Country Stereotypes

[philostam]

I was thinking recently about different countries with regards to cognitive functions. I based my thoughts on personal observation (travels), culture (writers and artists from the country), attitudes of the people I met, atmosphere/spirit/climate of the country, architecture etc. As such, this is all very subjective and unscientific, but I thought it can be fun.

Russia: strikes me as Ni-Se country. Serious, contemplative, pragmatic, proud. There is something about it's vastness that seems suited to Ni contemplation.

Poland: similar to Russia, but perhaps even a bit more tragic. Definitely introverted, but more Fi than Ni, I would say. Most Polish people I met were NFPs.

France: strikes me as Ne-Si axis. Democratic and interested in the 'common good'. People on average seem casual, artistic, agreeable, not so business oriented etc. @Ren?

Spain: Similar to France, but hard to say. Quite extroverted. Probably Ne-Si axis.

Switzerland: Si.

England: No idea, but I am leaning more towards Ne-Si axis. English people strike me as quite emotional, proud and social. Seem to value humor ("banter") a lot. But there is a lot of variance here. It's both very business oriented, but also artistic (musical centre of the world).

Germany: like England, seems hard to pin. Quite well rounded.

USA: Too diverse, probably depends on individual states. I was never there.

China: definitely Si-Ne axis.

You can add yours or correct me where you disagree. I forgot loads of countries, but I tried to limit myself to places I visited or interacted with in any other way.

 

[John K]

I was thinking recently about different countries with regards to cognitive functions. I based my thoughts on personal observation (travels), culture (writers and artists from the country), attitudes of the people I met, atmosphere/spirit/climate of the country, architecture etc. As such, this is all very subjective and unscientific, but I thought it can be fun.

Russia: strikes me as Ni-Se country. Serious, contemplative, pragmatic, proud. There is something about it's vastness that seems suited to Ni contemplation.

Poland: similar to Russia, but perhaps even a bit more tragic. Definitely introverted, but more Fi than Ni, I would say. Most Polish people I met were NFPs.

France: strikes me as Ne-Si axis. Democratic and interested in the 'common good'. People on average seem casual, artistic, agreeable, not so business oriented etc. @Ren?

Spain: Similar to France, but hard to say. Quite extroverted. Probably Ne-Si axis.

Switzerland: Si.

England: No idea, but I am leaning more towards Ne-Si axis. English people strike me as quite emotional, proud and social. Seem to value humor ("banter") a lot. But there is a lot of variance here. It's both very business oriented, but also artistic (musical centre of the world).

Germany: like England, seems hard to pin. Quite well rounded.

USA: Too diverse, probably depends on individual states. I was never there.

China: definitely Si-Ne axis.

You can add yours or correct me where you disagree. I forgot loads of countries, but I tried to limit myself to places I visited or interacted with in any other way.

It’s hard to simplify this from within a country both because you see the ramifications and because your impressions lack objectivity. There is a lot of xSxP in England, and a lot of INxx. The balance is rather different in the Celtic nations within the UK and they have more IxFx than the English. There’s nothing definite though because many folks, like myself, are rooted in both Celtic and Anglo-Saxon ancestry.

The Irish had a lot of Fi when I was a youngster - symbiotic with their religions. Not sure if this is still the case after 1.5 generations of emancipation from the priests and ministers.

 

[philostam]

It’s hard to simplify this from within a country both because you see the ramifications and because your impressions lack objectivity. There is a lot of xSxP in England, and a lot of INxx. The balance is rather different in the Celtic nations within the UK and they have more IxFx than the English. There’s nothing definite though because many folks, like myself, are rooted in both Celtic and Anglo-Saxon ancestry.

Yeah, I'd really love to explore this topic in more objective manner. I'm very interested in the spirit of nations, and how it was shaped by religion, history, geography etc.

But yeah, UK is definitely a very diverse place. How would you describe the English 'spirit'?

