when it comes to what we hate.

    Hate is an ego state that wishes to destroy the source of its unhappiness -Freud

    As much as I hate to agree with Freud, I have to say this is a pretty logical definition. Hate seems to always be tied into some aspect of our identity, and therefore is an "ego state". It also does seem that whatever is deemed a threat to our happiness or well being is the focus of our hatred.

    However, like other emotions, hatred can turn into an enduring attitude or disposition rather than a simple emotional state. We have names for when this happens to other emotions...

    Love - Euphoria
    Sadness - Depression
    Anger - Hostility

    But for some reason, we don't have such a word for hatred. And hatred is also easily confounded by other emotions such as anger and disgust.

    What is clear is that hatred takes on many forms. It can be toward any person, object, or group.

    However, the purpose of this thread is to examine hatred, whether its our own or others, and to determine what sparks it and whether it can be removed. I invite anyone to jump in, but I'll probably be using this thread to explore a wide variety of hatred. I think it is important, considering that I am aiming to be a social worker, to understand my own prejudices and biases, and to find a way to calmly confront those of others.
     
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    Satya

    Satya C'est la vie
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    My Critical Thinking Model:

    1. Define
    2. Comprehend
    3. Analyze
    4. Apply
    5. Evaluate

    First personal bias

    1. I hate traditional Christianity.
    2. I feel that traditional Christianity is bad and I have an immediate urge to withdraw from it. I have no desire to annihilate traditional Christianity as I do believe it serves a purpose in some people's lives. I believe traditional Christianity has caused me much pain in my life by filling me with guilt and shame for things I do not have any control over, for making me feel as if I am inferior or sick in comparison to other human beings, for making me feel like I don't deserve the same things as everyone else, for filling me with doubt for what I can expect from life, and for making me feel like I would have to be separate from God if I choose to be who I am rather than choose to be unhappy for the rest of my life. I feel that traditional Christianity is a threat to my happiness because it attacks my identity.
    3. I do not think that traditional Christianity is bad for everyone. If it was, then nobody would willingly partake in it. I think the reason it is bad for me is because it conflicts with my homosexual identity. I do not think that most traditional Christians realize how their choices affect me and many simply do not care because they firmly believe that I have the capacity to choose to be like them. Even those who acknowledge that I can't choose to be like them will choose to see my suffering as a test and will require me to live my life in accordance with their values. I believe they do so with the best of intentions, because they are more concerned with my eternal happiness than my mortal happiness. I think they see the negative feelings their actions invoke in me as proof that they are right and that I am not on the right path. I think the traditional Christians who make values judgments that homosexuals are "sick" or "inferior" are demonstrating their own hatred and are also turning their backs on their own religion.
    I believe that many of the values and ideas inherent in traditional Christianity are indeed good, and I have to acknowledge that every individual Christian is entitled to their own interpretation of the Bible. I think when it comes to what rights I deserve, I have to acknowledge that traditional Christians also feel like their values and identities are threatened when I aim to marry or adopt. I have to realize that they choose to interpret the Bible in a way that condemns who I am, and that choice may have even been socialized into them from childhood and is therefore very unlikely to change. I have to acknowledge that many traditional Christians perceive homosexuality as a threat, something that is bad, something that should be annihilated, something that causes them pain and discomfort, and something that is a threat to their identity and therefore they are hateful of it. I have to acknowledge that it is okay for traditional Christians to demonstrate hatred for homosexuality even if it conflicts with their ideology because traditional Christians are fallible human beings just like anybody else.
    4. I think it is important for me to live my life the way I feel I was meant to live it. I think if I do not wish to perpetuate the cycle of hatred then I need to learn to love traditional Christians as I love myself. That means that I should always remember that they are fallible and imperfect, just as I am, and that we are all just doing the best we can with what we have. In that way, I believe I can alleviate my hatred of traditional Christianity.

    Second personal bias

    1. I hate Neo Conservatives and Neo Liberals.
    2. I feel that those political ideologies are bad and have a desire to withdraw from them. I do have a desire to annihilate Neo Conservatism and Neoliberalism from the planet. I do not think that Neo Conservatism or Neoliberalism have caused me much pain in my life aside from spouting narrow minded ideas and beliefs. I am a classical liberal, so I do perceive these ideologies are a threat to my happiness and an attack to my identity.
    3. In short, much of what I said about traditional Christianity also applies here. People choose to interpret the world the way they want or the way they were raised to interpret it. People have a right to have different values. Those who spout narrowminded ideas are simply demonstrating the weaknesses inherent in their ideology and every ideology has such people. They are also imperfect, and as such, are allowed to hate my ideology since they are threatened by it.
    4. I think it is important for me to remain relative when it comes to divisive beliefs. As long as I remember that people usually have the best of intentions or are demonstrating their very human fears and hatred, then I really can't hate them. To do so would be no different than hating myself.
     
  3. Kwistalline

    Kwistalline Permanent Fixture

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    Poor Freud! No one likes him. . . I have great respect for Freud. I’m just disappointed that he allowed drug abuse to destroy and distort his potential (I truly believe this. Yes, I know, I’m insane).

    But I also agree this is an accurate description for hate. It is a strong aversion to something that threatens us, and aversion so strong it cannot help but manifest outwardly. True hatred is like radiation. It must release, it must vent, eventually. And it poisons those around it.

    Oy, sorry, back to topic. Waxing philosophic is my gift. Although, radiation being what it is, a sign of molecular decay, is not far off. I think perhaps it was you that said this, Satya, I don’t remember, but someone once said that hate and love were a part of the same emotion. If this is the case, then hatred is love decayed. The degeneration of love, it’s death.

    That may be because hatred is the end result of dislike.

