For myself I got very sick and felt in despair. Like becoming lost. But then I found my way again and the suicidal thoughts lifted. It did take some months.
Brain chemistry is another thing.
Brain chemistry is another thing.
What are the many causes of suicidal thoughts?
- Thread starter just me
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Hello JustMe, I have experienced sleep deprivation like you describe and can attest that it will very seriously mess with your mind and body. But when you do finally get sleep -- really good sleep -- I swear, it can feel like a miracle cure sometimes. Refreshing, like a cool spring in a desert. You will feel like a completely different person. Is there anything at all you can try to help yourself sleep better? I have had some success with guided meditation CDs, and of course, getting some exercise during the day -- it sounds overly simplistic but it truly can help tremendously; at least, it has helped me in the past.
The link between sleep and depression is interesting to me, it seems like a chicken and egg type of thing sometimes, wondering which came first.
That other stuff you mentioned, like murder-suicides, etc., is a whole different ballgame and one I think has more to do with rage and more severe illness than what I'm referring to above. :/
Probably a bit of both most of the time...or at least the feeling of one not being taken seriously otherwise....maybe mixed in with feelings of painting one’s self into a corner.
I’m sorry to hear about your difficult time with the sleep and the meds....I DO know about the not sleeping....it’s so incredibly awful! Next time, if you consider trying again...see if the doctor can give you Seroquel, it’s an SSRI, it will definitely allow you to sleep. When I was in the acute phase of stopping my pain meds. the gabapentin actually was the drug that allowed me to finally sleep and calmed the anxiety somewhat, but I think I remembered you saying that you were already taking that? So it may not give you as dramatic of an effect. Another option is to find a doctor who prescribes Suboxone...it’s an agonist/antagonist drug that works incredibly well...I took it for a while as it actually really helped my back pain, but then my insurance decided that it didn’t want to pay for it anymore....assholes.
Let me know if I can help at all with any other suggestions....I just stopped all my high doses of pain meds back in April so I have a few more ideas if you want to hear.
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If I have to boil it down to one cause, I would say it's hopelessness. However way someone arrives at that point, whether its an imbalance of brain chemistry for x, y, or z reasons or maladaptive patterns of thinking, I would say that believing that there's nothing to look forward to but continued misery would definitely have someone contemplating suicide.
This is why it's so important that people in that state of mind get support from their family and friends to challenge that perspective and introduce other patterns of thought and/or the medical treatment they need. Unfortunately, most people who have suicidal thoughts end up retreating into themselves and don't reach out. Or they're not honest with what is going on with them because of shame or, again, hopelessness (they don't feel anyone can help them anyway, so why worry anyone and have them waste their efforts).
Whether or not its a cry for help or a cry from the helpless, I would say it's both. When you're hanging onto a very thin strand of hope, it's still hope nonetheless, and you do want someone or something to intervene to tell you that there's a lot more that you're not seeing. At that point, you need to be showed the way, because you're not going to find it alone--if you could, you wouldn't be in this state in the first place.
This is why it's so important that people in that state of mind get support from their family and friends to challenge that perspective and introduce other patterns of thought and/or the medical treatment they need. Unfortunately, most people who have suicidal thoughts end up retreating into themselves and don't reach out. Or they're not honest with what is going on with them because of shame or, again, hopelessness (they don't feel anyone can help them anyway, so why worry anyone and have them waste their efforts).
Whether or not its a cry for help or a cry from the helpless, I would say it's both. When you're hanging onto a very thin strand of hope, it's still hope nonetheless, and you do want someone or something to intervene to tell you that there's a lot more that you're not seeing. At that point, you need to be showed the way, because you're not going to find it alone--if you could, you wouldn't be in this state in the first place.
I had suicidal thoughts in high school after years of bullying and loneliness. Lose of self-worth as human being. Why am I here? Only to suffer etc.? Blah blah more negative thoughts... It was really hard to break that bad cycle of toxic thoughts. No sense of purpose, life feeling meaningless, hopeless and empty. Dark, deep gorge where I couldn't get out without others help (aka professional doctors, nurses, psychologists, supporting people and my family etc.).
Maybe I am kidding myself, but I think most people have suicidal ideation (different than actually being suicidal) at some point. For certain people, such as those who deal with chronic pain, extreme tragedy, social isolation/alienation, chronic poverty etc, the thoughts will likely be more frequent and more serious. As for myself, I've long used suicidal ideation as a pleasant reminder that there is always a way out if pain becomes unbearable or if injury or disease cause me to lose dignity and quality of life to an extent I cannot bear. It's a thought I use to negate "What if ___ awful thing happens?" Remembering there's an escape hatch is comforting, though I'm aware this sounds morbid. I've only ever considered it seriously during a brief episode of psychotic depression in my early 20s, but I was thankfully too disorganized and dysfunctional to make a sandwich, let alone find an effective means to end it all.