The Irish had a lot of Fi when I was a youngster - symbiotic with their religions. Not sure if this is still the case after 1.5 generations of emancipation from the priests and ministers.

I think @Ren said that Fi is still quite overwhelmingly apparent in Ireland.

 

[John K]

But yeah, UK is definitely a very diverse place. How would you describe the English 'spirit'?

This is very hard to do because there isn't a single English spirit, and maybe never has been. Maybe the closest we got to it was as the 'Dowry of Mary' in pre-Reformation times, but that has long gone and is overpainted with very many other layers since then. I think we have been totally ambiguous since the 16th Century. We're a mongrel country culturally these days, but I think this was true even in the days of the British Empire. The English working class have always been totally different from the upper classes in terms of type ever since the 18th Century at least - working class P, upper class J, but all the dominant folks very S in outlook apart from the visionary opinion leaders in every class who were N. It might seem that things are different these days because we have so many people here from ethnic minorities - from the Indian sub-continent, and from Afro-Caribbean background. The culture of these people has a big influence on the UK character - but we have always been influenced by large immigrant populations. Half my own ancestors come from Ireland, and in the 19th Century with their RC religion they were as foreign as the Muslims are today.

 

[Asa]

USA stereotype is the most obnoxious extroverted sensor, ever.

 

[philostam]

This is very hard to do because there isn't a single English spirit, and maybe never has been. Maybe the closest we got to it was as the 'Dowry of Mary' in pre-Reformation times, but that has long gone and is overpainted with very many other layers since then. I think we have been totally ambiguous since the 16th Century. We're a mongrel country culturally these days, but I think this was true even in the days of the British Empire. The English working class have always been totally different from the upper classes in terms of type ever since the 18th Century at least - working class P, upper class J, but all the dominant folks very S in outlook apart from the visionary opinion leaders in every class who were N. It might seem that things are different these days because we have so many people here from ethnic minorities - from the Indian sub-continent, and from Afro-Caribbean background. The culture of these people has a big influence on the UK character - but we have always been influenced by large immigrant populations. Half my own ancestors come from Ireland, and in the 19th Century with their RC religion they were as foreign as the Muslims are today.

Very interesting, thanks for that summary.

I think this applies also to other countries and ethnic groups, although perhaps not to such extent as in Britain. The lines are getting blurier and blurier, and there is a lot of mixing of different ethnic groups going on. This is especially true for ex colonial powers, of course.

 

[Ren]

France: strikes me as Ne-Si axis. Democratic and interested in the 'common good'. People on average seem casual, artistic, agreeable, not so business oriented etc. @Ren?

Yeah, divided between Ne-Si and Se-Ni axis I would say. A "P" country for sure. Also a tendency toward rebellion etc.

Switzerland: Si.

I agree with that

Germany: like England, seems hard to pin. Quite well rounded.

I would say Si-Ne axis but not as strong as in Switzerland and China.

Merkel and the president of the European Commission are more likely both ISTJ.

USA: Too diverse, probably depends on individual states. I was never there.

Se-dom!

 

[Impact Character]

@Ginny (<3) and I talked about this a little bit some time ago and I think the consensus was something along Te(+Si) for Germany.

 

[Daustus]

@Ginny (<3) and I talked about this a little bit some time ago and I think the consensus was something along Te(+Si) for Germany.

That would make sense to me.

 

[Cornerstone]

Interesting. Jung did write about this but I've no idea what the essay is called. As I recall, he put England as a thinking type, Germany too. Ireland was a feeling type, I think. I can't remember any others but I think his way was to look at the most prominent myths of a country to determine what it generally aspired to. Of course, J and P and the Myers-Briggs business didn't come into the equation.

 

[Ginny]

@Ginny (<3) and I talked about this a little bit some time ago and I think the consensus was something along Te(+Si) for Germany.

Very much so. It's hell for the polar opposite types, like no matter how hard you try, you never feel connected to anyone.