    Perhaps this is not appropriate, and it may not mean anything to you, but do you have a good support group for when you are emotionally burdened? Then again, you may be emotionally stronger than I am. I could not handle social work. My heart dies daily as it is. To see people’s live s outside of the hospital may be more than I can bear. You are very strong. I guess I’m trying to say that I’d like it to stay that way.
    That seems acceptable. I mean, the adjective. “traditional” Christianity, in general, isn’t something I am altogether fond of, either. Not that I’ve received the same kind of censureship, but I’ve had bad experiences.

    That would seem illogical to me! But you’re right! I know so many who are like this “they really feel guilty” or whatever. I don’t mess with this mentality. Anyone who cannot see that feelings and logic are not directly related cannot be spoken to. I am often thought of as being “less rational” in the first place, so I rarely attempt to correct this flaw.

    For example, the right person could make me feel directly responsible for 9/11. My logic knows this is ridiculous. My emotional side, however, is horrified and distraught that I have somehow offended and hurt another, and I react on that feeling with enormous quantities of guilt.

    Agreed.

    Fallible, yes. Acceptable? Absolutely not. No such behaviour should be acceptable. No one has the right to treat you like you are a lesser being. Disagree with you, yes, believe you are wrong, yes. But to actually treat you with contempt and abhorrence is something worth hating.

    There is very little that I actually hate. Such abominable behaviour, especially from those of my own faith, is something that I hate. And also something I feel worth fighting against.

    How have you handled conflicts with Christians in the past? I’m just wondering. I’ve met a few homosexuals, in fact, one of my supervisors was gay, and his significant other worked the floor with me. I still miss him, sometimes. We never talked religion, for which I am actually greatful. I figured he’d already dealt with the dark side of Christianity. He never quite treated me the same when he found out my father was a minister. Made me sad, but I understood why.

    Loving those you hate seems to be the best resolution. I do not believe that love and hate are the same emotion, exactly. I do believe that hate destroys love and vica versa. But love takes longer to work, and therein lies the frustration.

    Perhaps. I am usually very cautious. Hatred is volatile. To use, then, an aggressive means of dealing with it, would be unwise. It must be handled gently, calmly, and lovingly. It requires much sacrifice of oneself. Sacrifice of time, sacrifice of image and reputation (in some cases), sacrifice of your own personal bias for a greater goal.

    My own experience with hate is not grand, by any means.

    When I was younger, I hated my mother. She remains much as she was: illogical, swayed and moved constantly by temporal emotions, no one emotion remaining consistent. I was her little black sheep. Still am, I think. I never did what she wanted, and was always being punished for it. Very much a martyr child. I wasn’t the only one, granted, but she does, to this day, remind me that I was the only one who “never did listen”. It was frustrating to no end, trying to please someone who never knew what they wanted. I truly hated her.

    When I moved to college, I was able to gain perspective, removed from the situation. I saw how my paternal Grandmother treated her (my whole family lives in the same small town). I realized that she had no friends, no support whatsoever except my father, an emotionally repressed ISTP. At first I felt pity, but that was quickly replaced with compassion. I’ve tried, since then, to encourage her. We’ll never be great friends (she is exhausting), but at least I can now accept her as my mother and a fallible human being.

    I still struggle with my aversion towards men. I’m not a lesbian, not by a long shot, but I cannot trust men. Any man who showed interest in me was verbally attacked. Another gift of mine: when I feel threatened, I have a bitter and beautiful two edged tongue. It is not hard for me, when I am not in control of myself, to emotionally mutilate those around me.

    That is a great improvement from what it was several years ago. It has been hard, learning to give up my hatred for the opposite sex, but it was wrong and unfair of me to judge all men for the sins of a few. But how great were their transgressions! I’ve lost one sister already, and begin to lose the other. But I cannot blame all of mankind. I can only blame the men involved, and acknowledge that my sisters were not completely without blame for their own demise.

    I wonder, sometimes, about people who thrive on hate. Without their hate, they would be empty, hollow shells. Those who have lived on hate, if it were removed, would have nothing left. No personality, no other interests. In short, it is their life, who they are. It has transcended mere comfort. It is the essence of their existence. It was almost the essence of mine.

    Life is too short to waste it wishing the worst on others. I can only control how I choose to approach my life. Nothing else. And I choose to live it loving others, regardless of how they feel for me.
     
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    Satya

    Satya C'est la vie
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    Love others regardless of how they feel about you eh? Dogma aside, I suppose that is ultimately what it means to be a Christian.

    As far as whether I can cut it as a social worker, only time can tell. As I am now, probably not. I need to evolve. But I have one strength, and that is I know what it means to face adversity.
     
  5. gokartride

    gokartride Community Member

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    St. Francis of Assisi said, "Love your neighbor as yourself...but if you cannot love your neighbor as yourself, at least don't do them any harm." I think this little practical advise if great because many of us stuggle with the absolutes of love and forgiveness. For most of us it's nice to have a backup plan just in case our higher selves aren't quite up to the task.

    Here is another thought I've always liked from first century writing, the Didache: "you shall not hate any man; but some you shall reprove, some you shall pray for, and some you shall love more than your own life." I like this as it offers some options as we reject hatred even if love seems hard to come by.

    Anyway, let me say that typical "church culture" is pretty whacked out right now and even in my own church, many who consider themselves "traditional" are doing so only because they feel safer with a very narrow, protected, black & white view...they are scared and it is a pity. Strictly speaking, if one wanted to be "traditional", they'd do better to go back 1200 or 1500 years rather than 200!! They'd come out far better.

    I myself live on the more marginalized fringe of my own chosen Christian congregation, too...I can be happy here only because our traditions are extremely broad and diverse so I know I am on solid ground in spite of popular/contemporary rhetoric on the subject. That rhetoric can be unnerving, though.
     
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