What's Fair and Unfair?

[Matty]

Reading a thread which described someone's resentment towards successful or lucky people, the sentiments of "fair" and "unfair" were raised a few times.

Elsewhere I often encounter people expressing the sentiment, "that's not fair", when someone is attractive, well endowed, wealthy, successful, etc.

I think my brain is wired to assess potential and paths to achieving it, and not so much to assessing present outcomes, so I seldom register the notions of fair and unfair. The closest I come is in terms of whether contracts (even implicit ones) have been fulfilled.

Anyhow, I could do some reading and thinking about it on my own, but I enjoy the insights of dominant intuitives. Please share some insights with this clueless INTJ, and jot down some thoughts about what fair and unfair mean to you.

 

[Elder]

Hmmm...interesting.

I think for me when I talk about fair/unfair, it is when dignity of people is being being assessed or engaged with unequally or in ways I cannot understand or predict.

I will validate people's feelings of unfairness, and my own, and at times fight to bring things toward a better balance as perceived by me.

However, I don't tend to find much value in arguments based on people's perception of unfairness because it often seems rooted in their cultural and personal value system rather than something that stands on its own objectively.

 

[aeon]

Fair and unfair are the subjective judgments of individuals who have bought into the just-world hypothesis, and believe something real exists behind the idea of, and use of, the word “deserve.”

Cheers,
Ian

 

[Matty]

Fair and unfair are the subjective judgments of individuals who have bought into the just-world hypothesis, and believe something real exists behind the idea of, and use of, the word “deserve.”

Cheers,
Ian

That's interesting, and seems related to some types of superstition.

When things are merely down to chance (in the macro scale), it's absurd to expect two dice to land the same number up, if thrown the same way. Nevertheless, some people will imagine they have a technique for throwing monopoly dice.

Similarly, when things are determined by individual preferences, such as the promotion of two completely equivalent workers, some people seem to superstitiously believe the decision should go with the worker who wants or needs the promotion more, rather than the actual causal factor, which is the employer's preference.

It seems to be an attribution of causality to things which cannot have a causal effect, and expecting outcomes to be determined by one's mind.

 

[aeon]

It seems to be an attribution of causality to things which cannot have a causal effect, and expecting outcomes to be determined by one's mind.

Exactly. One can choose to accept the world as it is, or one can wilfully believe a falsehood, live in delusion, and use that falsehood as justification to render and project one’s judgment onto situations—and in turn, think people are more or less entitled to a given situational outcome.

Absolute rubbish. It’s one of the most widely-accepted and used forms of magical thinking, and it suggests a significant lack of psychological self-awareness.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[dZpADTLrPmX4c]

However, I don't tend to find much value in arguments based on people's perception of unfairness because it often seems rooted in their cultural and personal value system rather than something that stands on its own objectively.

I like how you worded this. It seems very level-headed.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

I see it as a lack of reasonable balance where that is ultimately detrimental be it to individuals or to society as an whole. The issue of wealth inequality after all as an example led to the French Revolution as millions were nearing starvation while the wealthy of elites of the society of the day much like today lived in complete excess for which there was very little to no upward social mobility thus no opportunity for in the lower classes to even earn their way. The same is getting to be true of the world today where instead of millions it is billions of people who either in their retirement years will be forced back into working despite being in their 70s or 80s while the younger generations will only see the quality of life decline while the elites get to have the entire world along with much of its resources at their disposal. Hell we got billionaires cosplaying as wernher von braun and DR Evil ffs so what next Caligula or Hitler? The next big dread to come is the AI controlled social credit system.

 

[kim theresa]

Reading a thread which described someone's resentment towards successful or lucky people, the sentiments of "fair" and "unfair" were raised a few times.

Elsewhere I often encounter people expressing the sentiment, "that's not fair", when someone is attractive, well endowed, wealthy, successful, etc.

I think my brain is wired to assess potential and paths to achieving it, and not so much to assessing present outcomes, so I seldom register the notions of fair and unfair. The closest I come is in terms of whether contracts (even implicit ones) have been fulfilled.

Anyhow, I could do some reading and thinking about it on my own, but I enjoy the insights of dominant intuitives. Please share some insights with this clueless INTJ, and jot down some thoughts about what fair and unfair mean to you.

Everyone is blessed in their own way, it's unfortunate that some spend their life being jealous or resentful of others without realizing that the ones they feel is fortunate is also feeling the same about them, and the rule of thumb is that it is a good way to always treat others with a kind deed for one never know that what the person is going through or if it's their last day on this earth

 

[Wyote]

I think my brain is wired to assess potential and paths to achieving it, and not so much to assessing present outcomes, so I seldom register the notions of fair and unfair.

Opportunity mindset / Curiosity mindset, holding both in your mind when possible will carry a person healthily away from most mind traps

 

[Asa]

Life, as a whole, is unfair. Expecting it to be is the only way forward. That doesn't mean I don't get angry or sad about how unfair life is sometimes.

I don't get wrapped up in how "unfair" it is for one person to be successful, pretty, wealthy, etc, and another to struggle because that is the nature of existence on this planet for all things. One tree has more sunlight. One deer can run faster and escapes the coyotes

I use unfair/fair when discussing human choices. It is unfair to blame an innocent person. It is unfair to divide the task unevenly. It is unfair to reward one person more than another when they gave equal time and effort and the outcome was the same for both.

 

[mintoots]

I honestly believe that in one way or another, each of us as individuals give what we can take and take what we can give. I think that with the interests (as in banking) gained or lost with time, the fate of our ancestors and descendants combined would amount to karmic fairness. This is also probably because I think the social spectrum is a mundane product of imagination, i.e. neurotic propensity for order rather than a truly meaningful nor appropriate method of human valuation.