 

[Vendrah]

The official MBTI did run on a lot of countries and I had compiled all their work:

More details here on this article:
https://www.infjs.com/articles/mbti-population-by-country.36/

There is also Big 5 statistics on this as well, so, according to statistics...

France: strikes me as Ne-Si axis. Democratic and interested in the 'common good'. People on average seem casual, artistic, agreeable, not so business oriented etc.

France is slightly more agreeable and slightly more Open on Big 5, however France got lots of sensors and a lot of what you say are actually things that SF people can bring in, like ISFPs, ESFPs and even ISFJs. France is a lot SF.

Spain: Similar to France, but hard to say. Quite extroverted. Probably Ne-Si axis.

Switzerland: Si.

Spain is more extroverted than the world, on Big 5 measures and on MBTI. But it seems different than France, more Thinkers, less Agreeableness than France.
I don't think Switzerland is full of Si-doms, although there is no data.

England: No idea, but I am leaning more towards Ne-Si axis. English people strike me as quite emotional, proud and social. Seem to value humor ("banter") a lot. But there is a lot of variance here. It's both very business oriented, but also artistic (musical centre of the world).

Germany: like England, seems hard to pin. Quite well rounded.

USA: Too diverse, probably depends on individual states. I was never there.

China: definitely Si-Ne axis.

England (as UK): Still not full of NPs, it has more Openness to Experience, but has more introverts than world average.

Germany, USA: 'Well-rounded' I can't really tell or think so, but nevermind.

China: Not bad and partially on par, since they got lots of ISTJs but also ESTJs but not much ISFJs... But China does not have much Ne-doms, probably one of the least countries with Ne-doms, no wonder.

The Irish had a lot of Fi when I was a youngster - symbiotic with their religions.

I think @Ren said that Fi is still quite overwhelmingly apparent in Ireland.

Ireland is somewhat FPish, a lot IXFXish, so that is quite on par. Also has a very high number of XNFPs.

USA stereotype is the most obnoxious extroverted sensor, ever.

USA is ISTJ in average, there are a lot other countries that are more ES than US. Or countries with more ESTJs.

--

Japan

There was another thread which I had said nothing but Japan in some terms is terribly painted out there... I mean this:

This idea of a hard working Japan while others are all lazy... Like even inducing that Japanese are intelligent exactly because of that... These are all very deceiving.
Japan:
- Lowest number of Js and highest number of Ps on MBTI, across many countries as shown above.
- Lowest Conscientiousness on Big 5 among almost 30 countries.
- Japan does not work much, they work a little bit less year or month hours than OECD average.

This Japan J-Conscientiousness stereotypes is wrong in so many ways. By the personality statistics, perhaps the anime 'easy-going' vibe is actually more realistic than the one that is spread on western culture.

Also, Japan is curiously the most alike country on the whole community (no wonder lots of people like Anime or use related japanese Avatars, I do that sometimes):
- The only country with more Intuitives than Sensors. Also, the country with the most INFJs, only country where INFJs are not under-represented (INFJs are NOT a rare 'thing' in JP). Lots of INTPs, INFPs, ENFPs, INTJs and ENTPs, and Japan is the country with most INTPs, most INFPs, most INTJs, most INFJs, very INish.
- Overall MBTI community does not have much Emotional Stability, Japan got one of the lowest Emotional Stability.
- Overall MBTI community is quite high on Openness to Experience, while Japan is the highest in terms of Openness to Experience.

 

[Asa]

Great post and fascinating stuff @Vendrah.
I think there is discrepancy between citizen averages and cultural ideals in some countries, and also between averages and stereotypes.
For example, introversion is not prized in the USA. We champion extroversion.

 

[Krypton]

It’s hard to simplify this from within a country both because you see the ramifications and because your impressions lack objectivity. There is a lot of xSxP in England, and a lot of INxx. The balance is rather different in the Celtic nations within the UK and they have more IxFx than the English. There’s nothing definite though because many folks, like myself, are rooted in both Celtic and Anglo-Saxon ancestry.