When you in that dark place it's as if you completely forget the light, that the two exist. You can't remember the other reality and all feels hopeless and lost. I don't know about dealing with physical pain, that I imagine adds another dimension to the whole thing. We're constantly shifting through the light and the dark, and a decision taken when the pendulum has swung, I imagine may be an outcome that was not truly intended. Or may not have been truly intended. Thus the wisdom of "sleeping on things". It's difficult when people find it hard to talk about their emotions or maybe don't feel they have someone to turn to. More statistically in the male population because of men, sadly being trained to not talk about their emotions and to be "tough." My understanding of the law of cause and effect, and the idea that the seeds of this life will carry on and create the circumstances of my next; have led me to believe.... I do not want to repeat any unresolved trauma or angst, so I'd better deal with it in this life, and not seek an escape. I recently listened to a podcast by a empath American psychiatrist Dr Judith Orloff. She said that people who commit suicide get left stuck in a painful realm, where the pain and angst they feel at the moment of their death...continues. Not a great answer then.
Suicidal thoughts are triggered by emotional pain, a feeling of helplessness, not belonging, financial stresses, physical pain, new diagnoses, grief - a multitude of causes.
I think another major cause to acting on the suicidal thoughts is shame. I have heard of several tragic events - one of which the man caught up with a few of his friends for a drink or two, did not show any signs of upset, even spoke about plans for the following day and week, including renovating his home. Only to go home and take his life a few hours later.
As we know when shame is triggered its that warm wash that comes over us and the tears and nausea and feelings of being alone, and unworthy of love and belonging. When in the throws of it, it is nearly impossible to get oneself out of the thought and feelings pattern. It also, in its worst incidences can lead to suicide.
Dr Brene Brown has done such great work in this area and she says when in the throws of a shame spiral to call that trusted friend (and I'm aware that many people do not have a friend like this) or to call Lifeline. Because shame cannot exist when met with empathy. This I can vouch for experientially. I'm not sure why it has such a powerful effect but it does. It puts one back into that realm of life is ok.
Writing on this Forum can have this effect as well. If the shame trigger is met with empathy. Empathy is about saying "I've experienced that feeling before. It sucks. If one has been in the actual situation similar to the one being shared - even better. But not necessary"
There's a stark difference between sympathy ("It sucks that YOU are going through this. [I'm glad I'm not you]")
and
Empathy ("I've felt that same hellish feeling before. It sucks. But you are worthy of love and belonging").
I'm thinking that this is the answer to reducing suicide rates - that I have been seeking.
I think another major cause to acting on the suicidal thoughts is shame. I have heard of several tragic events - one of which the man caught up with a few of his friends for a drink or two, did not show any signs of upset, even spoke about plans for the following day and week, including renovating his home. Only to go home and take his life a few hours later.
As we know when shame is triggered its that warm wash that comes over us and the tears and nausea and feelings of being alone, and unworthy of love and belonging. When in the throws of it, it is nearly impossible to get oneself out of the thought and feelings pattern. It also, in its worst incidences can lead to suicide.
Dr Brene Brown has done such great work in this area and she says when in the throws of a shame spiral to call that trusted friend (and I'm aware that many people do not have a friend like this) or to call Lifeline. Because shame cannot exist when met with empathy. This I can vouch for experientially. I'm not sure why it has such a powerful effect but it does. It puts one back into that realm of life is ok.
Writing on this Forum can have this effect as well. If the shame trigger is met with empathy. Empathy is about saying "I've experienced that feeling before. It sucks. If one has been in the actual situation similar to the one being shared - even better. But not necessary"
There's a stark difference between sympathy ("It sucks that YOU are going through this. [I'm glad I'm not you]")
and
Empathy ("I've felt that same hellish feeling before. It sucks. But you are worthy of love and belonging").
I'm thinking that this is the answer to reducing suicide rates - that I have been seeking.
None of the above is meant in any way to be judgemental. It's just the conclusion I've come to myself.
In my case, these thoughts have mostly come from taking on the pain/hopelessness of others and feeling helpless to do enough without sacrificing basically my whole personal life and goals. Taking on the pain of others can really push one over the edge.
Help for Empaths
Dr Judith Orloff, Psychiatrist and Empath
You tube and website www.drjudithorloff.com