The Irish had a lot of Fi when I was a youngster - symbiotic with their religions. Not sure if this is still the case after 1.5 generations of emancipation from the priests and ministers.

Maybe we could divide it into rural, urban, and suburban? Each of those has different archetypes for me, at least for America.

For America, it might be:
Urban: ENFP (Strong focus on social problems and how things could be better, and a fair amount of weird personal decisions)
Rural: ISTJ (Strong focus on keeping things how they've always been, not really concerned with how they look in the broader eyes of the world)
Suburban: ESFJ (Strong focus on propriety, not doing anything offensive or too "out there", in the younger generations some "with it"-ness about societal things but it's largely social)

Could see ESFP on Urban and ISTP on Rural.

 

[Asa]

Maybe we could divide it into rural, urban, and suburban? Each of those has different archetypes for me, at least for America.

For America, it might be:
Urban: ENFP (Strong focus on social problems and how things could be better, and a fair amount of weird personal decisions)
Rural: ISTJ (Strong focus on keeping things how they've always been, not really concerned with how they look in the broader eyes of the world)
Suburban: ESFJ (Strong focus on propriety, not doing anything offensive or too "out there", in the younger generations some "with it"-ness about societal things but it's largely social)

Could see ESFP on Urban and ISTP on Rural.

Your depiction of Americans caused me to ruminate on American ideals and I landed on:

Ideal worker (rural, farmer, factory worker): Introverted, keep their heads down, don't cause waves, focused on good work.
Ideal woman (suburbs): focused on social norms and friendly bonds, propriety, don't cause waves.
Ideal "star" (urban, boss, CEO, billionaire, entertainer, athlete): Extroverted, perhaps a bit quirky (allowed if you are rich), championed by the public.

 

[Vendrah]

Great post and fascinating stuff @Vendrah.
I think there is discrepancy between citizen averages and cultural ideals in some countries, and also between averages and stereotypes.
For example, introversion is not prized in the USA. We champion extroversion.

What is prized and what is common are entire different things.
ENTJ is the rarest type on US, yet it is the most paid one, and I think it is a lot valued in western culture.
Also, there is one thing that is likely a strong factor in Japan, it is the older generations. Type distribution today and 50-100 years ago might be quite different. I am on the club that believes people are getting very slowly more intuitive with time.

Maybe we could divide it into rural, urban, and suburban? Each of those has different archetypes for me, at least for America.

For America, it might be:
Urban: ENFP (Strong focus on social problems and how things could be better, and a fair amount of weird personal decisions)
Rural: ISTJ (Strong focus on keeping things how they've always been, not really concerned with how they look in the broader eyes of the world)
Suburban: ESFJ (Strong focus on propriety, not doing anything offensive or too "out there", in the younger generations some "with it"-ness about societal things but it's largely social)

Could see ESFP on Urban and ISTP on Rural.

Your depiction of Americans caused me to ruminate on American ideals and I landed on:

Ideal worker (rural, farmer, factory worker): Introverted, keep their heads down, don't cause waves, focused on good work.
Ideal woman (suburbs): focused on social norms and friendly bonds, propriety, don't cause waves.
Ideal "star" (urban, boss, CEO, billionaire, entertainer, athlete): Extroverted, perhaps a bit quirky (allowed if you are rich), championed by the public.

There is one study that I had read months ago that talked about some stuff about Big 5 and regions, how there were changes of personality. I could not find it again easily, so I cant quote it.
I do remember that people on the coast of US have more ENTP tendencies (something like more Openness to Experience, more Extraversion, less Agreeableness) while the center of US have more ISFJ tendencies (something like less Openness, less Extraversion, more Agreeableness).
The coast profile is more the 'ideal star', while the ideal worker might fit ISXJ and the ideal woman as ESFJ, on american ideals of course.

 

[Asa]

What is prized and what is common are entire different things.

Yes. This is the stereotypes thread. Again, good post, too. It's really interesting.